Author Topic: Dust extractor autostart  (Read 3892 times)

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Offline Beacon1705

  • Posts: 14
Dust extractor autostart
« on: May 23, 2017, 02:11 AM »
Good morning FOG,

I have recently purchased a new Jointer and dust extractor from Hammer, I am now after an automatic start for the dust extractor.

The tool will be on a mobile base so I don't want to hard wire anything directly to the tool. Hammer offer an autostart but its in 400v, where as the tool i have purchased is 230v 16 amp.

This is the hammer attachment, which looks ideal if i could get it in 16 amp, any ideas anyone?



The dust extractor is in another room, i.e. not the workshop so the simple ir remotes will not work.

Regards

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Offline Bohdan

  • Posts: 975
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #1 on: May 23, 2017, 05:29 AM »

The dust extractor is in another room, i.e. not the workshop so the simple ir remotes will not work.

Regards

Get a wireless RF remote, around $20 from China.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/AC-240V-Long-Distance-High-Current-30A-Relay-RF-Wireless-Remote-Control-Switch-/271968342893

Offline Beacon1705

  • Posts: 14
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #2 on: May 23, 2017, 06:04 AM »
Unfortunately wireless remotes will not work in my situation.

Been told by felder other manufactures make what I require but they didn't know who, and google is not being of great help

Offline aloysius

  • Posts: 398
FOG-wit since '95:  Some say since birth...

Offline Beacon1705

  • Posts: 14
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #4 on: May 23, 2017, 07:47 AM »
Thanks, the first one seems to only go to 10 amp, if i am reading that right and the second is only for connecting to a 3 phase power supply which I do not have. I need something with two sockets standard uk plug 13 amp to dust extractor and a 16 amp socket to the jointer.

Seems what I want doesnt seem to be available anywhere.

Offline Bohdan

  • Posts: 975
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2017, 08:12 AM »
I need something with two sockets standard uk plug 13 amp to dust extractor and a 16 amp socket to the jointer.

Seems what I want doesnt seem to be available anywhere.

That would require a 29 amp outlet and since they are both motors starting simultaneously, the startup current will be a lot more.

Your best solution is to use one circuit to drive the jointer and with the other outlet switch a contactor which will turn on the dust extractor on a different circuit.

This will only work well for one machine.

Why did you say that you can't use wireless?

Offline antss

  • Posts: 1453
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2017, 09:41 AM »
How far away is your dust collector room ?

If it's close enough to be effective to pull the required cfm's at your tools , then it's close enough for a radio remote trigger - RF.

Unless your room is somehow shielded against RF - which is possible.

Your other option would be to build a relay module to detect current on the jointer when powered up that then throws a contactor to turn on your dust collector.

Another alternative is a blastgate trigger like iVAC 

https://ivacswitch.com/ivac-pro-blast-gate/ivac-pro-blast-gate-specifications/


Offline Beacon1705

  • Posts: 14
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2017, 11:38 AM »
The dust extractor is about 10 ft from the tool, however there is 3ft of reinforced concrete in-between. I couldn't get a brand new AC wifi router to penetrate it. I might get lucky with an IR remote I could try if I can find one I can return. The other option would be to drill through the concrete and pull the wire to a new socket on the workshop side, A lot of work to get power to that side of the room.

I will look at those blast gates.

Cheers

Offline Peter_C

  • Posts: 876
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #8 on: May 23, 2017, 02:59 PM »
Ivac should have something that can work hardwired for you. The blast gates tied in would be awesome!

https://ivacswitch.com/ivac-pro-switch/

Offline antss

  • Posts: 1453
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #9 on: May 23, 2017, 03:54 PM »
"Unless your room is somehow shielded against RF - which is possible."

" there is 3ft of reinforced concrete in-between."


Yep, that'll do it !

Those blast gate triggers are nothing special.  You could rig up something similar using a doorbell transformer and some regular light switches.  Plans/ design are probably chock-a-bloc on the internet.


Offline scholar

  • Posts: 130
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2017, 09:33 AM »
This is what you need for 240v



https://www.dm-tools.co.uk/product.php/sn/SCH79104010#.WSWGv1TTWhA

I use this with all my machines including 16" planer.  It works great - has a delay before starting the extractor, to reduce the total startup load, and a delay before switching off the extractor, to clear the chips etc.

I found that the startup delay was not quite enough when switching on the planer from cold - it must draw a lot of current to get spinning, even with a type C breaker it would trip.  So I found I had to switch the extractor off at the machine until the planer was up and running.  I have modified the whole setup now, best explained by the following picture.



I have integrated the Scheppach auto switch into the left hand enclosure and added a three-way switch for the extractor - now I can select from the panel to turn off the extractor, have it on auto start or just switch it on independently (useful for the floor gulper http://www.axminster.co.uk/floor-gulper-attachment-211551).  The layout also means I don't need to keep swapping over the connection for each machine.

Hope that helps


Cheers



« Last Edit: May 24, 2017, 09:43 AM by scholar »

Offline Beacon1705

  • Posts: 14
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2017, 04:12 AM »
Scholar,

That looks very good, will have to get an electrical savvy friend to help set that up. I have no clue when it comes to electrics. Especially when it comes to interchanging 13amp and 16 amp circuits.

The Scheppach auto switch, any idea what amp is is rated too cannot find any information on their website or the D and M tools one.

Regards

Offline scholar

  • Posts: 130
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2017, 08:18 AM »
... will have to get an electrical savvy friend to help set that up. I have no clue when it comes to electrics. Especially when it comes to interchanging 13amp and 16 amp circuits.

The Scheppach auto switch, any idea what amp is is rated too cannot find any information on their website or the D and M tools one.


Assuming you have a 16A circuit (as I guess you need for the Hammer planer anyway), you shouldn't need any great expertise to connect the switch up - you just need to wire up the Shuko plugs that the D&M offering includes - one for the planer and one for the extractor - and you will probably need to replace the german plug on the lead to the autoswitch with one that fits your 16A outlet.

Details of the autoswitch (actually made by Tripus) are as follows:



https://www.tripus.de/en/Time-delayer-for-start-and-stop-ALV-2-230V-shopitem-421-4980-7421-158.html

If your extractor is in a separate room, I would think the switched arrangement I have done would be even more beneficial.  If it helps, here are a few more pics etc:







You can see that I fashioned a new top panel for the autoswitch which made it less bulky so it would fit neatly in the enclosure (all reversible).

The three way selection switch is something i spotted on ebay and figured it would work, then had to work out how the various connections worked.  I did this from first principles and drew up a grid that I have reproduced below - there are two live inputs, one permanent live and one from the autoswitch, then one load output to the extractor socket.  Your leccy friend will find it easier than I did!





Hope that is helpful

cheers

Offline Beacon1705

  • Posts: 14
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2017, 01:07 PM »
Thank you so much. That is a great help, I think I will try this. It will be great to add the switch in the room for control as well.

Appreciate this a lot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Offline scholar

  • Posts: 130
Re: Dust extractor autostart
« Reply #14 on: May 25, 2017, 05:41 PM »
I meant to add the switch was a Kraus & Naimer CA10 A401 switch - their range is immense and seems to be widely available - no doubt other models might do the same job, but it was nice to have the "Off/Auto/On" legend marked on the faceplate (that might be an optional extra).

Good luck