Author Topic: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)  (Read 1397 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 1840
SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« on: July 12, 2020, 05:13 PM »
Regular blade and dado stack, too:

https://youtu.be/SYLAi4jwXcs?t=247



Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Birdhunter

  • Posts: 3093
  • Woodworker, Sportsman, Retired
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2020, 05:40 PM »
Great video. I triggered my SawStop Industrial touching the blade with a tenoning jig. Big Bang. Scared me! There was a tiny scratch on the steel jig. Expensive lesson.
Birdhunter

Offline rmhinden

  • Posts: 334
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2020, 05:57 PM »
I agree.   The high speed videos he is doing are cool.

I also watched one he did about different kind of router bits (Compression VS Upcut VS Downcut VS Straight).   See:



Worth watching.

Bob




Offline RJNeal

  • Posts: 533
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2020, 06:53 PM »
Thanks Chuck.
I was earlier checking out Fleet Woods out on you tube today.
I’m not sure how to share you tube clips.
He made a track and car with hot dog and set it off into the blade.
Quite interesting.
Rj
Have you walked your saw today?

Offline MikeGE

  • Posts: 97
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2020, 08:08 PM »
I’m not sure how to share you tube clips.

Do not use the Share link on YouTube because it creates a short link to the video that this board can't use.  Instead, copy the full URL and paste it where you want the video to appear.



Offline MikeGE

  • Posts: 97
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2020, 08:12 PM »
Here's the video Bob tried to link:





Offline JimD

  • Posts: 455
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2020, 09:00 PM »
I think Jonathan K's demonstration is better than the typical slow movement into the blade.  I saw another very experienced woodworker admit on you tube to touching the blade when he failed to use a push stick and he got a predictably tiny cut.  But my experience was a kickback with a dado blade and I got a broken bone, six stitches, and half a finger nail torn off.  But I still have the finger. 

I do not believe SawStop's statement that their saws have not been involved in any serious injuries.  I think my injuries were serious and I've seen at least one other example.  Wood magazine repeated this statement in a recent review of these saws.  What I think is true is that the SawStop circuit will greatly reduce any injury.  The degree of injury depends on how fast your hand is moving towards the blade.  For a kickback where your hand is moving very quickly, you are still going to need stitches.  If you are moving at a normal wood feed rate, you should only need a bandaid.

I don't know how the bone in the last section of my finger was broken.  The cut was not terribly deep, I don't think the saw blade hit the bone.  But the brake, by design, is VERY violent.  It has to be to stop the blade quickly.  I was touching the blade when it went off so that may have played a role.  I also got metal fragments in my finger which were not all removed.  But none of these effects are nearly as significant as the fact that the finger is still full length.  The surgeon who treated me agreed with me that I would not have the entire finger if I had not used a SawStop.   

The truth is a little more complicated but I think it still sells the saw.  Stitches, some small disfigurement, and possibly permanent loss of feeling is a lot better than a shorter finger.

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 2148
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2020, 09:21 PM »
@JimD , sorry to hear about your accident.
Is SawStop aware of this? Not blaming them, after all SS saved your finger. But perhaps they would be interested in accident statistic to make improvements.
Since 1970 Volvo sends technicians to the scenes of traffic accident involving their cars in Sweden to learn and further improve safety.

Offline RJNeal

  • Posts: 533
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2020, 10:27 PM »
The Mike for the help. I’ll try to figure it out. I’m currently not seeing the indicated area. But on fleets woods channel its the sled dog video
Have you walked your saw today?

Offline rmhinden

  • Posts: 334
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2020, 11:08 PM »
Here's the video Bob tried to link:

@MikeGE

Thanks for posting the correct link.

Bob

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 4820
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2020, 09:44 AM »
“I don't know how the bone in the last section of my finger was broken.  The cut was not terribly deep, I don't think the saw blade hit the bone.”

Glad you escaped very serious injury.

Forty years ago I cut a small slot in the end of a finger on the table saw and even though the blade barely touched the bone the medical record listed the injury as a bone fracture.


Offline Alex

  • Posts: 6629
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2020, 09:57 AM »
I do not believe SawStop's statement that their saws have not been involved in any serious injuries.  I think my injuries were serious and I've seen at least one other example. 

I don't want to diminish your pain, but I don't call your incident serious at all. It really falls in the category of minor incidents.

 There are many people who lost fingers and entire hands by saws. That is serious. There is one well known documented incident which you can find on the internet where a guy's arm was dragged through the entire blade, cutting it open from the hand to the elbow and causing an arterial bleeding. With SawStop, these type of accidents are of the past.

But that doesn't mean it's 100% fail-safe.

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 1840
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2020, 10:31 AM »
"Can I get a serious injury using a SawStop saw?

In the vast majority of cases, coming in contact with the spinning blade will result in a minor cut. However, if your hand moves into the blade at very high speed, it is possible for you to receive a serious injury."

https://www.sawstop.ca/support/faqs/

The video I posted suggests that a cut of 1/8" or so deep could happen with a standard blade if the contact is made at high speed. Is that a serious injury? It really depends on what part of the hand (wrist?) is cut and the individual (underlying conditions?).
« Last Edit: July 13, 2020, 10:35 AM by ChuckM »

Offline JimD

  • Posts: 455
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2020, 07:28 PM »
SawStop is fully aware of my injury.  They gave me a new dado cartridge in return for filling out their information form.  I think it is good that they collect this data.  I haven't purchased another dado set yet but I appreciate the new cartridge in case I do get another blade set.

I guess it just matters what you consider a serious injury to be.  I think once you need multiple stitches it crosses over into a serious injury.  But SawStop and others are fully allowed to have other opinions.  I also agree completely that the minor lingering effects I have are just that, minor.  The finger works and is being used right now to type this.  Without the SawStop, I would be having a lot more difficulty.

Please do not take my comments to mean I do not like my PCS.  It is a good saw, even absent the protection circuit.  And the protection circuit works.  I just think the extent of injury to expect is not well communicated, the linked video should help. 

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 1111
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2020, 04:57 AM »
I just wish this technology could be incorporated into push pull saws, that would be the real deal for me. Also as I've said before, although safety is paramount, having one "safe" machine in your workshop is only helping with that particular tool. For example, you could have a situation where you're cutting on your SawStop, and suddenly the safety facility springs into action.
After getting over the shock of realizing that you just dodged a possible serious, or life changing injury. You drink a mug of tea, dust yourself off and proceed to the band saw, where a twist of fete causes an accident that loses a couple of fingers [scared]

So, when the time comes when all machinery has a quick action stop/safety built in action, which it no doubt will eventually, obviously buying all of your machines with these features makes good sense. At the moment, I can't help thinking the SawStop tech, as great as it is, is more a selling point than a leap in safety for machine users.

I would love to see this safety built into band saws, radial arm saws and planer thicknessers, even drill presses and sanders, pretty much all machinery.
I'm not being negative either, just realistic.

Another point, why keep wasting all these lovely hot dogs? They belong in a bun with fried onion, mustard and ketchup [drooling]
A pig's trotter is fine for testing  [tongue]  [wink]

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 1840
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2020, 10:59 AM »
Snip.
I would love to see this safety built into band saws, radial arm saws and planer thicknessers, even drill presses and sanders, pretty much all machinery.

Bandsaw:

And the equivalent of the hot dog test:
« Last Edit: July 14, 2020, 11:50 AM by ChuckM »

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 1111
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #16 on: July 14, 2020, 01:30 PM »
Wouldn’t mind some of that Chuck, band saws and radial arm saws are the machines that scare me a little, after witnessing a terrible accident.
I give these machines a bit more respect than others.

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 2148
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #17 on: July 14, 2020, 03:11 PM »
I just wish this technology could be incorporated into push pull saws, that would be the real deal for me.
Agreed. And it probably can at the expanse of added weight and cost. Linear guides would have to be much stronger and incorporate a brake of their own.

Online Cheese

  • Posts: 7511
Re: SawStop - Another User Test (Unlike the Usual Demos)
« Reply #18 on: July 14, 2020, 03:52 PM »
That router bit video is great, I was surprised by how much the ply moves when using a straight flute router bit.

Thanks 🙏 Bob & Mike 🙏