Bit ruff to mark the dial gauge down because your saw plate isn't straight Anthony?

Ahh, sorry my mistake, that makes more sense now thanks!

if you have a surface plate and dial indicator you can sweep it and check.  clean the surface plate with IPA, put the indicator stand on it and sweep your plate with it see what readings you get

The time to purchase a gauge like this is when your saw cuts are not square, and to find out why. Why do it otherwise?

Regards from Perth

Derek

My rating of 2.5/5 in the first post was meant to be a bit tongue in cheek because half the plate is great, the other half, not so much. Take the average...there you go.

Do you have a stand or a 1-2-3 block where you could use your dial indicator to measure the plate with it flat on the table top? If it's out of spec, please get in touch with Customer Service.

I have a 38" Veritas aluminum straight edge and a WP 1-2-3 setup block. I was not able to slip a piece of paper under either, anywhere along the Saw Plate.

Is the gauge's round dowel sitting on the chamfer of the miter slot ?

The large dowel sits on two smaller dowels. The smaller dowels center the large dowel in the slot.

Also, you should put the saw blade on the arbor and check your blade lateral run-out. 

I will check this later today.

Some video observations:

This is a fairly new Ridge Carbide 40T Box Joint Blade. The gauge starts at 0 then gradually increases ~.002 at the arbor and coming to a stop a .003.



This is the Saw Plate on the smooth (logo) side. It starts at 0, wobbles a bit around 0 until center, then climbs to .005.



This is the Saw Plate on the rough (non-logo) side. It starts at 0, gradually increases to .008 at center, then comes to a stop a .007.



This is the Saw Plate on the rough (non-logo) side. I set the Saw Gauge to 0 at the center/arbor. It starts at -.092, hits 0 at the center, then comes to a stop at -.099



I sketched some exaggerations of the results. I would've expected the Saw Plate to have a more gradual change across the entire width, as was the case with the Ridge Carbide blade.

I don't know where my discrepancy is. Assuming a perfect Saw Plate, my miter slots would be shaped like a hockey stick. The hockey stick reverses when I reverse the plate, so my guess is the miter slots are fine. I can't find any gaps in the Saw Plate but the gauge still shows a hockey stick measurement. When measuring blades, the measurements are mostly gradual.



The Saw Gauge 2.0 has been a very useful tool and I'm glad I have it. I always check my table alignment after I trip a brake and it comes in handy for checking my fence from time to time.

As for the Align-A-Saw Plate, well, it wasn't something I needed. I wanted it because I wanted it. But I didn't need it.

I took some measurements with two more blades and also got fairly consistent results.

Examples:

Freud thin kerf: 0, .001, .001


SawStop 80T Titanium: 0, .002, .099
This blade has slightly raised lettering near the center which may have skewed the center reading. I placed the gauge between letters as best as I could.


Maybe I'll reach out to WP customer service and get their thoughts on the matter.

4nthony has done a public service, confirming what many of us know that if your saw cuts well based on the actual cutting results, you don't need to do anything else.

Agreed 100%. My takeaway from all this is that I need to stop buying tools that I think I need, that I think are cool, or that I think will help me achieve perfection in my woodworking.

The more I chase and fail to achieve perfection, the more frustrated I get, and the less fun this hobby becomes.

Take 2 more readings .. mark the Ridge carbide blade and your your saws arbor .. take a reading then rotate the arbor 180 deg to your mark on the blade and check your measurement again. See what the result is ? Report back

Exactly. Plus check the mitre slot. There are a number of possible reasons why a reading can vary.

The easiest way to check the blade is to use the saw to make a few cuts. Measure the saw cuts for accuracy.

Regards from Perth

Derek

I have their 1.0 version. It didn't come with the test plate. I like that addition; with the blades, I've had a few with a wobble in the plate that messes with the numbers until I rotate the blade and start over.

Anthony did you loosen the arbor nut and then rotate the blade to be 180 deg from the orig marks for those measurements ?

Take 2 more readings .. mark the Ridge carbide blade and your your saws arbor .. take a reading then rotate the arbor 180 deg to your mark on the blade and check your measurement again. See what the result is ? Report back

When I first checked my table saw, I found the alignment with the miter slot was not very good.   And it really didn't have provisions for adjustment.   The spindle assembly was bolted to the table top through clearance holes, and already pushed over as far as it would go.  I had to neck down the mounting screws to give some more adjustment.

Also found some wobble in my blades that I was able to mostly get out by sanding the appropriate spot on the arbor face. (The arbor, not the blade, was the problem)

So it is worth going through the exercise of checking.

Anthony did you loosen the arbor nut and then rotate the blade to be 180 deg from the orig marks for those measurements ?

I did not. I left the arbor nut tight and only turned the blade 180°. I checked the runout on the arbor itself and the gauge barely moved. Like 1/10th of .001". The very slightest of movement. I'll do it again.

I haven’t read the whole thread carefully so some of my comments might be redundant.

Long story short, I bought a thing. My expectations of thing were X. My reality was Y. Expectations > Reality.

Currently trying to figure out how to accurately measure thing to see if it's in spec or out of spec.

Realizing none of this is all that important (my saw was already within spec using implements other than thing), convincing myself to stop falling for thing marketing, and to no longer buy things I don't need.

When I was into photography, I believe my behavior -- obsessing over mystical numbers -- was called "measurebating".

I'm going to mention something I ran into while working on the Align-A-Saw video, while trying to get the saw in my shop under .001" (something I would not recommend to anyone no matter how OCD).

If I ran my angle and/or height adjustment all the way to the stop and locked it, I would get a different reading than if I brought it to the stop and then just removed the backlash and ever so slightly released the tension against the stop.

I mention it because the error was weirdly non-linear, like you're seeing.

I've made the tension release part of my routine when making adjustments, and it seems to be yielding consistently better results.

I found a lot more variation in the miter slot to the SawStop Industrial fence than in the miter slot to the blade. My guess is the there is more blade deflection in the wood while cutting than the measurements being discussed here.

If I need a high precision cut, I make the first cut proud and then make the final cut to the exact desired dimension. In no case do I expect metal machining accuracy for wood cuts.

If I ran my angle and/or height adjustment all the way to the stop and locked it, I would get a different reading than if I brought it to the stop and then just removed the backlash and ever so slightly released the tension against the stop.

I think Steven Woodward also discovered this problem.

I've given up on on the Saw Plate.

I backed off the height as Jeff suggested and that improved the tooth to tooth alignment on a couple saw blades.

- My 40T Ridge Carbide tested above improved to .004".
- The 80T SawStop and the Freud thin kerf improvements were <.001"
- My 24T Woodworker II improved from .004" to .003"

However, measurements from the Saw Plate were basically the same; Very little movement from 0 - 6", then a curve.

Hopefully I'll hear back from WP customer service in the next day or two.

Hey @4nthony,
I just looked at the Woodpeckers Align-A-Saw video and noticed that they use a 2-step grinding process. The first step is for an outside service to blanchard grind the saw plate and then the saw plate is brought in-house where it is surface ground. To put things into perspective, blanchard grinding is a process used to get material surfaces "close" to flat while precision surface grinding is a process used to get surfaces "perfectly" (within .0005" to .000001" or less) flat.
Blanchard grinding is typically used to condition a flywheel or pressure plate surface and thus a surface flatness of .002" to .004" would be good enough given the end use of these items.

When I first looked at your photos the other day, the first thing I noticed was the strong blanchard grinding marks on your saw plate and thought that was unusual because they were deeper/more defined than they should be which would skew your indicator readings.

However, now knowing that Woodpeckers utilizes a double grinding process, I think your saw plate was blanchard ground and for some reason never went through the final surface grinding operation.

Blanchard grinding will leave circular grinding marks on the surface, while precision surface grinding will leave long parallel grinding marks on the surface. I'd have a long conversation with Woodpeckers about this because there is no area that I can see on your saw plate that has been surface ground.

Interesting find. There's a night and day difference in the two sides of my plate. The side with the logo is so smooth that the dial indicator left a bunch of streaks. The other side, with the faded sharpie numbers, not so much. In the Deep Dive video, Jeff uses both sides to take measurements. And if both sides are supposed to be surface ground, then you're right in that mine missed a step.

I was out in the garage OCD'ing over this tonight, because, Saw Plate...



I also saw their "production update" video, and it's mentioned that the tolerances are "one-thousandth of an inch", not the .002" on the website description.

Though, what caught my eye was the guy measuring flatness:



A lightbulb turned on and I realized what Jeff meant when he said:

Do you have a stand or a 1-2-3 block where you could use your dial indicator to measure the plate with it flat on the table top? If it's out of spec, please get in touch with Customer Service.

I rigged up my dial indicator onto a piece of scrap and clamped it as snug as possible to the 1-2-3 block. I slid the block along the table and noted some deviation.



Then I started thinking my tables are probably not perfectly flat and maybe the 1-2-3 block is riding across undulations in the table. Do I want to check every inch of cast iron to look for a perfect 12" section that I can use to check if the plate is flat? How far down this rabbit hole do I want to go?

I still haven't heard back from Woodpecker's customer service, though this isn't the first time I've tried to contact them via the website and didn't hear back. I'll pick up the phone on Monday and see where it gets me. Hopefully the person I get on the phone will also know the difference in grind types.

Thanks @Cheese !