Author Topic: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d  (Read 4361 times)

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Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« on: August 26, 2021, 08:49 AM »
So I am watching this video and it sinks in there truly is no 3d type of carving to be done with SO. You can set z to a depth and cut a layer then another etc like in this video but no z-axis changes during cut for even shallow rudimentary 3d relief carving. Am I understanding this correctly?
https://youtu.be/fUWhXYCJq2g
I have been unable to get a link to a youtube to work but this at least shows the proper link so just copy and paste if you so desire.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2021, 08:55 AM by Bertotti »
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

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Offline squall_line

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2021, 09:14 AM »
Correct, the Shaper Origin currently only cuts "live" in the X/Y plane.  Adjustments in the Z axis are between runs.

I don't have one myself, but I researched it a little while back because I was curious about relief shaping.

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2021, 09:47 AM »
Yes, as I learn more about it it would be a perfect tool for me if it did even a limited .75-1' z-axis live. I am now back to wondering if a cnc might be a better solution for me but the cost is upped a bit to go that route because of the size and scale I want to work in. Large table tops and or small decorative structural beams. The Yeti cnc someone posted or one of the home builds I can lengthen is looking like a more suitable solution at this point but the cost is probably double what I would need for a SO and related accesories.
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline WastedP

  • Posts: 390
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2021, 09:47 AM »
Also note that the z-axis depth can't be programmed into a design.  If you have a hinge or something with multiple holes or mortises at different depths, you need to keep them sorted out when you're cutting.  If I am designing something in Inkscape, I add notes to the design to call out the depth so I remember it when I'm at the tool.  If I have a jig for a design, I'll write the depths on the jig. For things that are designed on-tool, I find myself writing depth dimensions on scraps.  Making z programmable is my #1 feature request for future software updates.  It would be great if it could adjust it on the fly, for relief carving, but I would settle for just being able to tie a z dimension to a path.

Here's a video of on-tool design, if you skip in a few minutes, it shows how I have to keep track of what z is what.  The recent Inverness update to the SO makes the grid and anchoring parts a little easier.


Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2021, 01:11 PM »
Wow, nice vid, sure seems like more work than it needs to be though. I wonder if Shaper plans on adding more z functionality as they move forward. Sadly I only buy on current functionality not hopeful or even promised upgrades. I have been bitten by that in the past so if it can't do what I want now I generally will wait until it can or move on. I still want one just really needed a bit more z functionality. Thanks for the vid!
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Online Cheese

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2021, 02:27 PM »
Really nice job on the video...[not worthy]...this one is actually very enjoyable to watch and to learn from.

Offline WastedP

  • Posts: 390
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #6 on: August 27, 2021, 12:17 AM »
Hey, thanks for the kind words.

Shaper has never promised any kind of z control other than what you can get to from the touchscreen.  I think they've gone as far as saying that they will NOT be supporting any kind of 3d carving, since the machine generates it's own toolpaths on the fly, and that would just be too much computing demand for... a router.  A simple pre-programmable z would save some headaches caused by human error, though.  There's a big difference between 0.1 inch and 0.01 inch of depth if you're engraving.  I tested this, and it's true.  Even still, I'd buy the SO again because it's the most portable option, and I can work on inlays smaller than a dime and cut a single sixteen-foot 1x12 into a set of arched door rails with a single radius.  If I was just sticking to small stuff, I sure like the specs (and looks) of the Hammer HNC machine, albeit at twice the price of the SO with Workstation.

Offline Bob D.

  • Posts: 2336
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #7 on: August 27, 2021, 06:37 AM »
"I have been unable to get a link to a youtube to work "

For me if I try to use the link provided by YT when you use their Share button it does not work. But if you go up to the address bar in your browser and copy that link and paste it into your post here it does work, at least for me.

As an example these two links are to the same video on YouTube.

This first one is using the Share button on YT. Most likely just a blank space below




and the second link taken from the address bar

broken link text [ ht tp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dC13inQC9A ]




Here is the first link again but broken so the forum software will display the text.

ht tps://youtu.be/7dC13inQC9A
« Last Edit: August 27, 2021, 07:27 AM by Bob D. »
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It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2021, 07:18 AM »
I'll give that a shot next time! Thanks for the tip and the one you posted was pretty cool to watch as well.
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #9 on: August 27, 2021, 07:24 AM »
Hey, thanks for the kind words.

Shaper has never promised any kind of z control other than what you can get to from the touchscreen.  I think they've gone as far as saying that they will NOT be supporting any kind of 3d carving, since the machine generates it's own toolpaths on the fly, and that would just be too much computing demand for... a router.  A simple pre-programmable z would save some headaches caused by human error, though.  There's a big difference between 0.1 inch and 0.01 inch of depth if you're engraving.  I tested this, and it's true.  Even still, I'd buy the SO again because it's the most portable option, and I can work on inlays smaller than a dime and cut a single sixteen-foot 1x12 into a set of arched door rails with a single radius.  If I was just sticking to small stuff, I sure like the specs (and looks) of the Hammer HNC machine, albeit at twice the price of the SO with Workstation.

There are a few cool cnc machines, maybe more than a few, but I have often wondered how much trouble it would be to take the standard fourth rotary axis and convert it to a drive for a belt on the table to work longer pieces through, pieces longer than the table would normally allow with its limited lengths. The length is why the Yeti is interesting to me. And really what was drawing me to the SO! I may still go for an SO we will see.
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline tallgrass

  • Posts: 990
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #10 on: August 27, 2021, 04:05 PM »
There are solutions for dealing with long material in short beds cnc routers. Shopbot has a solution for just this issue.

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #11 on: August 28, 2021, 08:36 AM »
I was doing more googling and saw some workarounds, index points, etc. I think however the So will come home first. After I get used to it I might step up to a CNC. At this point, there are plenty of uses I can put an SO to work on the larger beams, and such, are ideas for personal projects at this time so no rush and maybe no long-term need.

I have Affinity now through the mac app store and am working on text and manipulations of them. Next, some simple inlay designs then how to export. I did order the Affinity Workbook. Anything else I should work on with Affinity to get going? I doubt I will see the Shaper until next year, apparently, my wife needs to have a wrist scoped from a fall on the ice this winter, so I'll need short-term cash to pay for that! But, that doesn't mean I can't get up to speed with this software first, right! That will just make my first days with Shaper go quicker! I could even do a few easy exports and run to my equipment store. They would gladly try one out to see how it works. They almost always have three SO and three or four workstations on hand at any given time. Several of those guys want one as well especially after using their demo unit!

Thanks for all the replies and advice everyone it is greatly appreciated and if you have any thoughts on what to do with Affinity besides what I mentioned here let me know! I am not beyond listening to others with more know-how than I have. I might be an older go but I can still learn new tricks!
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline HowardH

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2021, 09:05 AM »
Something else to know is you are only supposed to safely plunge the depth of the diameter of the bit. For example, if you are cutting curves with tight corners, you might use a .125 bit meaning the depth of cut would be the same or risk snapping the bit.  It forces you to make 3-4 passes, sometimes more, if you are required to cut all the way through a workpiece that could be .5” thick or more. That’s the kind of thing that you have to have patience. 
Howard H
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Offline WastedP

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #13 on: August 28, 2021, 12:26 PM »
When I can get away with it, I will just use one pass, then cut the remainder off with a miter saw, table saw, or jigsaw, then flush trim with a larger router.  Totally depends on the situation, though.

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #14 on: August 28, 2021, 01:00 PM »
I did not know that but I will keep it in mind. Does that hold true with straight bits as well? So an 1/8" straight bit you cut to 1/8 or 1/4 cut to 1/4? no more?


It seems to me that this tool and any software you are using becomes more and more useable with many more options on how to use it the better you learn it.
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline HowardH

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #15 on: August 28, 2021, 01:17 PM »
I did not know that but I will keep it in mind. Does that hold true with straight bits as well? So an 1/8" straight bit you cut to 1/8 or 1/4 cut to 1/4? no more?


It seems to me that this tool and any software you are using becomes more and more useable with many more options on how to use it the better you learn it.

That is what they recommend. I would imagine if you’re using a .25” bit, you can be a little bit more aggressive but definitely not with the smaller bits. Ask me how I know…
Howard H
The Dallas Texas Festool Fanatic!

Mark Twain:  "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a letter approving of it." "If you tell the truth you don't have to remember anything."

mft1080, P1cc, MFT/3, T15, TID-18, RO150FEQ, MT55cc, RTS400, CT22, CT36E, 800, 1080, 1400, 1900 rails, OF 2200, OF1400, CSX, C18, VacSys, Vecturo, Qwas dogs, Parf Dogs, Zobo's, Syslite Uni, CMS GE. Mafell DDF40, Sawstop contractor, PM 1500, Shaper Origin. Felder AF-14

Offline Crazyraceguy

  • Posts: 709
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #16 on: August 28, 2021, 05:45 PM »
That is not entirely true, because the "Helix" that it can do while cutting small holes (that are bigger than the cutter) is a Z-axis move while moving X and Y at the same time. So, the machine is capable, it just needs to be enabled in a firmware update? I would guess that they are either working that out or holding it back for some kind of future model?
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Offline HowardH

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #17 on: August 28, 2021, 05:58 PM »
I’m talking about moving laterally.  Helix is for cutting holes. It’s the only time it used a Z function.
Howard H
The Dallas Texas Festool Fanatic!

Mark Twain:  "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a letter approving of it." "If you tell the truth you don't have to remember anything."

mft1080, P1cc, MFT/3, T15, TID-18, RO150FEQ, MT55cc, RTS400, CT22, CT36E, 800, 1080, 1400, 1900 rails, OF 2200, OF1400, CSX, C18, VacSys, Vecturo, Qwas dogs, Parf Dogs, Zobo's, Syslite Uni, CMS GE. Mafell DDF40, Sawstop contractor, PM 1500, Shaper Origin. Felder AF-14

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #18 on: August 29, 2021, 07:56 PM »
When did Amazon start delivering packages, my workbook was delivered today. When did Sunday become a good delivery day?

As to the workbook I am into the first chapter and it looks to be quite useful. I'll learn a lot from it. It has other pro users with projects later in it and links to the resources to use to get through them the way the pro did. Very cool I htink.
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline squall_line

  • Posts: 824
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #19 on: August 29, 2021, 11:11 PM »
When did Amazon start delivering packages, my workbook was delivered today. When did Sunday become a good delivery day?

As to the workbook I am into the first chapter and it looks to be quite useful. I'll learn a lot from it. It has other pro users with projects later in it and links to the resources to use to get through them the way the pro did. Very cool I htink.

Amazon has had their own delivery fleet for quite a while.  Sunday deliveries started for all companies some time in the late 2010's; I think USPS went to 7-day work weeks around 2016 or 2017.  I don't remember when Thanksgiving was taken over by retailers to stay open, but it was around that same time.  Nobody in this country knows what a "day off" is any more, it seems...

Online Cheese

  • Posts: 8952
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #20 on: August 29, 2021, 11:35 PM »
Amazon Prime still has their delivery trucks out on Sundays...there were several circulating the neighborhood today.

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2021, 05:41 AM »
Hi Everyone

I have been reading this thread as contributions arrive as I am interested in having a test drive of the Shaper.

Right now (and without ever playing with a machine or even seeing someone using one close up) I believe that the 2D/3D aspect is not a huge factor for the sort of work that the tool has been designed for. The cutting of an even depth groove or rebate is easily achieved and separate jobs/toolpaths can be created if a change in depth is required.

The key advantage of the Shaper is that you take the tool to the job. Getting a door or a section of worktop into my CNC would be impossible but the Shaper can go into the kitchen where the worktop sits or the room where the door might be and do whatever is required. This is exactly the factor that convinced me to buy my Domino machines and sell my big morticing machine - you take the tool to the job rather than struggle to take the job to the tool.

My only concern, and this really is just me, is that I do almost all of my design work in Draftsight (similar to AutoCAD). For the majority of my CNC work I use Aspire from the start as it is very simple to use. I like the idea of creating the jobs in a drawing environment on a PC with a big screen. Perhaps this can be done with the Shaper.

Once I get my hands on a machine I will make a video which (I hope) will explain the detail of using the tool. What a pity the majority of woodworking shows have been cancelled this year.

Peter

Offline HowardH

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #22 on: August 30, 2021, 08:50 AM »
Looking forward to seeing your sure to be excellent review, Peter! 
Howard H
The Dallas Texas Festool Fanatic!

Mark Twain:  "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a letter approving of it." "If you tell the truth you don't have to remember anything."

mft1080, P1cc, MFT/3, T15, TID-18, RO150FEQ, MT55cc, RTS400, CT22, CT36E, 800, 1080, 1400, 1900 rails, OF 2200, OF1400, CSX, C18, VacSys, Vecturo, Qwas dogs, Parf Dogs, Zobo's, Syslite Uni, CMS GE. Mafell DDF40, Sawstop contractor, PM 1500, Shaper Origin. Felder AF-14

Offline squall_line

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #23 on: August 30, 2021, 09:56 AM »
My only concern, and this really is just me, is that I do almost all of my design work in Draftsight (similar to AutoCAD). For the majority of my CNC work I use Aspire from the start as it is very simple to use. I like the idea of creating the jobs in a drawing environment on a PC with a big screen. Perhaps this can be done with the Shaper.

I used Draftsight about 10 years ago to visualize layouts for a Class A CDL (semi truck / LGV / HGV) training program and it's driving and backing range.  It took me a bit to get used to, but once I did, it was a far sight better than anything else I could get my hands on for free.

I believe that Draftsight can export directly to SVG, which should then be able to be ingested by the Shaper Origin.  You may be closer to using it than you think! :)

Edit to add: I look forward to seeing a Peter Parfitt video on Shaper Origin! I expect quite a few "brilliant"s, although I imagine there might also be a few places where things are a bit dodgy.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2021, 10:06 AM by squall_line »

Offline WillAdams

  • Posts: 100
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #24 on: August 30, 2021, 10:12 AM »
One CAD application which has a direct facility for exporting the SVG is LibreCAD which has an option for exporting to MakerCAM SVG --- I use it often to fix problematic DXFs.

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #25 on: August 30, 2021, 03:57 PM »

I believe that Draftsight can export directly to SVG, which should then be able to be ingested by the Shaper Origin.  You may be closer to using it than you think! :)

Edit to add: I look forward to seeing a Peter Parfitt video on Shaper Origin! I expect quite a few "brilliant"s, although I imagine there might also be a few places where things are a bit dodgy.

Hi @squall_line

Yes, Draftsight can export to .svg but I have not tried it to see if it works with the Shaper. Draftsight is no longer free but I believe that it is so good that the £90 a year is worth every penny.

Fingers crossed that I can get hold of a Shaper before something else comes along to displace it.

Cheers.

Peter

Offline squall_line

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #26 on: September 01, 2021, 09:47 AM »
As I was thinking about this last night (no idea why it was in my head), my understanding of how the Shaper Origin works is that it can compensate for user error to hold a straight line by moving the head in the X and Y planes, relative to the tape on the surface.  I don't know what sort of feed rate this auto-correction is able to handle, but I would imagine that there are upper limits on that (the only lower limit would be your burn risk)

Compensating for X & Y error correction is a fairly easily-solvable problem (to wit, they've solved it), and solving for Z-height on-the-fly for relief cuts with a CNC is a solvable problem when you know the feed rate.  Trying to change the height on the fly without a consistent feed rate and compensate for user X/Y error at the same time?  Probably solvable, but maybe not currently within the margins that would be acceptable to most consumers.  I think it's a mechanical limitation more than a computational/processing limitation, personally (this is what my brain was thinking of last night, at least).

That said, since the depth can be programmed and controlled by zeroing out "in an emergency", maybe the reason they don't want to make it attach to a design is because the depth of cut also depends on how deep you start your bit in the collet?  The .1" / .01" example earlier is a pretty good example of this.

Offline HowardH

  • Posts: 1354
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #27 on: September 01, 2021, 10:23 AM »
Having had a SO for a year with quite a bit of trial and error behind me, I have a few observations. It's really good at compensating between the X and Y axis's but within limitations. This is a hand held machine and there is definitely a learning curve on how fast you move laterally and stay within the reticle to keep the machine from raising the bit if you wander outside of the circle. There a lot of factors involved, i.e. the depth of cut, the size of the bit, the material being cut, changes in density and grain direction. More importantly, there is the human factor which introduces all kinds of variables a flat bed machine wouldn't have to contend with. It would be, IMO, very difficult to program in a moving Z depth while using the machine. How far you put the bit into the collet isn't a factor because once a bit is inserted and tightened, there is a Z touch feature you must do in order for the machine to get the correct depth of cut. This machine wasn't designed for 3d work. However, if you cut a lot of hinge mortices, design templates, or work in large fields like hardwood floors, there is nothing else like it. I'm finding new uses for it all the time.       
Howard H
The Dallas Texas Festool Fanatic!

Mark Twain:  "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a letter approving of it." "If you tell the truth you don't have to remember anything."

mft1080, P1cc, MFT/3, T15, TID-18, RO150FEQ, MT55cc, RTS400, CT22, CT36E, 800, 1080, 1400, 1900 rails, OF 2200, OF1400, CSX, C18, VacSys, Vecturo, Qwas dogs, Parf Dogs, Zobo's, Syslite Uni, CMS GE. Mafell DDF40, Sawstop contractor, PM 1500, Shaper Origin. Felder AF-14

Offline Crazyraceguy

  • Posts: 709
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #28 on: September 01, 2021, 05:33 PM »
Having had a SO for a year with quite a bit of trial and error behind me, I have a few observations. It's really good at compensating between the X and Y axis's but within limitations. This is a hand held machine and there is definitely a learning curve on how fast you move laterally and stay within the reticle to keep the machine from raising the bit if you wander outside of the circle. There a lot of factors involved, i.e. the depth of cut, the size of the bit, the material being cut, changes in density and grain direction. More importantly, there is the human factor which introduces all kinds of variables a flat bed machine wouldn't have to contend with. It would be, IMO, very difficult to program in a moving Z depth while using the machine. How far you put the bit into the collet isn't a factor because once a bit is inserted and tightened, there is a Z touch feature you must do in order for the machine to get the correct depth of cut. This machine wasn't designed for 3d work. However, if you cut a lot of hinge mortices, design templates, or work in large fields like hardwood floors, there is nothing else like it. I'm finding new uses for it all the time.     
Yes, I imagine that trying to control that 3rd axis at the same time would get very complicated and somewhat outside the scope of the design.
As far as "new uses", I came up with one today. Turns out that the Origin is the world's more expensive holesaw...lol. I needed a fairly precise 4.5" hole in a piece of plywood. In times past, I would have pulled out a router with a trammel baseplate. That would definitely work, but it does require some kind of way to secure the center point when the cut completes to keep from cutting into the side. It also requires a hole for the center pin, although there are ways around that too. Shaper doesn't have any of those limitations, plus you can adjust the size of the hole after it is cut. A couple of strips of tape and you can put that hole anywhere.
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Offline rst

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #29 on: September 01, 2021, 07:47 PM »
I've used mine for just the opposite, acrylic rounds, beats a bandsaw and sander jig any day for perfect rounds...works for wood also.

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #30 on: September 03, 2021, 07:42 AM »
An application question. If you had something to route in the side of an existing cabinet hanging on a wall would that be possible? I have watched a bunch of vids but they are always on the workbench or capable of scanning the whole area including the corners. But hanging on a wall you may only be able to scan 2 or three corners. Would that be an issue?
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

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Offline HowardH

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #31 on: September 03, 2021, 10:21 AM »
I suppose it would be possible by placing tape on the vertical surface.  The machine doesn't know or care about it's orientation.  Sounds like you are referring to using grid lines. If that's the case, you only need one corner to establish the grid.  You can measure in from there to establish a starting point. Scanning the entire workpiece is great when you can do it as you will be able to visually place the file instead of using measurements.  However, it's a pretty heavy machine and I think it would be almost impossible to safely carry out such an operation. Not to mention being able to stay within the boundaries without fighting gravity.   
Howard H
The Dallas Texas Festool Fanatic!

Mark Twain:  "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a letter approving of it." "If you tell the truth you don't have to remember anything."

mft1080, P1cc, MFT/3, T15, TID-18, RO150FEQ, MT55cc, RTS400, CT22, CT36E, 800, 1080, 1400, 1900 rails, OF 2200, OF1400, CSX, C18, VacSys, Vecturo, Qwas dogs, Parf Dogs, Zobo's, Syslite Uni, CMS GE. Mafell DDF40, Sawstop contractor, PM 1500, Shaper Origin. Felder AF-14

Offline WastedP

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Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #32 on: September 03, 2021, 03:15 PM »
Not to mention that the SO's large baseplate would keep you several inches away from any walls.

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #33 on: September 18, 2021, 06:54 PM »
Well, I went in to buy one today and the guy asked me to come back Monday because they weren't sure how to bill it out under the current incentive. So I'll go back Monday. That was a bit disappointing but it will soon be mine. Thanks, everyone for helping me make this decision.
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #34 on: September 19, 2021, 09:56 AM »
I am curious if anyone uses a vacuum table to hold their pieces in place? I do not have one but wondered about it, rather than using tape all the time. Probably a seriously bad idea but I have never used a vacuum table so I have no idea.

Do you have a preferred double-sided tape? Thanks!
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 5297
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #35 on: September 19, 2021, 11:41 AM »
Vacuum will work as long as the workpiece is larger than the vacuum area and you won't be perforating the workpiece.

I prefer to capture the workpiece from the sides with blue tape, using double stick as a last resort.

If three sides are taped well (tape folded into the intersection of the work and support surface) so that the tape has to be sheared lengthwise to fail, it holds the workpiece very well laterally. It is possible to lift the workpiece taped this way but the router is usually holding it down.

I fold a tab on one end of the tape strip so it's easy to remove. Getting double stick tape separated from the liner and off the work is what makes me try to avoid using it.

The double stick tape the Shaper people use is Intertape 591.

Offline rmhinden

  • Posts: 483
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #36 on: September 19, 2021, 11:53 AM »
I use this Intertape 591 Premium Double Sided Golf Grip Tape from Amazon.  I think it's the same as what Shaper tools sells.

Offline cider

  • Posts: 55
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #37 on: September 19, 2021, 09:31 PM »
I've been using blue tape and superglue to hold things lately.  Works well enough for me.

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #38 on: September 20, 2021, 01:03 PM »
Thanks! I have had all weekend to go through the tutorials and help on the shaper website. I see they recommend that tape as well. Sadly I can't find it here. I'll have to order some online and hopefully figure out if one of the alternatives here is a suitable local replacement.
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline jarbroen

  • Posts: 392
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #39 on: September 24, 2021, 12:02 PM »
Infinity Tools also has a really good double sided tape.  Not sure if it's the same brand that Shaper Tools sells, but it's a Made in the USA tape.

I've used both the narrow and the wide tape from Infinity on numerous projects.  It has crazy holding power (if you remember to apply pressure to the workpiece) and it removes easily without residue left behind.

They also have a ton of good bits to look at for using with the Shaper Origin(or any other router you might have).  If you're ordering tape, might as well get some bits and make it over the free shipping threshold.

Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 256
Re: Shaper origin Z axis truly 2d
« Reply #40 on: September 24, 2021, 03:04 PM »
Thanks!
I want to populate SD with trees because I miss the forests of the river bottoms.