Author Topic: Mafell edge bander  (Read 1267 times)

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Offline afish

  • Posts: 736
Mafell edge bander
« on: October 23, 2021, 02:18 PM »
HAs anyone here actually used the newer zero joint edgebander?  If so what were your thoughts?  I know its been out for awhile now but there is very little info out there from people that have used it.  At 10k its a pretty serious commitment but if its any good 10k is a down right steal to produce zero joint edgebanding.

Im also a little concerned about how perfect the edge needs to be.  The big machines have a pre mill to make sure the edge is perfectly square and straight. Without any gap filling type glue it would seem that the edge would need to be darn near perfect.   

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Offline Peter Kelly

  • Posts: 61
Re: Mafell edge bander
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2021, 04:06 PM »
I did look at the Kluge-branded version of this thing at a store in Berlin a few years ago, the results are impressive and the man that did the demo for me cut off a piece of melamine clad board using nothing more than a Mafell track saw with a fresh blade. Just beware that it's actually a hot air bander that only accepts Döllken Fusion Edge tape not plain 1mm tape, fleece-backed wood or plastic laminate. Pretty much a $10k boat-anchor without it.

https://na.doellken.com/products/seamless-edgebanding/

I haven't tried a Conturo but I can't imagine the Mafell's results are $6,500 nicer. The proprietary tape thing is pretty annoying too.

Offline WastedP

  • Posts: 395
Re: Mafell edge bander
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2021, 12:37 PM »
I worked with a shop some time back that used Dollken tape and had investigated a laser edgebander.  The promo materials the manufacturer provided included blocks of melamine edgebanded on four sides with the laser system and a regular glue-pot edgebander, submerged in an aquarium.  The results were predictable, but still amazing.  If you can get that level of water resistance for $10k in a portable machine, that sounds about $690,000 cheaper than the full-size industrial machine they were looking at.

Offline afish

  • Posts: 736
Re: Mafell edge bander
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2021, 01:18 PM »
Yep, 10k for a zero joint edgbander is a big outlay for smaller guy but thats why I said its also a steal if it works good since its the only sub 500k zero joint machine I know of.  Its a very interesting machine for sure.  From my understanding there is 2 types of zero joint systems. Laser and hot air. Not the typical hot air some are used too though.  The laser was first and tends to be more expensive. Hot air has brought the price down a bit and Im sure it will continue to get better but The mafell is the only one within reach for me and still a stretch but it is appealing for sure. 

I didnt know the Mafell could only use the Dolken edgebanding... Im not sure if that is 100% correct or not. Many edgbanding co. offer the zero joint banding "however the color selection is limited" from what I noticed.  I know it needs special edgebanding just not sure if there is something different for the Mafell unit that only Dolken offers.  The water and heat resistance is another big plus.  I know PUR glue is available but the cleanup is concerning and once the polyurethane hardens if you dont get it all its probably going to turn the conturo into a 3k brick.

Offline WastedP

  • Posts: 395
Re: Mafell edge bander
« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2021, 01:37 PM »
I had to look at Mafell's site  when I saw this thread, because I'd never heard of their edgebander.  Judging from the info there, including the manual (in German, which didn't help me too much), I see several different brands of compatible edgeband mentioned besides Dollken, but nothing about separate adhesive.

I own a Franklin PUR gun, and despite the incredible bond strength of the adhesives, there are lots of problems with that system that would keep me from using PUR adhesives anywhere they weren't designed for.

I personally would get more use out of a Conturo because it can be used with 3mm+ wood edgeband, but if I had some job that required that zero-edge look, and I had to send panels out of town to be edged, I'd look closer at the Mafell.

Offline afish

  • Posts: 736
Re: Mafell edge bander
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2021, 04:10 PM »
I think I confused you.  They make PUR glue for the conturo NOT the Mafell but Im to cautious to use it as I dont want or need to turn my conturo into a brick.  I am curious if any have used it for extended periods with no adverse side effects.  I know you have to run the red glue cleaner puck right after using it so it doesnt set up in the conturo.

The Mafell and other laser/hot air edge banders dont use a separate glue (which another attraction) the adhesive is already on the edgebanding and is activated by the laser or hot air. just before contact.  I know some might want to confuse this with the old school hot air pre glued edge banding technology but it is not that.  I havent seen any up close but it looks like the adhesive looks non detectable.  The newer "zero joint" is better in every way. I wont say zero joint but the joint is darn near invisible and only if you really look close and I mean close.  If anything any slight color variation is the only tell.  Plus being waterproof and more heat resistant and less mess. 

My biggest concern is without the pre mill feature of the big stationary edge banders that as someone pointed out are big money. I was concerned any slight deviation in the cut would ruin the zero joint since it doesn't really look to have any gap filling properties like the typical glue       

Offline WastedP

  • Posts: 395
Re: Mafell edge bander
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2021, 05:54 PM »
Understood about the PUR; you have to follow instructions to the letter.

I think the zero edge adhesives might be color-matched and I wouldn't be surprised if they worked though some kind of solvent weld like solid surface glues.  The special edgeband surely costs more, but I bet it pays off if you can avoid alot of standard edgebander maintenance.  The tradeoffs between buying into a system or using commodity materials.

Offline Peter Kelly

  • Posts: 61
Re: Mafell edge bander
« Reply #7 on: October 24, 2021, 08:48 PM »
I didnt know the Mafell could only use the Dolken edgebanding... Im not sure if that is 100% correct or not.
This is what I was informed of when I first saw the Kluge-branded machine demoed over 4 years ago in 2017 prior to Mafell becoming their distributor so things may have changed since.

It's a cool system but it seemed to me that if I really needed to produce panels or cabinet doors to look truly monolithic it's almost simpler and cleaner to make them out of MDF and either spray them or send out for powder coating. Vastly more colour choices, finishes, door edges can be profiled and the look is generally a lot higher end than just melamine-clad particleboard.

Offline afish

  • Posts: 736
Re: Mafell edge bander
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2021, 04:38 PM »
I didnt know the Mafell could only use the Dolken edgebanding... Im not sure if that is 100% correct or not.
This is what I was informed of when I first saw the Kluge-branded machine demoed over 4 years ago in 2017 prior to Mafell becoming their distributor so things may have changed since.

It's a cool system but it seemed to me that if I really needed to produce panels or cabinet doors to look truly monolithic it's almost simpler and cleaner to make them out of MDF and either spray them or send out for powder coating. Vastly more colour choices, finishes, door edges can be profiled and the look is generally a lot higher end than just melamine-clad particleboard.

I hear you but sometimes painting isnt always the best option.  The waterproof/extra heat resistance is another big plus without having to deal with PUR glue.  I can get pretty darn good edges with a conturo but if you are doing anything that is going to be used outside like a outdoor kitchen for example its really the only automated possibility.  IM doing some doors for one now and its a pita having to epoxy and clamp everything.  The edges are the worst and slowest part the faces arnt that bad just throw them in the vacuum bag and leave it.  The edges are different story and take a lot of clamps plus the epoxy takes awhile to set up so its slow going.  If there was a good waterproof heat resistant edge banding option it would be ideal for exterior projects. 

I did look at the Rehau website and they have waaaaaay more color options available for their zero joint edge banding (it did seem like they were out of stock on a lot of it) but Im assuming thats more do to the supply chain issue.  My local place only offered a few basic colors so I assumed that was it.  I dont remember for sure but I think Rehau said there was 400 different options after I filtered on zero joint.  Originally I was thinking I would sell the conturo and use that money toward the zero joint but when I saw there was only a few different colors available I figured I would need to keep the conturo and add the mafell which I wasnt prepared to do.  Rehau does make the mafell more attractive with the range of options. 

I was a little confused it looks like Rehau has an online store, but I wasnt sure if I was on some type of dealer site or if they sell to the public via their online store.  Does anyone know if its dealer only for online sales?