Author Topic: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker  (Read 3607 times)

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Offline elfick

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Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« on: November 15, 2021, 07:41 PM »
I'm starting to plan out some long overdue tall cabinets for my garage shop and I've been debating slab/flat vs. shaker for the full overlay doors. What do you guys think? What did you use for your shop? Share pics if possible.
Thanks!
-Lee

Offline VirTERM

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2021, 08:00 PM »
I'm starting to plan out some long overdue tall cabinets for my garage shop and I've been debating slab/flat vs. shaker for the full overlay doors. What do you guys think? What did you use for your shop? Share pics if possible.
Thanks!
-Lee
Shaker style

Offline tsmi243

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2021, 08:16 PM »
If you think you might want to put shaker doors inside the house one day, now's your chance to practice.

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2021, 08:17 PM »
Shaker for appearance, flat / slab for no dust accumulation.  That is if you have any dust in your shop  [big grin]

Peter

Offline afish

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2021, 09:10 PM »
I prefer the modern flat slab look, plus they have the added benefit of being easy to clean. win, win.

Offline Mortiser

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2021, 09:14 PM »
And I prefer a slab door on shop cabinets in case you may ever want to mount tool holders on the insides of the doors... a place to hang measuring tools, chisels, files, etc.

Offline elfick

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2021, 01:57 PM »
Shaker style
Those look great! Thanks for sharing!

Offline elfick

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2021, 02:01 PM »
Shaker for appearance, flat / slab for no dust accumulation.  That is if you have any dust in your shop  [big grin]

Peter
This was exactly was I was thinking. :D

Offline elfick

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2021, 02:03 PM »
For slab doors, is 1/2" or 3/4" stock more appropriate? Since this is going to be a tall cabinet I'm concerned about the weight if using 3/4" material.

Offline Packard

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2021, 03:26 PM »
I raised the same questions a while back.  I don't know if you can search for that thread.  The answer I got was that Blum hinges can handle the weight.  You probably need three or four hinges. 

My other question was "plywood or MDF".  I made one in MDF.  I used a 1/16" round-over bit to break the edges.  Faster and more uniform than hand sanding. 

I think white shaker cabinets are the most popular right now. It looks both contemporary and traditional. 

Slab doors are faster to make.  Easier to paint.  But be wary of high gloss finishes--they seem to be the most demanding to apply well. 

This from Real Simple magazine:  https://www.realsimple.com/home-organizing/decorating/decorating-kitchen/kitchen-cabinet-styles


Shaker Style Cabinets

With clean, classic lines, Shaker is the most popular cabinet door style because it can work beautifully whether your aesthetic is modern, transitional, or traditional.


Slab Cabinet Doors

Think of a kitchen with a sleek, modern aesthetic and chances are you picture slab cabinet doors. Also known as flat panel cabinets, this style consists of a single, smooth piece of wood, plywood, or MDF. Flat panels are available in a variety of finishes and veneers from glossy white, gray, or colored lacquer to natural wood tones. The unadorned cabinet front makes a clean backdrop for statement hardware or looks sophisticated with no visible hardware.

Addendum:  I found the old thread on this subject.  But when I put the link down it does not work.

Search:  slab doors, author Packard.  The search engine is in the black bar above the threads.

« Last Edit: November 16, 2021, 03:29 PM by Packard »

Offline squall_line

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2021, 04:06 PM »
Addendum:  I found the old thread on this subject.  But when I put the link down it does not work.

Search:  slab doors, author Packard.  The search engine is in the black bar above the threads.

@Packard , this one?
https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/building-materials/refacing-kitchen-cabinets/

Offline Packard

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2021, 04:15 PM »
Yes, that's it.  I found it, but I could not figure out how to link it.  Thanks for doing that.

Offline afish

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #12 on: November 16, 2021, 05:15 PM »
3/4" ultra light MDF for the doors.  Its light, stays flat no twisting or warping.  Which is a big deal when you have a bunch of doors with only a few mm of revel between them.  If they start twisting or warping its going to stick out like a sore thumb. Blum has published guide on # of hinges for door size.  Its not only the height that matters its the width too.   

And, yes. High gloss finish is going to be much harder. Not only to apply but to maintain.  It shows everything fingerprints smudges, dirt, etc.  For a shop or garage I would never do it unless its some fancy high end garage/show room with several million dollars worth of cars parked in it.  For shop cabinets I would probably just go with laminate.  Easy to wipe clean and wears well.

 
« Last Edit: November 16, 2021, 05:55 PM by afish »

Offline Crazyraceguy

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #13 on: November 16, 2021, 08:08 PM »
The term "shaker" generically applied to what is just a normal Frame and Panel design. They are not really the same thing. Frame and Panel doors, as far as modern use, are made with thin (approx 1/4" or 6mm) sheet goods. Most are MDF or Ply, depending upon final finish.
True "Shaker" door were of course solid wood and actually a raised panel design. The panel was reversed to appear flat on the outside, which was the preferred "plain" look. The raised part of the panel was turned to the inside, sticking into the space some. Often the panels were the same thickness as the doors, so they would stick in by the same amount as the in-set of the front. All of the ones I have ever seen have had a much steeper angle, because it was not intended to be decorative. It was just there to thin the panel on the edges to fit in the groove.
In reality this was a technique to keep doors flat, similar to bread-board ends on table tops. The frame would stay straight and on-size, while the floating panel could move without in being noticeable.
The exterior "look" is the same, but thin panels are not Shaker.

All that said, slab doors are easier to keep clean in a shop. Dust doesn't catch on the ledge, which I also why I generally edgeband and finish plywood doors in a shop space too.
But, as mentioned above, I gives you an opportunity to get some practice or even just show-off a bit. Why not have a nice space? Just because it's a "shop", doesn't have to mean bare-bones.

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Offline Packard

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2021, 08:37 AM »
This image is from a Shaker museum.  Note the exposed hardware, inset doors and face-nailed wood flooring.  The counter top looks to be 1" or less thick.   



And this is another shot from the Shaker Museum.  This time from the kitchen.



Wood knobs in both images.  Flat panel doors.  Really wide rails and stiles in the bottom photo.  No toe kick in either.  I can't imagine any modern homeowner would want to cook in this kitchen.  It looks like part of the flooring in the bottom photo was replaced with plywood--so that does not look original to me.  But I might be wrong.

Offline afish

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #15 on: November 17, 2021, 08:52 AM »
Man, yall take your shaker door history pretty serious...  It might be perspective but that last photo looks like a kid sized kitchen.

Offline Gerald_D

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2021, 09:20 AM »
I made frame and panel doors for my shop and used white pegboard for the panel.  I was thinking I could hang tools on the outside of the doors for easy access.  I tried that for a while but found it didn’t work well for me.  If I had to do it over, would just stick with standard panel- I spend a lot of time in the shop and like it to look somewhat nice.

Regards,
Gerald
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I have Festools- Big and Small and a few other tools

Offline Bob D.

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2021, 09:48 AM »
Man, yall take your shaker door history pretty serious...  It might be perspective but that last photo looks like a kid sized kitchen.

You could be right. Looking at the width of the door I guesstimate that is at least a 2-6 door or 30 inches so the height of the kitchen sink can't be more than 30", maybe less.

Or extend the line of the front edge of the sink toward the doorway and you'll see it lands very low on the jamb. Far below the height of a normal doorknob which would be about 34 inches.
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Offline Packard

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2021, 10:24 AM »
I routinely make shaker-style doors using 1/2" thick plywood for the center panel.  I use my dado head to thin out the perimeter (on the inside) to fit the groove in the rails and stiles. 

It makes the doors seem more solid to me and it allows me to screw brackets to the inside of the doors.  It also makes drawer fronts more substantial and allows me to screw into the center panel if required.

It also means I never have to use "space balls" to keep the center panel from rattling. I adjust the thickness of the perimeter for an interference fit.  It is a fairly quick operation.  Most of the work is just switching from the rip or crosscut blade to the dado head.  A router would work just as well.  And I might be going that route on my next doors.

Note:  I pulled the images from my earlier post from a Shaker Museum site.  I would assume it is for a full-sized kitchen.  It did not say anything about it being a kids' toy kitchen.  The sink height does seem a bit low.

Offline Bob D.

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2021, 12:17 PM »
A good design. Shaker in the front and slab/flat panel on the rear. Best of two worlds. :-)
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Offline Packard

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2021, 12:54 PM »
Man, yall take your shaker door history pretty serious...  It might be perspective but that last photo looks like a kid sized kitchen.

You could be right. Looking at the width of the door I guesstimate that is at least a 2-6 door or 30 inches so the height of the kitchen sink can't be more than 30", maybe less.

Or extend the line of the front edge of the sink toward the doorway and you'll see it lands very low on the jamb. Far below the height of a normal doorknob which would be about 34 inches.

The ultra-wide rails and stiles can also skew the perspective.  It does look a little low, but not massively low.  And perhaps people were shorter back when that kitchen was built.

Offline Crazyraceguy

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Re: Full overlay shop cabinet doors - slab/flat or shaker
« Reply #21 on: November 17, 2021, 06:45 PM »
You also have to remember that these things were hand made, probably by the family in some form, and would have been done "to order". This is long before the "standards" that we expect today, so I suppose the height could vary a bit.
Hardware is a completely different thing. I have always disliked the "American" style exposed hinge look. For so many years the 3/8" lipped overlay with those ugly knuckles hanging out were the standard, but they have no adjustment or spring tension to pull them closed. They are free-swinging, requiring some type of latch, just to stay closed.
The concealed "Euro" hinges are much better, IMHO, in every way.
They are far too complex for that time, when things were simple, but I bet they would have loved to look.
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