Author Topic: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop  (Read 111416 times)

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Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 6774
Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #120 on: March 20, 2015, 01:02 PM »
Hmmm...maybe they use a SawStop cartridge for that part [eek]

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Offline Sean Ackerman

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #121 on: March 20, 2015, 01:04 PM »
I believe they do it mathematically by bringing the motor to an abrupt stop and calculating horsepower based on the resulting torque and rpm from full speed.

What Rick said, it's either a nominal rating or some unrealistic application.  Example, some companies rate torque on their drill /drivers by throwing a HUGE self feed bit on it, drill into something SUPER hard, bind the tool up and measure the torque at the point the drill is about to rip your wrist apart and your shoulder out of the socket.  And there ya go, max torque.  Not usable per se
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Offline Grasshopper

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #122 on: March 20, 2015, 03:15 PM »
I wanted to chime in again and just say that I think this is awesome.  I don't mind the price, and I love the tech.  I think it's brilliant that you can reset and get back to work if you happen to trip the saw.

I hope to see more innovations like this.
Aspiring DIY'er (hence the name "grasshopper" as I am looking to learn from all the masters on the FOG)- TS 55, OF 1400, MFT/3, VS600 Dovetail Jig, MFS700+ MFS2000 extension profiles, Kapex, Kapex UG set, T12 Li set(x2), CT22, Domino, Carvex, RO90, RO150, MFK700, CMS-VL, Qwas super pack & Cool Wife.

Offline NERemodeling

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #123 on: March 20, 2015, 07:39 PM »
i got a real look at the saw today and it seems very nice..   largely based on the bosch 4100..     it is around 78lbs saw only and i think the guy said around 130lbs with the stand.    the internals do seem quite beefy so im sure it it will hold up quite well to a discharge.
 
in the video you will notice that the saw actually misfires the first time he goes to make a cut   it fired when it hit the wood and not the hot dog.. maybe it was wet from the hot dog or something..   he seemed a little thrown off and surprised about it so it probably hadn't happened to him before.  also these are obviously pre production models with the planned fall release so im sure they have some kinks to iron out
he fire it up a second time and it works excellent.    its amazing how fast you can change the cartridge and get back to work
 
enjoy guys

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Offline Rick Christopherson

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #124 on: March 20, 2015, 07:50 PM »

in the video you will notice that the saw actually misfires the first time he goes to make a cut   it fired when it hit the wood and not the hot dog.. maybe it was wet from the hot dog or something..   

Actually, it never even got to the wood yet. Something else caused it to misfire. It could have been the splitter that touched the blade. Things do tend to go awry at trade shows, so it's probably not that big of a deal.

Offline Charlie Mac

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #125 on: March 20, 2015, 08:47 PM »
It seemed to happen just when the plastic guard touched the food.

Offline jafenske

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #126 on: March 20, 2015, 09:18 PM »
Has anyone seen any information regarding the use of dados with this saw.

Offline Frank Pellow

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #127 on: March 21, 2015, 04:21 AM »
Has anyone seen any information regarding the use of dados with this saw.

Yes.  A regular 8" dado stack is supported and does not require a speciall cartridge.
Cheers,   
               Frank (Festool connoisseur)

Offline Frank Pellow

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #128 on: March 21, 2015, 04:31 AM »
As Bosch says, the 4100 REAXX saw is an improved 4100 -09.   The most obvious improvement is the "flesh detecting drop down'.  But, there is at least one other improvement.  The fence on the 4100 -09 is kind of finicky to set properly whereas the 4100 REAXX saw's fence is obviously easier to set (and appears to me to be a little bit larger). 

Can anyone spot any other improvements?
Cheers,   
               Frank (Festool connoisseur)

Offline Kev

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #129 on: March 21, 2015, 04:39 AM »
What was that? Oh ... that's the sound of sausages all around the world letting out a united sigh of relief. Safe at last! [big grin]

To me the good thing here is that regulators can now intelligently mandate a capability rather than a proprietary product (which has always been my beef in this area).

It's going to be interesting to watch the market now ... I can see a bit of rebadging happening soon!


Offline Paul G

  • Posts: 1986
Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #130 on: March 21, 2015, 07:49 AM »
What was that? Oh ... that's the sound of sausages all around the world letting out a united sigh of relief. Safe at last! [big grin]

To me the good thing here is that regulators can now intelligently mandate a capability rather than a proprietary product (which has always been my beef in this area).

It's going to be interesting to watch the market now ... I can see a bit of rebadging happening soon!

Frankly I see nothing intelligent about mandating this capability.
+1

Offline elfick

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #131 on: March 21, 2015, 08:20 AM »
Can anyone spot any other improvements?
Does the 4100 have that extending outfeed table/ledge? I think that's pretty cool.

Offline SittingElf

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #132 on: March 21, 2015, 08:25 AM »

To me the good thing here is that regulators can now intelligently mandate a capability rather than a proprietary product (which has always been my beef in this area).


Frankly I see nothing intelligent about mandating this capability.

Except of course eliminating a large percentage of the estimated $2.6Billion/yr in medical costs for TS accidents...in the USA alone.

Seat Belts are mandated
Shatter-Proof glass is mandated
Hearing protection is mandated
Helmets are mandated (construction)
Etc, Etc....

I DO see the benefits of mandating safety technology...especially for products and conditions that have been clearly identified as being problems. Table saws fit this bill in spades.


Frank
Woodworking is 3% talent and 97% paying attention to the FOG! 

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Offline Frank Pellow

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #133 on: March 21, 2015, 08:54 AM »
Can anyone spot any other improvements?
Does the 4100 have that extending outfeed table/ledge? I think that's pretty cool.

Well spotted.  There is  a smaller out-feed support available as an ad-on for about $30.  Here is a photo:



The out-feed support on the 4100 REAXX is larger and appears to be more robust.

Cheers,   
               Frank (Festool connoisseur)

Offline hopper

  • Posts: 109
Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #134 on: March 21, 2015, 04:28 PM »
There is , also, a side extension similar to that outfeed extension available for the 4100 saw.  I have had both extensions on my saw for over a year now.

http://www.amazon.ca/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=bosch%20extension%20table%20for%20saw

Offline ccmviking

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #135 on: March 21, 2015, 08:12 PM »
Has anyone seen a test on the Bosch or SawStop that represents someone reaching across the blade to get a cut off piece of wood as often happens in these injuries.  I've always seen it demonstrated laying on a piece of wood and being fed into the saw.  I'm sure it would work pretty much the same, just wondering if the nick would change much in severity if your finger went more rapidly into the blade as in the normal course of work.

Chris...

Offline Kev

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #136 on: March 22, 2015, 08:14 AM »
What was that? Oh ... that's the sound of sausages all around the world letting out a united sigh of relief. Safe at last! [big grin]

To me the good thing here is that regulators can now intelligently mandate a capability rather than a proprietary product (which has always been my beef in this area).

It's going to be interesting to watch the market now ... I can see a bit of rebadging happening soon!

Sorry ... what am I thinking using the words "intelligent" and "regulators" in the sane sentence [huh]

Frankly I see nothing intelligent about mandating this capability.

Offline ajcoholic

  • Posts: 44
Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #137 on: March 22, 2015, 03:03 PM »
Having had three firings on my 5 HP Industrial SS (one due to multiple quick power fades, one due to trying to cut some copper clad laminate and forgetting to lock out the trigger, and one due to touching the aluminum mitre fence) I have to say that the claims of people saying the SS destroys the blades, is false.

I use good quality, industrial (Onsrud, FS Tool, BC Saw & Tool, Forest) full kerf blades.  I have triggered the saw twice on the same blade and other than one slightly chipped tooth which was a few bbucks to replace on the next sharpening, the blades were still true and back on the saw cutting within a few minutes.

The Bosch cartridge is still going to cost $$ to replace after 2 firings as well.  You wont get something for nothing.

I like the competition.  The more saws like this on the market for those who do want the technology, the better.  But I dont think, after over a decade in business Sawstop will suddenly be put out of business, as they make a very good saw.

I run a professional cabinet and custom woodworking shop with myself and 2 employees.  Been in full time business since I took over from my father in 97' and I grew up in the business since starting to work as a young teen in the early 80's.

I have seen a few very serious (lost fingers) saw accidents.  I dont want any of my guys, nor either of my two sons to go through that, even a small accident never mind several amputated fingers.

Accidents can happen to the best of "us".  Having been through several shops over my career, I always look to see who's got all ten digits and there is always a surprising # who do not, unfortunatley.  Why fight a good technological advance?  It just might save you, or one of your employees hands.

If I could get the technology on my $20,000 panel saw, I would have bought it as well.  Saws are still IMO the prevelant danger in the custom woodshop.  Since they are called upon to do many tasks other than just straight cutting.

Andrew J Coholic
Joe Coholic Custom Furniture Ltd.

(PS I do have a bunch of Festool stuff too, I just dont post much).

Offline Tom Bellemare

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #138 on: March 22, 2015, 06:57 PM »
It's always nice to hear the voice of reason...

Thank you!


Tom

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1946
Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #139 on: March 22, 2015, 09:47 PM »
Yeah, I have all my fingers, but don't turn down any safety mechanism period and especially on a table saw. I've had a couple of close calls over the years and they were the result of a loss of concentration or distraction or a sudden random event with the wood or just a human mistake. As I get older, I know my reaction time is not quite as fast as it used to be and the next close call might just be the one where I don't recover in time.
Randy

Offline jimbo51

  • Posts: 465
Waiting for Reaxx
« Reply #140 on: November 20, 2015, 10:33 AM »
Bosch 09 Reaxx Portable - Free Shipping. Tax Free. In StockÔÇÄ

Copied from Google. But click on the Tool Nut link and find out it is not yet in stock.  Oops.

It is getting late on in 2015 for a product launch this year. Any one hear other news?

In other news the Elio (three wheeled US car) launch has been delayed another 6 months or so (late 2016). Not looking good there.

Offline Shane Holland

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #141 on: November 20, 2015, 10:46 AM »
Thanks for the heads up.

Latest info I've heard is limited availability in early 2016.
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Offline jimbo51

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #142 on: December 26, 2015, 11:06 AM »
In just under two weeks we can all crowd around the Bosch booth at the Woodworking Show in Baltimore and ask about the delivery date for the Reaxx.

I think that Sawstop and Bosch should do a cross license agreement. That way Sawstop could get the possibly superior blade retraction mechanism for their larger table saws and Bosch could compete in the portable market without worry about the lawsuit.

Offline Kev

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #143 on: December 27, 2015, 10:35 AM »
I'd be curious if the blades retract when they start cutting into a lawyer ... nothing human about them.

Offline Alex

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #144 on: December 27, 2015, 12:35 PM »
I'd be curious if the blades retract when they start cutting into a lawyer ... nothing human about them.

That question has already been answered. The guy who made it is lawyer, right?  [wink]

Offline Snoring Bear

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #145 on: December 27, 2015, 08:08 PM »
Interesting, reviews posted already? Hmmmm can't seem to truthful

http://www.boschtools.com/Products/Tools/Pages/BoschProductDetail.aspx?pid=GTS1041A-09#reviews
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Offline tjbnwi

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #146 on: December 27, 2015, 08:19 PM »
Interesting, reviews posted already? Hmmmm can't seem to truthful

http://www.boschtools.com/Products/Tools/Pages/BoschProductDetail.aspx?pid=GTS1041A-09#reviews

I'm thinking they posted the review on the wrong saw site, they own the 4100 not the 4100-09??

Tom

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1946
Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #147 on: December 28, 2015, 12:24 AM »
Looks like the reviews GTS1041A-09 which is what all the reviews seem to be under. I would assume that Bosch is trying to make the case that the Reaxx is the same high quality saw but with the safety freature added. Give that Bosch appears to have postponed release of the Reaxx saw for at least 6 months, they needed to keep some interest so that potential customers would possible wait the extra time,  Meanwhile those of use who wanted a safe, high quality, movable, fold up saw, have been able to use their Sawstop Jobsite saws for almost a year before the Bosch is available. To me, the Sawstop jobsite was one of the best purchases I have made over the past 2 years with the Domino coming in as a tie. The saw really works well for me in my shop, movable when I need it be, out of the way when I need it to be, accurate cuts, good dust collection with my cycloe, and peace of mind because it's safe. If the Bosch is as good as the Sawstop, it would be great to have competition but, given it was projected at $1500 instead of the Sawstop's $1300, the competition might not be as much of a factor.
Randy

Offline Sparktrician

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #148 on: December 28, 2015, 08:20 AM »
I'd be curious if the blades retract when they start cutting into a lawyer ... nothing human about them.

That question has already been answered. The guy who made it is lawyer, right?  [wink]
 

What?  You didn't read the manual?  It says very clearly, "When cutting lawyers, engage the lockout switch before feeding the lawyer to the blade.  Be sure to wear proper eye and ear protection.  Lawyers are known to be loud and messy when dismembered." 

 [big grin]
- Willy -

 "Remember, a chip on the shoulder is a sure sign of wood higher up." - Brigham Young

Offline Kev

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Re: Bosch to Compete Against Saw Stop
« Reply #149 on: December 28, 2015, 09:48 AM »
I'd be curious if the blades retract when they start cutting into a lawyer ... nothing human about them.

That question has already been answered. The guy who made it is lawyer, right?  [wink]
 

What?  You didn't read the manual?  It says very clearly, "When cutting lawyers, engage the lockout switch before feeding the lawyer to the blade.  Be sure to wear proper eye and ear protection.  Lawyers are known to be loud and messy when dismembered." 

 [big grin]

Sorry .. I got out of the habit of reading manuals with Festool .. never anything useful.

I see it suggests the same method for politicians [cool]