Author Topic: Oneida's new Supercell collector  (Read 6598 times)

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Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 977
Oneida's new Supercell collector
« on: June 20, 2019, 01:55 PM »
https://www.woodworkingnetwork.com/awfs/awfs-news/oneidas-new-supercell-dust-collector-delivers-8x-static-pressure

Looks like I might finally get a dust collector in my small shop. To be released next month.
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Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 1111
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2019, 04:10 PM »
That looks interesting.

Offline RKA

  • Posts: 1986
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2019, 04:13 PM »
That's interesting.  Can you post more info when it becomes available?  I'm curious about the CFM specs.  This seems like an updated version of their Dust Cobra which will work on a range of hand held tools and machines.
-Raj

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 2378
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2019, 04:23 PM »
Looks like modified Dust Cobra
https://www.oneida-air.com/industrial-dust-cobra-full-unit-hepa-2-stage-vacuum-17-gallon
245 CFM at 23" WC, Maximum Suction 70" WC
It's a shop vac on top of cyclone, no magic there. I'd be surprised if Supercell is any different.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2019, 04:57 PM by Svar »

Offline live4ever

  • Posts: 836
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2019, 05:18 PM »
Interesting.  If it’s also quieter than a traditional collector I’ll buy one immediately.
Current systainer to productivity ratio:  very high

Offline RaptorScrew

  • Posts: 1
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2019, 02:53 PM »
We'll see how this goes - Just delivered this week.  Will set up this weekend and go from there.

Offline JimD

  • Posts: 511
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2019, 02:25 PM »
Interesting but more specifications are needed.  Like how much current does it draw?  More static pressure equals less airflow.  That is why shop vacs don't flow what DCs are.  Oneida may have made a good tradeoff and produced something really interesting but, if so, where is the data?  I am skeptical.  My HF 2hp DC only gives me about 400 CFM at the table saw hooked with 5 inch metal pipe almost all the way.  That works but is not overly powerful.  I don't know how much lower would work but my 100 CFM shop vac did not.  If it is like the 245CFM dust cobra it would probably not work so great.  And I need more air at my CMS and planner, I think, they are not hooked up yet. 

I am skeptical that anything 120V with high static pressure capability flows enough for the larger tools.  The capability of just moving a hose around and hooking up any tool in the shop is interesting I am just not sure it has the CFM for bigger tools.  I suspect it is a super shop vac - like the dust cobra.  That is not terrible but if that's what it is, I think a DC and shop vac are still required to cover the range of shop tools I want to use. 

Offline RKA

  • Posts: 1986
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2019, 07:38 PM »
Jim, I am as skeptical as you.  It seems like this would work well for small shops, while minimally meeting the demands of a machine with a 4” port.

Their specs indicate 5hp, 17A, 230V, 415cfm @ 3” WC.  The link below has the specs under the specs tab.  In the pictures of the unit, cycle to the last picture and they provide a chart that will provide a better sense of the airflow as the size of the port on the tool changes. 

I think if I had portable machines with 2.5” ports and smaller, this would be the ticket with 350 cfm of airflow, but matching or slightly exceeding a vacuum or DE with 1.25” ports.  I agree with you, at 4” and larger ports it’s a tough sell, unless the smaller size of this all in one cyclone meets a requirement.

https://www.oneida-air.com/dust-collectors/new-systems/supercell/supercell-high-pressure-14-gal-hepa-cyclone-dust-collector
-Raj

Offline alainp

  • Posts: 1
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2020, 09:24 AM »
We'll see how this goes - Just delivered this week.  Will set up this weekend and go from there.

Any feedback you want to share? I am looking to improve dust collection in my shop and this looks too good to be true (except the price)

Offline egmiii

  • Posts: 209
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2020, 09:43 AM »
If price is an issue and you have the space, then you could build your own. Three shop vacs and three mini cyclones in parallel would give you equal or better performance. They just take up a lot more floor space. I did it for $750.

Offline Bob D.

  • Posts: 2008
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2020, 09:56 AM »
I can only imagine what three shop-vacs screaming in unison sounds like.  [eek]
-----
It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 5132
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2020, 10:00 AM »
Interesting.  If it’s also quieter than a traditional collector I’ll buy one immediately.

Remains to be seen, or heard. As implied above, the Supercell uses three 220v vac fan motors in one housing.

Offline egmiii

  • Posts: 209
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2020, 10:00 AM »
I can only imagine what three shop-vacs screaming in unison sounds like.  [eek]

It’s loud as heck. But I always wear 30db hearing protection while working, so it doesn’t really matter. Long term plan is to build a small closet.

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1750
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2020, 11:34 AM »
Quote
eight times the static pressure of traditional units

Static pressure is completely meaningless - unless you want to build a vacuum chamber.

The metric relevant for dust extraction is amount-of-air per timespan moved (cfm or m³/h, depending on your kind of units) at the pressures that exist at inlet and outlet of the (whatever kind of) 'pump' you employ.

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 2378
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2020, 12:01 PM »
Quote
eight times the static pressure of traditional units
Static pressure is completely meaningless - unless you want to build a vacuum chamber.
The metric relevant for dust extraction is amount-of-air per timespan moved (cfm or m³/h, depending on your kind of units) at the pressures that exist at inlet and outlet of the (whatever kind of) 'pump' you employ.
Static pressure is absolutely meaningful. Three basic parameters that describe your system are static pressure that pump can deliver, air flow rate, and friction losses in your duct network. All three are interrelated.
(Good analogy is electrical circuit. In this analogy static pressure is voltage. Is voltage a meaningless metric?).

In this particular Supercell unit high static pressure means you can connect it to a hand power tool with a long narrow hose and it will collect dust. Something you can't do with traditional high flow, low pressure stationary dust collector.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2020, 04:47 PM by Svar »

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 2544
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2020, 12:17 PM »
I can only imagine what three shop-vacs screaming in unison sounds like.  [eek]

Probably like working under a running airplane engine. [eek]

I built a box to house a shop vac and the result was pleasantly surprising: https://www.lumberjocks.com/projects/366049

In terms of dust filtration, I've built one with a furnace fan (used with three furnace filters, 1 in (nylon type, washable) 2 out), and again I can't be happier. The unit is mounted on castors so it is low on the floor and can be wheeled closer to the source of dust generation. I don't like the idea that the filtration system is mounted overhead and dust is sucked up.

In practical terms: I recently jointed lengths of boards on the sawstop (with the dust collection blade guard in place). Because they were edge cuts, lots of dust could still be seen on the table. After an hour of work with the furnace system running, there were no visible dust particles found on my glasses! My shop is about 200  - 220 sq ft.

I have another spare furnace fan from my neighbor but have yet to find time to build a second system. (I paid $60 Cdn for the first fan unit.)
« Last Edit: January 07, 2020, 01:01 PM by ChuckM »

Online John Huh

  • Posts: 31
    • Tidbits
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #16 on: March 21, 2021, 11:30 AM »
We'll see how this goes - Just delivered this week.  Will set up this weekend and go from there.

I’m also looking for a dust collector for a small shop in a garage. Space is extremely valuable. Thought of getting 2-3HP DC, but 48” width is just not bearable in a tight space.

This unit looks promising, but sure do not want an airplane taking off noise in the shop.

Wondering what your experience is like.

Offline Stan Tillinghast

  • Posts: 178
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2021, 12:35 AM »
Here’s a Fine Woodworking review from last year; may be behind pay wall.
Author says it works great and is quiet.

Fine Woodworking review of Oneida Supercell

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 2544
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #18 on: March 25, 2021, 10:46 AM »
To be honest, I haven't come across yet any reviews on new products in Fine Woodworking that are negative. $300 handsaw, nice; $350 fret saw, beautiful; $750 chisel set, great design. You get my point. I suspect all the new items are received free by the reviewers. Sometimes, it's hard to tell if it's infotainment or subtle ad in magazine reviews.

Chris Schwarz makes it a point that he pays for the items he reviews.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2021, 10:50 AM by ChuckM »

Offline Tom Gensmer

  • Posts: 748
  • Residential Remodeler in Minnesota
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #19 on: March 25, 2021, 11:10 AM »
I suspect the real appeal of the Supercell is for a small shop where the user doesn't want to have both a traditional dust collector (high volume, low static pressure) AND a "shop vac"/CT dust extractor (low volume, high pressure).

The Dust Cobra "sort of" bridged the gap with 200+ cfm and good static pressure, but it was really never up to the task for machines with 4" ports. The Supercell seems targeted at those machines with 4" ports (router tables, smaller jointers and planers, etc...), while still handling sanders, saws, and other machines that might use a 27mm hose.

Alas, my needs are at the opposite ends of the spectrum, as most of my machines have 5" ports and require 600-800cfm, or are better served with a CT-style machine. That being said, it's great to see Oneida continue to innovate, I hope some woodworkers out there find this to be a good fit for their shops.
CT-MIDI, C-18, RO-150, RO-90, OF-1010, OF-1400, MFK-700, MFK-700EQ/B, EHL-65, DTS-400, LS-130, MFT/3 (x4), MFT/Kapex (x3), KA 65 Conturo, endless Systainers

Offline Bugsysiegals

  • Posts: 815
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #20 on: March 25, 2021, 08:00 PM »
I've the Oneida V3000 with 7" adapter to 6" drain pipe to 4" blast gates.  Maybe I'm reading it wrong but it seems like about the same static pressure in this situation, maybe less, and far less CFM?  I'm not sure why anybody would want to run a 220V motor to collect dust from a tool than to just connect a Festool Vac?

https://www.oneida-air.com/dust-collectors/personal-shops/v-system/v-system-3000-hepa-cyclone-dust-collector-v2019


Offline Tom Gensmer

  • Posts: 748
  • Residential Remodeler in Minnesota
Re: Oneida's new Supercell collector
« Reply #21 on: March 26, 2021, 12:29 PM »
I've the Oneida V3000 with 7" adapter to 6" drain pipe to 4" blast gates.  Maybe I'm reading it wrong but it seems like about the same static pressure in this situation, maybe less, and far less CFM?  I'm not sure why anybody would want to run a 220V motor to collect dust from a tool than to just connect a Festool Vac?

https://www.oneida-air.com/dust-collectors/personal-shops/v-system/v-system-3000-hepa-cyclone-dust-collector-v2019

The difference here is, the V3000 has far less static pressure. The Supercell can deliver close to 100" of static pressure, whereas the V300 tops out at ~13". 

So, the V3000 is only suitable for machines with 4"+ (I'm not sure how it would handle 2"?) ports, whereas the Supercell fills the niche from 1" to 4". That being said, the V3000 can handle machines with larger ports and higher CFM requirements, so it's really not an "apples-to-apples" comparison, they're targeted at different market categories, with a narrow range of overlap.

Overall, I suspect the Supercell is intended to fit the gap between the Dust Cobra and the Mini Gorilla.

Regarding "why not just use a CT?", I own a Dust Cobra https://www.oneida-air.com/contractor-tools/industrial-vacuums/industrial-dust-cobra-full-unit-hepa-2-stage-vacuum , and much prefer it to a CT in the Shop. The appeal is, I can have the Cobra (and associated noise) in the corner, and just run hose to my work station. I have it on an iVac remote, so I don't need to fuss with having the tool tied to the collector (other than the hose). That being said, that's my preference, but I also understand that some users would still prefer a CT. My Midi is mostly assigned to kitty litter clean up duties these days....

Again, I don't think Oneida is trying to replace anything per-se, rather I suspect they identified a specific need in Industry (grinding concrete, for example), developed a product, and are marketing it to fill other niches for users with specific needs.

For my own shop, I'm currently using a Mini Gorilla and a Dust Cobra, which have served their purpose but I'm looking forward to a permanent setup with 8" spiral lines and a Oneida High Vacuum machine https://www.oneida-air.com/dust-collectors/professional-shops/high-vacuum/5-hp-high-vacuum-cyclone-dust-collector . Oneida's been great to work with, it's nice to see them offer a range of products within a particular category (I think for a given motor HP they offer several product lines), I'm curious to see what other solutions they come up with.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 12:36 PM by Tom Gensmer »
CT-MIDI, C-18, RO-150, RO-90, OF-1010, OF-1400, MFK-700, MFK-700EQ/B, EHL-65, DTS-400, LS-130, MFT/3 (x4), MFT/Kapex (x3), KA 65 Conturo, endless Systainers