Author Topic: Stihl interesting (Read 31589 times)

Kev · « **on:** August 03, 2015, 12:43 AM »

Hi All,

Thought I'd take a peek at the 36V Stihl gardening tools ...

The range consists of ...

3 small chain saws ...
I grabbed the larger of the three and it works well, 6mm chain cuts fine and efficiently.

3 hedge trimmers ...
I grabbed the larger of the two hand helds and also the pole version, they cut extremely well.

2 edge trimmers ...
I got the larger one and I'm a bit ho-hum about it. Fine for a manicured garden.

1 mower with catcher and 14.5" blade
I didn't bother, one day this may suit my garden, but it won't be for a while and a 4 stroke petrol Honda will take a lot to beat.

1 blower
I did get this, it absolutely chews the batteries, but has very impressive gusto for a cordless blower!!

1 pole pruner
A must have, this is the jewel of the cordless range to me the light and compact chain head is a winner.

3 battery sizes
115, 180 and 900 (backpack). I went with 2x 180's and they'll give 2 hours with a hedge trimmer and 40 minutes with a chain saw.

3 charger types
Slow, ok and awesome. I got the "awesome" one and it charges the 180 battery pack fully in 25 minutes.

Other stuff
There's a cut off saw and other bits and pieces in the range that I'm not in the market for, but seem well made.

Summing up ...

This stuff isn't for everyone and switching from a powerful petrol variant and expecting similar will leave you mostly disappointed. They do seem to hold their own with most mains electric models of similar size to me.

If you do anything approaching commercial work, only a couple of the items will be useful. Probably the hedge trimmers in conjunction with the backpack battery and perhaps the really compact top handle arborist's chainsaw (I may still grab this one).

The chain saws will require you to keep the chains clean and sharp to get through anything. I doubt you'll ever see one of these cordless units in the back of a pickup

All in all I'd say cordless battery gardening is mostly here and it's nice to have much quieter gardening tools.

I'm keeping an eye on the robot mower market .. there's some serious stuff for the big end, but the domestic stuff has a way to go yet.

Untidy Shop · « **Reply #1 on:** August 03, 2015, 01:00 AM »

Kev · « **Reply #2 on:** August 03, 2015, 03:40 AM »

Quote from: Untidy Shop on August 03, 2015, 01:00 AM

(Attachment Link)

@Kev

I do blame you ... you didn't exactly "talk me down"

Coliban · « **Reply #3 on:** August 03, 2015, 03:47 AM »

Nice collection !

While most of my colleagues also use Stihl, I bought a McCulloch CS350 (petrol powered, now a subsidiary company of Husqvarna, Sweden), our lawn mower is a Bosch Li-Ion, which is running for years (but the lawn is only about 150 square meter) without problems and we think, for smaller sawing tasks we get a li-ion powered chain saw from Makita, because we already have the big Makita lo-ion powered drill hammer.

Kev · « **Reply #4 on:** August 03, 2015, 05:42 AM »

Quote from: Coliban on August 03, 2015, 03:47 AM

Nice collection !

While most of my colleagues also use Stihl, I bought a McCulloch CS350 (petrol powered, now a subsidiary company of Husqvarna, Sweden), our lawn mower is a Bosch Li-Ion, which is running for years (but the lawn is only about 150 square meter) without problems and we think, for smaller sawing tasks we get a li-ion powered chain saw from Makita, because we already have the big Makita lo-ion powered drill hammer.

My "petrol stable" is a bitsa ... I'll be glad to clear most of it out. It has some Honda and Husky stuff in there, but also a couple of strange brands that a local shop conned me on (once I trusted them, but no more!)

As things stand today we've got ~500sqm to deal with, but that's going to decrease to less than 300sqm over time. A cordless battery mower is likely then ... plus I'll be critical of the type of grass, hopefully making it more of a friendly lawn for maintenance.

Kev · « **Reply #5 on:** August 06, 2015, 07:36 AM »

Update ... apparently all of these gardening tools belong to my wife

Well guys, buy your wife a cute little 36V electric chainsaw for Christmas .. Hey, I think she needs her own shed

Untidy Shop · « **Reply #6 on:** August 06, 2015, 08:36 AM »

Quote from: Kev on August 06, 2015, 07:36 AM

Update ... apparently all of these gardening tools belong to my wife

Fine, then let her do all the work then!

MsUntidy 'rescued' a Bosch 4.5V screwdriver from the Untidy Shed today. I know she will soon tire of it and then will look at the CXS.

She already thinks it is cute.

@Kev

Cheese · « **Reply #7 on:** August 06, 2015, 06:37 PM »

Quote from: Untidy Shop on August 06, 2015, 08:36 AM

MsUntidy 'rescued' a Bosch 4.5V screwdriver from the Untidy Shed today. I know she will soon tire of it and then will look at the CXS.

@Kev

I can appreciate that...
A couple of days ago I couldn't find one of my Festool tape measures...So my wife & I were at a gardening store and I needed to measure something, so she pulls the Festool tape out of her purse. I said, "hey that's my tape measure", she says "not any more, besides, you never even knew it was gone, so it's mine now".

cliffp · « **Reply #8 on:** August 15, 2015, 05:07 AM »

Cheers Kev, you've just cost me £1300! I couldn't resist the idea of some shiny new tools in a different category from woodworking. Initially the idea seemed completely stupid, then over the course of a week or two I managed to persuade myself that I HAD to have them. I am getting the largest chainsaw, the largest hedge trimmer (not pole version), largest edge trimmer and pole pruner. I am also getting one 180 battery and 'awesome' charger. I only need the 'ok' charger but don't want to be outdone by a fellow Festool fanatic!

I hope my wife will enjoy using the tools after I have finished playing with them and the novelty has worn off

mark · « **Reply #9 on:** August 15, 2015, 05:32 AM »

I've been tempted to go with Stihl after having some problems with my top handle Stihl due to operator error... but not that thing is awesome... dang noisy, but powerful and nice to have up in the tree. I've been trying to hunt down the Husqvarna version of their arborist saw but its running around $800+ to get one here in Hawaii and our local Husqvarna dealer is also a Stihl and Corepower dealer so I don't think they want another battery saw in their shop.

Stihl is supposedly coming out with their version of a top handle arborist next year but who knows how much that thing will cost. I'm hoping Dewalt will compliment their new 20 and 40v brushless line with a chainsaw soon.

For now though, and for smaller and quick jobs, I'm getting a Milwaukee m18 Fuel recip with a pruning blade... quieter, toss the blade when it gets dull or bent...

Kev · « **Reply #10 on:** August 15, 2015, 07:50 AM »

Quote from: Mark Enomoto on August 15, 2015, 05:32 AM

I've been tempted to go with Stihl after having some problems with my top handle Stihl due to operator error... but not that thing is awesome... dang noisy, but powerful and nice to have up in the tree. I've been trying to hunt down the Husqvarna version of their arborist saw but its running around $800+ to get one here in Hawaii and our local Husqvarna dealer is also a Stihl and Corepower dealer so I don't think they want another battery saw in their shop.

Stihl is supposedly coming out with their version of a top handle arborist next year but who knows how much that thing will cost. I'm hoping Dewalt will compliment their new 20 and 40v brushless line with a chainsaw soon.

For now though, and for smaller and quick jobs, I'm getting a Milwaukee m18 Fuel recip with a pruning blade... quieter, toss the blade when it gets dull or bent...

The Stihl top handle 36V arborist has been out for a while here. I was actually thinking of grabbing it tomorrow morning ...

Kev · « **Reply #11 on:** August 15, 2015, 08:14 AM »

Quote from: cliffp on August 15, 2015, 05:07 AM

Cheers Kev, you've just cost me £1300! I couldn't resist the idea of some shiny new tools in a different category from woodworking. Initially the idea seemed completely stupid, then over the course of a week or two I managed to persuade myself that I HAD to have them. I am getting the largest chainsaw, the largest hedge trimmer (not pole version), largest edge trimmer and pole pruner. I am also getting one 180 battery and 'awesome' charger. I only need the 'ok' charger but don't want to be outdone by a fellow Festool fanatic!

I hope my wife will enjoy using the tools after I have finished playing with them and the novelty has worn off

Sorry

The pole hedge trimmer is awesome if you have over fence or tall hedges, I hadn't realised what I'd been missing. No more ladders, no more noisy two stroke and a much better cut than my old petrol hedge trimmer too (that wasn't a cheapie either!)

I grabbed the little file guide for the chainsaw (30⁰ guide). The chain saws cut really well, but it's worth keeping that narrow little chain sharp.

The tool I'm actually liking most lately is the blower. It's the only tool in the range that can empty a battery as fast as the 'awesome' charger can fill it!

I've got two of the 180 batteries and I'm tempted to get a third, that way we can go bonkers in the garden with 2 tools and have a spare battery charging.

You've gotta love the reach of the pole pruner

Less that an hour ago my wife asked me if "her" tools are charged for tomorrow. Maybe I can justify the dainty little aborist's chainsaw as a present

Tinker · « **Reply #12 on:** August 15, 2015, 08:25 AM »

I have been behind the times. I was not aware that there are battery type chainsaws. VERRRRYYYYY interesting.

For years, i have using all sizes of chainsaws. the problem has been that the longer i am 39, the harder it gets for me to start them, to say nothing about my back pains from holding on to them. I always carry a chainsaw in my truck when out snow plowing. That and an armstrong powered snow plow with a hickory boom. For years, i carried a small Echo that was adequate for emergencies and for tree work. It always started on first pull in warm weather. In the cold, i sometimes need three pulls before it made noise on its own. The last time i took it into the shop for repair, parts were no longer available (I think i had been using that saw since I was 37

) I replaced it with a slightly larger model of the same brand. That saw I cannot start in the cold weather. Most of the problem with that is that since I turned 39, it is impossible for me to pull the cord once the temp drops below 50º. I can not find much snow to push when temp gets above 50º.

Even when i store the saw at the floor heater in my truck, i can no longer pull that cord once the cold air hits (the saw/not me).

I will start looking into cordless chain saws, or even reciprocating pruning saws. I plan to keep working until i am 40, so a cordless saw will be handy to me for at least a few more years. maybe even after retirement.

This discussion has been very enlightening so far. Thanks guys.
Tinker

Cheese · « **Reply #13 on:** August 15, 2015, 10:57 AM »

@Mark Enomoto
I have a collection of Stihl petrol powered tools but most of the time for quick trimming jobs I simply use a 18 volt Sawzall and one of these blades.

I can see the time is coming very soon when most of the small gas powered equipment will be replaced with battery powered gear.

https://www.milwaukeetool.com/accessories/cutting/48-00-1301

cliffp · « **Reply #14 on:** August 15, 2015, 11:55 AM »

Kev, thanks for the extra info. I think I'll pass on the pole mounted hedge trimmer (for now at least!). I'll pick up the saw guide (I presume it is the FF1?).

I think I might pick up the blower a bit later in the year when the leaves start falling here. I already have a Viking blower/vacuum (like this one below:)

http://www.stihl.co.uk/STIHL-Products/Blowers-and-Vacuum-Shredders/029575/Electric-vacuum-shredder.aspx

This is a fantastic tool for sucking/shredding but it takes too long to switch between sucking and blowing so I could do with a separate blower.

I googled "chainsaw accidents" to see if this would sway my decision to acquire such a lethal tool and as a result I am thinking of investing in at least a pair of chainsaw gloves.

One thing I won't be buying is a snow plough! Here on the south coast of England it hardly ever snows.

RKA · « **Reply #15 on:** August 15, 2015, 03:06 PM »

I would recommend Kevlar chaps and steel toed boots. Your legs and feet are usually at much higher risk of accidental contact with the chain.

mark · « **Reply #16 on:** August 15, 2015, 04:17 PM »

The Stihl top handle NAINA till 2016 and NAIH (not available in Hawaii) till who knows when :-) Like lots of homeowners, I don't use the tools enough to keep them running enough, though when I need them its often a question of IF it will start. Using canned non-ethanol gas is key as well as running the tool dry before storing it. I've handled the Echo 56v at Home Depot and their weed wacker is too heavy as well as their blower. I was looking for something for my 86 year old Dad to use but these are all too heavy for him.

The only guys that seem to buying the Stihl Li-ion are resorts that want to reduce noise. Aulani, the Disney Resort out here I'm told bought a bunch of Stihl Li-ion hedge trimmers for on site use.

Can't beat gas for portability and out in the field. I sometimes do trail maintenance and you can't beat gas for portability and not having to lug dead batteries back to the car versus empty gas cans.

wrt to sawzall... those pruning blades work really well. I just got tired of pulling an extension cord and Milwaukee just has a July trade in sale of old tools and an extra battery deal. So I'll see how the Fuel 18v works for me.

Kev · « **Reply #17 on:** August 15, 2015, 05:36 PM »

Quote from: Mark Enomoto on August 15, 2015, 04:17 PM

The Stihl top handle NAINA till 2016 and NAIH (not available in Hawaii) till who knows when :-) Like lots of homeowners, I don't use the tools enough to keep them running enough, though when I need them its often a question of IF it will start. Using canned non-ethanol gas is key as well as running the tool dry before storing it. I've handled the Echo 56v at Home Depot and their weed wacker is too heavy as well as their blower. I was looking for something for my 86 year old Dad to use but these are all too heavy for him.

The only guys that seem to buying the Stihl Li-ion are resorts that want to reduce noise. Aulani, the Disney Resort out here I'm told bought a bunch of Stihl Li-ion hedge trimmers for on site use.

Can't beat gas for portability and out in the field. I sometimes do trail maintenance and you can't beat gas for portability and not having to lug dead batteries back to the car versus empty gas cans.

wrt to sawzall... those pruning blades work really well. I just got tired of pulling an extension cord and Milwaukee just has a July trade in sale of old tools and an extra battery deal. So I'll see how the Fuel 18v works for me.

We're a long way from battery technology that'll comprehensively challenge a petrol engine when you're working any distance at all from your charging station. The Stihl backpack battery is the closest I've seen and I reckon that's very much geared towards resorts, hospitals, corporates, etc. (It's EXPENSIVE!!)

I will say the 36V Stihl pole pruner is excellent.

As with anything, the tool must meet your needs or it actually starts to fall short of the definition of being a "tool"

I also can't imagine we'll see a cordless equivalent of a 10hp chainsaw any time soon

jmbfestool · « **Reply #18 on:** August 15, 2015, 06:08 PM »

A very nice collection!

Well jell!

Couple weeks ago I was using our petrol hedge cutter and it was playing up and before I finished it wouldn't start any more.

Been thinking of getting an electric one to replace it.

We have the egomower http://egopowerplus.co.uk
Not had it long but so far it's doing the job fine with the 4ah battery. They do a 6ah also.

I like Sthil so would lean towards getting their hedge trimmer however egopower do their own range of tools. It would make sense to go with theirs. Seen as we already have battery and charger.

I have learnt tool companies do have good and bad tools in their range.

So struggling to decide which route to go down.

Kev · « **Reply #19 on:** August 15, 2015, 06:40 PM »

Quote from: jmbfestool on August 15, 2015, 06:08 PM

A very nice collection!

Well jell!

Couple weeks ago I was using our petrol hedge cutter and it was playing up and before I finished it wouldn't start any more.

Been thinking of getting an electric one to replace it.

We have the egomower http://egopowerplus.co.uk
Not had it long but so far it's doing the job fine with the 4ah battery. They do a 6ah also.

I like Sthil so would lean towards getting their hedge trimmer however egopower do their own range of tools. It would make sense to go with theirs. Seen as we already have battery and charger.

I have learnt tool companies do have good and bad tools in their range.

So struggling to decide which route to go down.

@jmbfestool

I think the EGO mower is near the top end of town when it comes to cordless mowers, but I don't think their hedgers and chainsaws are in the same league as their mower. It is all relative though.

You'd think a sharp blade and a scissor action wouldn't be that hard to get right, but my Chinese brand petrol hedger is complete rubbish!

Take a good look at the pole hedger from Stihl .. that and the pole pruner are the real show ponies that other cordless garden tool makers seem not have in their range. If you're inclined towards them then it's certainly worth the extra charger/battery overhead, otherwise maybe not.

I don't think you'd be happy with the Stihl mower either after the EGO. The Stihl isn't an alternative to a petrol mower at all.

jmbfestool · « **Reply #20 on:** August 15, 2015, 07:00 PM »

When I had a look at the Stihl lawn mower when googling I instantly disregarded the Sthil.

Reason was because it wasn't orange. To me it was like them saying we made this but it's junk so we are to embarrassed to have it associated with the brand colour

Plus it doesn't look anything special.

The ego I read good reviews and the 56v was interesting and 6ah

Yet stihls hand held cordless tools seem well made and are orange!! I client I work for has the cordless trimmers. I didn't use it just had a feel and seems well made.

Yet it's a lot more expensive than the EGO. I like te Ego mower so from that one would assume the hedge trimmer would be good also. I would have to get my hands on one before buying.

I think Stihl might be the way to go though.

I think ego and Stihl should join together so they can produce a complete range which is useful and not just a couple of good and bads tools.

It's almost like the companies decide to spend a lot of money in producing a good tool or a couple and then people have bought into the product line and so buy the others tools to find they are not as good but it's to late.

Kev · « **Reply #21 on:** August 15, 2015, 07:10 PM »

@jmbfestool agreed !

The other cordless Stihl I wouldn't rush out to buy is the trimmer (either of the two). I've got the larger one, but it's no substitute for my petrol trimmer. The problem is likely more the way I use them though (I'm more terraform than trim when I use it!)

From the videos I've seen, I think the Stihl blower would beat the EGO, but battery life on a cordless blower is going to be pants either way! ... unless you're carrying a LOT of juice about with you.

DB10 · « **Reply #22 on:** August 15, 2015, 07:52 PM »

There is some good deals on Stihl products, down under at the moment.
I ordered up a new petrol chain saw last week and Sthil are giving away a free pair of protective trousers (pants) worth $200 bucks and a case for the saw worth another $90. Not sure if this deal includes the cordless range.
Every time my Sthil tools fire up easily as opposed to the cheap gear that doesn't, I remind myself it was worth paying the extra for.

Kev · « **Reply #23 on:** August 16, 2015, 06:03 AM »

Quote from: DB10 on August 15, 2015, 07:52 PM

There is some good deals on Stihl products, down under at the moment.
I ordered up a new petrol chain saw last week and Sthil are giving away a free pair of protective trousers (pants) worth $200 bucks and a case for the saw worth another $90. Not sure if this deal includes the cordless range.
Every time my Sthil tools fire up easily as opposed to the cheap gear that doesn't, I remind myself it was worth paying the extra for.

Couldn't help myself - tried to buy a bigger chainsaw today and get rid of my trusty old MS170. Also intended to grab the 36V Arborist. I succeeded on the Arborist, but the guy simply told me not to buy a bigger chainsaw

So annoying when you confront someone with both integrity and common sense in sales ... He could have easily made $2K+ today instead of $700, but I'll keep going back like a spawning salmon

Despite all of my anti Bunnings feelings, I did the unbelievable today ... I rushed in before closing and grabbed the cheapest Ozito shredder on the floor (well, at $309 it was $50 cheaper that the only other offering - a Ryobi). If it does what it did today another two or three times, I don't even care if I throw it away - it's not terrible. I would have needed a skip otherwise for what I've now got into three large wheelie bins !!

You're never to old to learn new tricks.

Untidy Shop · « **Reply #24 on:** August 16, 2015, 08:02 AM »

Quote from: Kev on August 16, 2015, 06:03 AM

Quote from: DB10 on August 15, 2015, 07:52 PM
There is some good deals cccc
........

Despite all of my anti Bunnings feelings, I did the unbelievable today ... I rushed in before closing and grabbed the cheapest Ozito shredder on the floor (well, at $309 it was $50 cheaper that the only other offering - a Ryobi). If it does what it did today another two or three times, I don't even care if I throw it away - it's not terrible. I would have needed a skip otherwise for what I've now got into three large wheelie bins !!

You're never to old to learn new tricks.

Mmmmmmmmm!

You know what I cannot say Kev on a public forum.
Signed the Leprechaun.

@Kev

DB10 · « **Reply #25 on:** August 16, 2015, 08:54 AM »

Quote from: Kev on August 16, 2015, 06:03 AM

Quote from: DB10 on August 15, 2015, 07:52 PM
There is some good deals on Stihl products, down under at the moment.
I ordered up a new petrol chain saw last week and Sthil are giving away a free pair of protective trousers (pants) worth $200 bucks and a case for the saw worth another $90. Not sure if this deal includes the cordless range.
Every time my Sthil tools fire up easily as opposed to the cheap gear that doesn't, I remind myself it was worth paying the extra for.

Couldn't help myself - tried to buy a bigger chainsaw today and get rid of my trusty old MS170. Also intended to grab the 36V Arborist. I succeeded on the Arborist, but the guy simply told me not to buy a bigger chainsaw

So annoying when you confront someone with both integrity and common sense in sales ... He could have easily made $2K+ today instead of $700, but I'll keep going back like a spawning salmon

Despite all of my anti Bunnings feelings, I did the unbelievable today ... I rushed in before closing and grabbed the cheapest Ozito shredder on the floor (well, at $309 it was $50 cheaper that the only other offering - a Ryobi). If it does what it did today another two or three times, I don't even care if I throw it away - it's not terrible. I would have needed a skip otherwise for what I've now got into three large wheelie bins !!

You're never to old to learn new tricks.

You sir have a lot more patience than I do. I bought a Mcculloch garden shredder over 3 years ago with the idea of never having to buy garden mulch ever again. The shredder works well and is good, but boy are they slow and noisy, hours later and only one bag of garden mulch to show, hence the shredder hasn't been out of the shed in two years. Might be time to see if my son would like to earn some extra pocket money!

SRSemenza · « **Reply #26 on:** August 16, 2015, 09:11 AM »

Quote from: Tinker on August 15, 2015, 08:25 AM

I have been behind the times. I was not aware that there are battery type chainsaws. VERRRRYYYYY interesting.

For years, i have using all sizes of chainsaws. the problem has been that the longer i am 39, the harder it gets for me to start them, to say nothing about my back pains from holding on to them. I always carry a chainsaw in my truck when out snow plowing. That and an armstrong powered snow plow with a hickory boom. For years, i carried a small Echo that was adequate for emergencies and for tree work. It always started on first pull in warm weather. In the cold, i sometimes need three pulls before it made noise on its own. The last time i took it into the shop for repair, parts were no longer available (I think i had been using that saw since I was 37 ) I replaced it with a slightly larger model of the same brand. That saw I cannot start in the cold weather. Most of the problem with that is that since I turned 39, it is impossible for me to pull the cord once the temp drops below 50º. I can not find much snow to push when temp gets above 50º.

Even when i store the saw at the floor heater in my truck, i can no longer pull that cord once the cold air hits (the saw/not me).

I will start looking into cordless chain saws, or even reciprocating pruning saws. I plan to keep working until i am 40, so a cordless saw will be handy to me for at least a few more years. maybe even after retirement.

This discussion has been very enlightening so far. Thanks guys.
Tinker

You may want to have a look at the Stihl saws with the Easy2Start feature. It has been out for quite a few years now. They are the same model saws as regular Stihl line saws but with a slow pull cord. I don't have one but I was checking them out when saw shopping. I saw the star demonstrated. Just draw the cord out slowly and don't pull it fast. I am sure an internet search will find some reviews and videos.

Seth

Wuffles · « **Reply #27 on:** August 16, 2015, 09:17 AM »

Quote from: SRSemenza on August 16, 2015, 09:11 AM

Quote from: Tinker on August 15, 2015, 08:25 AM
I have been behind the times. I was not aware that there are battery type chainsaws. VERRRRYYYYY interesting.

For years, i have using all sizes of chainsaws. the problem has been that the longer i am 39, the harder it gets for me to start them, to say nothing about my back pains from holding on to them. I always carry a chainsaw in my truck when out snow plowing. That and an armstrong powered snow plow with a hickory boom. For years, i carried a small Echo that was adequate for emergencies and for tree work. It always started on first pull in warm weather. In the cold, i sometimes need three pulls before it made noise on its own. The last time i took it into the shop for repair, parts were no longer available (I think i had been using that saw since I was 37 ) I replaced it with a slightly larger model of the same brand. That saw I cannot start in the cold weather. Most of the problem with that is that since I turned 39, it is impossible for me to pull the cord once the temp drops below 50º. I can not find much snow to push when temp gets above 50º.

Even when i store the saw at the floor heater in my truck, i can no longer pull that cord once the cold air hits (the saw/not me).

I will start looking into cordless chain saws, or even reciprocating pruning saws. I plan to keep working until i am 40, so a cordless saw will be handy to me for at least a few more years. maybe even after retirement.

This discussion has been very enlightening so far. Thanks guys.
Tinker

You may want to have a look at the Stihl saws with the Easy2Start feature. It has been out for quite a few years now. They are the same model saws as regular Stihl line saws but with a slow pull cord. I don't have one but I was checking them out when saw shopping. I saw the star demonstrated. Just draw the cord out slowly and don't pull it fast. I am sure an internet search will find some reviews and videos.

Seth

They feel like they have a mind of their own though, especially when you have other Stihl tools with the conventional system and always go to pull the same way. Pull it, nothing happens, then a second later it tries to fire up, like you woke it up with the pull and it has a think about it.

Tinker · « **Reply #28 on:** August 16, 2015, 09:32 AM »

Quote from: Wuffles on August 16, 2015, 09:17 AM

Quote from: SRSemenza on August 16, 2015, 09:11 AM
Quote from: Tinker on August 15, 2015, 08:25 AM
I have been behind the times. I was not aware that there are battery type chainsaws. VERRRRYYYYY interesting.

For years, i have using all sizes of chainsaws. the problem has been that the longer i am 39, the harder it gets for me to start them, to say nothing about my back pains from holding on to them. I always carry a chainsaw in my truck when out snow plowing. That and an armstrong powered snow plow with a hickory boom. For years, i carried a small Echo that was adequate for emergencies and for tree work. It always started on first pull in warm weather. In the cold, i sometimes need three pulls before it made noise on its own. The last time i took it into the shop for repair, parts were no longer available (I think i had been using that saw since I was 37 ) I replaced it with a slightly larger model of the same brand. That saw I cannot start in the cold weather. Most of the problem with that is that since I turned 39, it is impossible for me to pull the cord once the temp drops below 50º. I can not find much snow to push when temp gets above 50º.

Even when i store the saw at the floor heater in my truck, i can no longer pull that cord once the cold air hits (the saw/not me).

I will start looking into cordless chain saws, or even reciprocating pruning saws. I plan to keep working until i am 40, so a cordless saw will be handy to me for at least a few more years. maybe even after retirement.

This discussion has been very enlightening so far. Thanks guys.
Tinker

You may want to have a look at the Stihl saws with the Easy2Start feature. It has been out for quite a few years now. They are the same model saws as regular Stihl line saws but with a slow pull cord. I don't have one but I was checking them out when saw shopping. I saw the star demonstrated. Just draw the cord out slowly and don't pull it fast. I am sure an internet search will find some reviews and videos.

Seth

They feel like they have a mind of their own though, especially when you have other Stihl tools with the conventional system and always go to pull the same way. Pull it, nothing happens, then a second later it tries to fire up, like you woke it up with the pull and it has a think about it.

@SRSemenza
Thanks
My equipment guru handles Huskies and Jonserods. He has a couple of saws that you can elieve the back pressure on to start. I have been thinking of getting one, but that wood just eat into my Festoy budget. I can live without another chainsaw. I always carry a armstrong powered pruning saw with two different sized blades. that saw never talks back when i try to start it. Oh, my shoulder sometimes keeps reminding me of my folly for a few days, but I'm used to that

@Wuffles
when it comes to Chain saws, i don't want to be surprised. they are dangerous enough. There are two tools that i think rental companies should take off of their inventory to all but the very experienced. Chainsaws and ladders. both are simple to operate when used correctly. Both can be just as simple to operate >>> wrongly. Both, when carelessness is a portion of the operation, can become killers.
Thanks for the heads up
Tinker

Cheese · « **Reply #29 on:** August 16, 2015, 09:48 AM »

Quote from: Mark Enomoto on August 15, 2015, 04:17 PM

The Stihl top handle NAINA till 2016 and NAIH (not available in Hawaii) till who knows when :-) Like lots of homeowners, I don't use the tools enough to keep them running enough, though when I need them its often a question of IF it will start. Using canned non-ethanol gas is key as well as running the tool dry before storing it...

I had 5 or 6 Stihl lawn tools which meant 5 or 6 tanks to fill and 5 or 6 tanks to drain for the season. Also each tool had its own unique starting procedure. I decided to eliminate this foolishness and purchased one KombiSystem KM 130 motor and then the attachments that I needed. Too easy...

I agree with the non-ethanol gas issue, luckily there is a local station that sells the stuff year round. It's the only stuff I use for petrol powered equipment.

Also about 2-3 weeks before the season ends, I start to use Stihl MotoMix premixed fuel in the KM 130. It's made with 92 octane ethanol free gas and has a shelf life of 2 years after it's opened. That way, during the winter when I use the equipment less often, the tank contains gas that I know will not go bad.

SRSemenza · « **Reply #30 on:** August 16, 2015, 10:49 AM »

Quote from: Cheese on August 16, 2015, 09:48 AM

I had 5 or 6 Stihl lawn tools which meant 5 or 6 tanks to fill and 5 or 6 tanks to drain for the season. Also each tool had its own unique starting procedure. I decided to eliminate this foolishness and purchased one KombiSystem KM 130 motor and then the attachments that I needed. Too easy...

I agree with the non-ethanol gas issue, luckily there is a local station that sells the stuff year round. It's the only stuff I use for petrol powered equipment.

Also about 2-3 weeks before the season ends, I start to use Stihl MotoMix premixed fuel in the KM 130. It's made with 92 octane ethanol free gas and has a shelf life of 2 years after it's opened. That way, during the winter when I use the equipment less often, the tank contains gas that I know will not go bad.

I have KM110 with a bunch of attachments. Works great , starts great.

Sorry to take this away from the battery discussion. I have looked into the Stihl battery system too, thinking about the handiness and convenience factor.

Seth

johninthecamper · « **Reply #31 on:** August 16, 2015, 04:58 PM »

if a stihl product doesn't start quickly &easily, it has to do with maintenance.

Peter Halle · « **Reply #32 on:** August 16, 2015, 06:29 PM »

As someone who has used them professionally and also owns quite a few I would offer the following: USUALLY is do to lack of maintenance. There are exceptions to the rule.

Peter

Kev · « **Reply #33 on:** August 17, 2015, 03:27 AM »

Quote from: Peter Halle on August 16, 2015, 06:29 PM

As someone who has used them professionally and also owns quite a few I would offer the following: USUALLY is do to lack of maintenance. There are exceptions to the rule.

Peter

I pulled my 2 Stoke Stihl MS170 out yesterday. Cleaned it, checked the spark plug, fresh fuel and it started on the second pull (probably on the shelf for 2 years). Stuck a new chain on it and put it back on the shelf

With my new electric stuff it's not going to see any use, but I'm just going to keep it as a spare - perfectly good and worth very little to me if I sell it.

Untidy Shop · « **Reply #34 on:** August 17, 2015, 04:48 AM »

Quote from: Kev on August 17, 2015, 03:27 AM

Quote from: Peter Halle on August 16, 2015, 06:29 PM
As someone who has used them professionally and also owns quite a few I would offer the following: USUALLY is do to lack of maintenance. There are exceptions to the rule.

Peter

I pulled my 2 Stoke Stihl MS170 out yesterday. Cleaned it, checked the spark plug, fresh fuel and it started on the second pull (probably on the shelf for 2 years). Stuck a new chain on it and put it back on the shelf

With my new electric stuff it's not going to see any use, but I'm just going to keep it as a spare - perfectly good and worth very little to me if I sell it.

Kev, given you put it back on the shelf, I assume that you emptied the fuel tank, restarted and ran out any fuel in the carburettor.
@Kev

Kev · « **Reply #35 on:** August 17, 2015, 05:00 AM »

Quote from: Untidy Shop on August 17, 2015, 04:48 AM

Quote from: Kev on August 17, 2015, 03:27 AM
Quote from: Peter Halle on August 16, 2015, 06:29 PM
As someone who has used them professionally and also owns quite a few I would offer the following: USUALLY is do to lack of maintenance. There are exceptions to the rule.

Peter

I pulled my 2 Stoke Stihl MS170 out yesterday. Cleaned it, checked the spark plug, fresh fuel and it started on the second pull (probably on the shelf for 2 years). Stuck a new chain on it and put it back on the shelf

With my new electric stuff it's not going to see any use, but I'm just going to keep it as a spare - perfectly good and worth very little to me if I sell it.

Kev, given you put it back on the shelf, I assume that you emptied the fuel tank, restarted and ran out any fuel in the carburettor.
@Kev

Nooop ... just like I didn't last time!

Kev · « **Reply #36 on:** August 17, 2015, 08:14 AM »

Just a bit more of a rave about the Stihl 36V chainsaws with the narrow chain .. they cut REALLY, REALLY well and the batteries last ages. The other surprise is the precision you suddenly have with the light weight and fine cut. Now I wish they'd bring out a serious 72V mower (taking two of the 180 36V batteries), that'd be awesome! (their 36V mower isn't in the same class as the other cordless tools ... actually I'm still on the fence with the trimmer too, I suppose I may need more time with it)

So all I'd need now is a couple of Teslas, that way I'd be done with petrol completely

Cheese · « **Reply #37 on:** August 17, 2015, 08:34 AM »

Quote from: Kev on August 17, 2015, 08:14 AM

Just a bit more of a rave about the Stihl 36V chainsaws with the narrow chain .. they cut REALLY, REALLY well and the batteries last ages. The other surprise is the precision you suddenly have with the light weight and fine cut....

So all I'd need now is a couple of Teslas, that way I'd be done with petrol completely

So I wonder if the long run time is because they use a brushless motor? Any idea?

How much lighter is it than your MS 170?

Kev · « **Reply #38 on:** August 17, 2015, 09:20 AM »

Quote from: Cheese on August 17, 2015, 08:34 AM

Quote from: Kev on August 17, 2015, 08:14 AM
Just a bit more of a rave about the Stihl 36V chainsaws with the narrow chain .. they cut REALLY, REALLY well and the batteries last ages. The other surprise is the precision you suddenly have with the light weight and fine cut....

So all I'd need now is a couple of Teslas, that way I'd be done with petrol completely

So I wonder if the long run time is because they use a brushless motor? Any idea?

How much lighter is it than your MS 170?

They are brushless motors. My 170 is quite old, I would have said at least a kilo lighter. The little arborist one is feather light.

I'll put them on the scales with batteries in them if I get a chance tomorrow.

I actually think the light and narrow chain creates less kick when you throttle up, making them feel a lot lighter to use.

cliffp · « **Reply #39 on:** August 22, 2015, 04:26 PM »

I took delivery of my Stihl gear yesterday (everything Kev bought except I didn't get the blower or long reach hedge trimmer).

I think the quality of the tools is excellent and the design is very well thought out.

The chainsaw cuts at least as well as my mains powered McCulloch 1650W chainsaw but is much lighter and with the convenience of being cordless. It is very ergonomic - I can see myself using it a lot more than my old chainsaw (I often used a reciprocating Bosch saw for cutting small branches but this Stihl blows that out of the water).

The pole pruner is amazing. It is great fun giving your trees a bit of topiary, tweaking the shape of it without having to climb ladders. I found that on many occasions the cut off bits would be difficult to pull down because they were tangled up with other foliage so you may still need a ladder to pull them down (or maybe rig up a pole with hook). This tool is extremely well made and the telescopic pole looks to be very well engineered and robust - suitable for professional use I would say. The chainsaw (on the end of the pole) cuts like a knife through butter.

I didn't use the hedge trimmer much but it cuts very well (better than my Bosch mains powered one).

I was very impressed with the Strimmer. It is fairly light but very powerful (I would say slightly more powerful than my Viking corded one). It ripped through everthing I tested it on including quite thick tree saplings (5 mm or so). If weeds were growing on soil on paving slabs the strimmer would shift the weeds and the soil without hesitation. I didn't try this rigorously but you can use it for edging by rotating the handle onto the opposite side of the shaft and holding it upside down. I know that Kev was a bit underwhelmed with this but I found this to be one of my favourite tools out of the Stihl collection.

I found the battery life to be excellent (AP300). Today I did about 20 mins of strimming, made about 30 pruning cuts with the pole pruner, cut up the branches with the chainsaw (15 mins) and did about 15 mins of hedge trimming and only used half the charge in the battery.

I will be ordering the BGA85 blower next week, such is my satisfaction with this gear.

Thanks to Kev for taking the time to bring these products to our (my) attention!

Kev · « **Reply #40 on:** August 22, 2015, 07:56 PM »

Glad you're not disappointed

You'll like the blower too, but you will notice how the blower chews through the battery. I'm jealous of your AP300 ... I don't know what it is with Australia and batteries ... we only get the AP115, AP180 and AR900 at the moment. Consequently I've got 3 AP180's now. Fortunately the charge quickly.

Kev · « **Reply #41 on:** August 23, 2015, 06:43 AM »

So .. just upgraded my cordless MSA200 chainsaw to TCT chain. The TCT chain is 3/8, so the upgrade required new:

Bar
Chain
Sprocket
Chain cover

I'll keep my little MS170 petrol in case of a zombie apocalypse, but the MSA200 seems to match it. Maybe I should get a Stihl Magnum (in case of really big zombies)

Untidy Shop · « **Reply #42 on:** August 23, 2015, 08:29 AM »

Quote from: Kev on August 23, 2015, 06:43 AM

So .. just upgraded my cordless MSA200 chainsaw to TCT chain. . . . . . . . . . .,. Maybe I should get a Stihl Magnum (in case of really big zombies)

Mmmm, Kev, this addiction to Orange Aid could be even greater than
the one to Green!

Just note that the TCT chains are not a DIY sharpening option, and even the professional timber cutters around here dislike them as they cannot be easily sharpened out in the field.

Despite this I have two of them for my Wood Boss and yes they certainly do last a lot longer cutting storm damaged/pruning Gum and Wattle Trees (the latter very tough on chains) before I need my dealer to sharpen them.

@Kev

johninthecamper · « **Reply #43 on:** August 23, 2015, 09:09 AM »

I drank orange koolaid way before chugging on the green.
at one time I had more than one of everything in the pro line.somethings three identical(climbing saws).never was able to wear anything out,just drop or smash it beyond justifiable repair,one of the first ones I got has won the lifespan lotto,1988,with 15 yrs of daily use."stihl" use it monthly

johninthecamper · « **Reply #44 on:** August 23, 2015, 10:32 AM »

buying the bench mounted sharpener was one of the best purchases.if the chain even just looked dull,swap it out with another,plenty of spares on the truck.I bought rolls of the sizes I used,made my own.that meant a whole bunch of chain was around,easier to make a new one than sharpen a dull one.stihl brand chain was far superior to other brands.
the sprocket is one very frequently overlooked maintenance item for the occasional user to inspect,along with the bar itself

cliffp · « **Reply #45 on:** August 23, 2015, 03:24 PM »

Had another days productive gardening with the pole pruner and the strimmer. I hacked down as much stuff with the pruner in half an hour as my wife managed to achieve in a day last year.

It does seem strange that the latest batteries are not available in Australia. It can't be a safety issue - maybe Stihl want to test them in a limited sized market in case there are problems?

The blower is definitely next on the list. I don't think I do enough chainsawing to justify a TCT chain.

Kev, you'll have to buy the bench mounted chain sharpener. I see you can get diamond wheels to sharpen your new chain.

johninthecamper · « **Reply #46 on:** August 23, 2015, 07:18 PM »

carbide chain is only better for roots,stumps&dirty cuts.super expensive to buy and sharpen with dismal performance in normal cuts.

Kev · « **Reply #47 on:** August 23, 2015, 07:57 PM »

Quote from: johninthecamper on August 23, 2015, 07:18 PM

carbide chain is only better for roots,stumps&dirty cuts.super expensive to buy and sharpen with dismal performance in normal cuts.

Specifically got one to attack a stump that is low and grew in (well, through) a large plastic pot. The heavier bar, chain, etc in 3/8 over the 1/4 is very noticeable when introduced to the light 36V chainsaws ... but it does cut extremely well so far.

SRSemenza · « **Reply #48 on:** August 23, 2015, 11:23 PM »

Quote from: cliffp on August 23, 2015, 03:24 PM

Had another days productive gardening with the pole pruner and the strimmer. I hacked down as much stuff with the pruner in half an hour as my wife managed to achieve in a day last year.

Yeah the pole pruner is great (I have a gas model)! BUT be careful you can make a big mess to pick up real fast. One of the first times I used it I spent maybe an hour cutting all around the property. When I got done I looked around and thought Oh cr..

Took me about six hours the next day to clean it all up.

Seth

Cheese · « **Reply #49 on:** August 23, 2015, 11:47 PM »

FWIW...keep an eye on the chain oil supply reservoir as it tends to be depleted faster than you'd think.

Kev · « **Reply #50 on:** August 24, 2015, 12:02 AM »

Quote from: Cheese on August 23, 2015, 11:47 PM

FWIW...keep an eye on the chain oil supply reservoir as it tends to be depleted faster than you'd think.

You're not wrong ... I don't think the oil lasts as long as the battery

Cheese · « **Reply #51 on:** August 24, 2015, 12:11 AM »

Ya, I've got the petrol version of the trimmer and i was surprised as to how much oil the auto luber dispensed. Two tanks of gas....one tank of oil.

Thanks for the original post...as much as I enjoy the gas versions...I'm going to check out the battery variant.
It's the wave of the future...

cliffp · « **Reply #52 on:** August 24, 2015, 02:52 AM »

I noticed the oil levels were going down very quickly - wishing I'd bought 5 litres rather than 1 litre.

The mistake I made with the pole pruner was not checking the tension of the chain - it came off yesterday, luckily it didn't cause any damage.

Tinker · « **Reply #53 on:** August 24, 2015, 03:38 AM »

Quote from: SRSemenza on August 23, 2015, 11:23 PM

Quote from: cliffp on August 23, 2015, 03:24 PM
Had another days productive gardening with the pole pruner and the strimmer. I hacked down as much stuff with the pruner in half an hour as my wife managed to achieve in a day last year.

Yeah the pole pruner is great (I have a gas model)! BUT be careful you can make a big mess to pick up real fast. One of the first times I used it I spent maybe an hour cutting all around the property. When I got done I looked around and thought Oh cr.. Took me about six hours the next day to clean it all up.

Seth

@SRSemenza, I don't think you are cutting real navy stuff with the pole pruner. You should put your Grasshopper to good use along with the pruner. When i do a pruning job, large or small, i use my Skag to clean up the brush. A few minutes with the mower and a few minutes with the sweep rake, and the mess has disappeared. You would be surprised how large diameter twigs/branches can disappear in a hurry with no damage to the mower blades.
Tinker

Holmz · « **Reply #54 on:** August 24, 2015, 05:53 AM »

Quote from: cliffp on August 23, 2015, 03:24 PM

...
The blower is definitely next on the list. I don't think I do enough chainsawing to justify a TCT chain.
...

I got an 86c, which is a blower and it goes in reverse with a bag to suck and mulch the leaves.
It is also possible to blow gently into a pile, but in a garden bed, or around a pool it is easier to go straight into the bag.
It doesn't have a HEPA and the dust cloud is impressive.

Quote from: cliffp on August 24, 2015, 02:52 AM

I noticed the oil levels were going down very quickly - wishing I'd bought 5 litres rather than 1 litre.
...

I started putting the used car oil into the chain oil...

Untidy Shop · « **Reply #55 on:** August 24, 2015, 07:48 AM »

http://forestry.about.com/od/chainsaws/f/cs_baroil.htm

It's your bar and chain Holmz, but I use Stihl Chain oil.

@Holmz

Kev · « **Reply #56 on:** August 24, 2015, 08:22 AM »

Quote from: Untidy Shop on August 24, 2015, 07:48 AM

http://forestry.about.com/od/chainsaws/f/cs_baroil.htm

It's your bar and chain Holmz, but I use Stihl Chain oil.

@Holmz

It's my bar chain, it'll fry if i want to ...

... well you make the lyrics work better

@Holmz @Untidy Shop

Holmz · « **Reply #57 on:** August 24, 2015, 08:39 AM »

When the shops are closed and one needs oil then one does what is required.

cliffp · « **Reply #58 on:** August 24, 2015, 09:09 AM »

Quote

I got an 86c, which is a blower and it goes in reverse with a bag to suck and mulch the leaves.
It is also possible to blow gently into a pile, but in a garden bed, or around a pool it is easier to go straight into the bag.
It doesn't have a HEPA and the dust cloud is impressive.

I've got the Viking corded version of this and like it a lot except for the wire. I was thinking that if the battery version was good at blowing the leaves into piles, I could use the Viking in suction mode to mulch them (I find it tedious to switch between the two modes).

I've got some unused engine oil from my old BMW 535d, I might check its viscosity to see if it'd work?

Cheese · « **Reply #59 on:** August 24, 2015, 09:54 AM »

Quote from: cliffp on August 24, 2015, 02:52 AM

The mistake I made with the pole pruner was not checking the tension of the chain - it came off yesterday, luckily it didn't cause any damage.

The chain's new so the initial stretch happens in the first couple of hours, after that it slows down. Just like putting a new chain on a motorcycle, drive it 20-30 miles and then readjust it.

SRSemenza · « **Reply #60 on:** August 24, 2015, 10:07 AM »

Quote from: Tinker on August 24, 2015, 03:38 AM

Quote from: SRSemenza on August 23, 2015, 11:23 PM
Quote from: cliffp on August 23, 2015, 03:24 PM
Had another days productive gardening with the pole pruner and the strimmer. I hacked down as much stuff with the pruner in half an hour as my wife managed to achieve in a day last year.

Yeah the pole pruner is great (I have a gas model)! BUT be careful you can make a big mess to pick up real fast. One of the first times I used it I spent maybe an hour cutting all around the property. When I got done I looked around and thought Oh cr.. Took me about six hours the next day to clean it all up.

Seth

@SRSemenza, I don't think you are cutting real navy stuff with the pole pruner. You should put your Grasshopper to good use along with the pruner. When i do a pruning job, large or small, i use my Skag to clean up the brush. A few minutes with the mower and a few minutes with the sweep rake, and the mess has disappeared. You would be surprised how large diameter twigs/branches can disappear in a hurry with no damage to the mower blades.
Tinker

Yes, I do use the Grasshopper to get rid of a lot of the twigs now. But that first time was a lot 2" -4" limbs from about 20 big pine trees.

It is mostly smaller stuff now. I just got the hedge trimmer attachment and use that for the forsythia , willow tree and such. That debris was quickly windrowed with a rake and then ground up with the Grasshopper. I try to stay under 1" for Grasshopper "shredding".

Seth

johninthecamper · « **Reply #61 on:** August 24, 2015, 11:29 AM »

Quote from: Holmz on August 24, 2015, 08:39 AM

When the shops are closed and one needs oil then one does what is required.

30wt mixed with kerosene

Tinker · « **Reply #62 on:** August 24, 2015, 08:17 PM »

@SRSemenza You can shred the smaller stuff off of the larger branches if yo can get the heavy to be flat of the ground. I have a bunch of slightly bent blades for my Skag. i will put them on when i am getting into heavier branches. It does take a little preparation.

I even cut brush and briars with the mower. As long as the stems are not over 3/4" to 1", I can do quite a large area in an hour or so. When mowing brush, I wait until blades are due for sharpening or ready for new. I do the brush before i change the blades. that way I don't ruin brand new blades.

I am going to talk to my equipment guru and see what he knows about battery trimmers. He handles Husky and Josenrod. I battery operated trimmers and chainsaws are on the horizon, I will wait til he handles. If they are not, I will look into the Stihl's. I like the idea of not having to make a lot of noise. I try to do that work almost as soon as daylite. Some people think that is still nite time.

Also, in winter, i have to keep my chainsaw close to the truck heater. I sometimes need to cut a few branches before i can get into a driveway, or a roadway to plow. If the saw is not warm, i cannot even pull the cord. It's funny how much resistance there is with the new saws. Way back when i was 38, i did not have such problems.

Tinker

Cheese · « **Reply #63 on:** August 24, 2015, 10:11 PM »

Quote from: Tinker on August 24, 2015, 08:17 PM

@SRSemenza
If the saw is not warm, i cannot even pull the cord. It's funny how much resistance there is with the new saws. Way back when i was 38, i did not have such problems.

Tinker

In the interest of reducing the weight of the equipment, manufacturers are fitting smaller displacement engines on their tools. This reduces the weight and also increases the fuel economy (probably does something for the emissions they have to achieve too). However, some of these small engines don't quite have the power that's needed, so the manufacturers increase the compression ratio of the engine, which can significantly increase the HP if done correctly. The down side is that anyone that is 38 or older, will have a hard time trying to pull start the engine. Stihl is noted for this...I have a Stihl TS 400 concrete saw that is notorious for this behavior.

Way back when I was 38, I had a BSA 441 Victor motorcycle that incorporated a compression release. You'd pull in the compression release and slowly move the kick starter so that the engine was slightly past TDC (top dead center) release the compression release and give it a good hard kick. It would usually start on 1 kick if done properly. If not done correctly it would kick back and bend your knee/leg into a position that would make you assume your leg was broken, or it would literally send you over the tank and onto the ground. Hmmm...that was in 1966...guess in some areas we haven't progressed much.

Tinker · « **Reply #64 on:** August 25, 2015, 07:34 AM »

Quote from: Cheese on August 24, 2015, 10:11 PM

Quote from: Tinker on August 24, 2015, 08:17 PM
@SRSemenza
If the saw is not warm, i cannot even pull the cord. It's funny how much resistance there is with the new saws. Way back when i was 38, i did not have such problems.

Tinker

In the interest of reducing the weight of the equipment, manufacturers are fitting smaller displacement engines on their tools. This reduces the weight and also increases the fuel economy (probably does something for the emissions they have to achieve too). However, some of these small engines don't quite have the power that's needed, so the manufacturers increase the compression ratio of the engine, which can significantly increase the HP if done correctly. The down side is that anyone that is 38 or older, will have a hard time trying to pull start the engine. Stihl is noted for this...I have a Stihl TS 400 concrete saw that is notorious for this behavior.

Way back when I was 38, I had a BSA 441 Victor motorcycle that incorporated a compression release. You'd pull in the compression release and slowly move the kick starter so that the engine was slightly past TDC (top dead center) release the compression release and give it a good hard kick. It would usually start on 1 kick if done properly. If not done correctly it would kick back and bend your knee/leg into a position that would make you assume your leg was broken, or it would literally send you over the tank and onto the ground. Hmmm...that was in 1966...guess in some areas we haven't progressed much.

@Cheese I first learned to operate various pieces of equipment back in the early and mid '40's 1940's that is. i was living on my great uncle's farm. when i first arrived, we had all horse drawn machinery. All i had to do was wait for an adult to harness and "hitch" the team and then i could "drive" for some operations. Along about 1940, or 41, we got a Farmall F-12 tractor with the iron lug wheels. I guess i was about 13, maybe only 12, when i was first allowed to drive that monster. Actually, in that time, the F-12 was the smallest of the line; but to shift, i had to slide down so I was sitting on top of the transmission, hang onto the steering wheel with my left hand stretched far above my head and using my right hand at about my chin to operate the gearshift lever. I was stretched out almost flat on my back as I would be pushing for all i was worth on the clutch. With those old "box" gears, I had to bring the tractor to a dead stop before shifting. It could have been somewhat dangerous for me hanging on to the steering wheel. The front wheels were tricycle type with iron rib around the iron wheel. The slightest bump could send the steering wheel into a spin that could break my skinny arms. I learned early on that one never wraps his hand around the steering wheel with thumb inside the arc of the wheel. When hitting a bump, as the wheel would spin and your thumb locked against a spoke could break thumb and wrist. I still, to this day, even with power steering, find myself hanging on to steering wheels with my thumb on top of the wheel, never inside where the spoke can whack me if i hit a bump. Of course, that never happens with today's vehicles. When my kids first learned to drive, some vehicles, including my trucks, did not have power steering. even tho the improvements were such that kick back was long a thing of the past, i taught both of them to never wrap your thump under the rim. They never learned, and probably will go to their graves thinking, "My Old Man was a total nut."

By the time i was allowed to crank that old F-12, I was totally into the habit of not locking my thumbs around a steering wheel. I was instructed as a very strict rule that it was even more important when starting that tractor. you see, the self starter was actually a hand crank that was inserted directly into the front of the engine driveshaft. If the engine fired early, the crank handle would kick back with the potential to break, not only a thumb and wrist, but an elbow and possibly dislocate a shoulder. It was also very important to be sure the tractor was out of gear when hand cranking. I knew of one person in the local area who was buried at a very young age when he pulled up on the crank, (incidentally, you never push down on that crank. A short pull/snap up with never going all the way to top of the spin was as important as not wrapping one's thumb), the huge tractor jumped ahead. He tried to get to the shift, but was flattened.

Anyhow, your, @ Cheese, reply brought back some great (and not so great) memories of "the Good Ol' Days" Any body who says "they just don't make them like they useter" just ain't been around the "useter"

Tinker

Cheese · « **Reply #65 on:** August 25, 2015, 09:19 AM »

@Tinker
Good story, if someone nowadays saw a young Tinker driving a tractor as you describe, they'd have the local authorities hauling your great uncle to the slammer for child endangerment.

Interesting though that in both cases whether starting the Farmall or the Beezer, a short quick movement was needed to get the engine turned over and after that the limb used (arm or leg) had to be removed immediately from the area or serious damage could be the outcome.

BTW I'm a fan of all old tractors, been thinking about restoring a Ford 8N for the last 15 years or so.

Tinker · « **Reply #66 on:** August 25, 2015, 11:52 AM »

@ Cheese
I taught my son the same way. I did post a pic somewhere on the FOG showing him at 5yr old operating my backhoe mounted on my skid steer. He was so small, he had to rest his feet on the valve bank. He went thru many hours of his dad hanging on to him before he was allowed to operate alone. Son taught grandson the same way. But somebody did blow the whistle on him. I was taught, my son was taught and my grandson was taught how to properly operate with safety in mind. all three of us were taught and not allowed to operate until we showed respect for the machines, and of more importance, for our own and others safety. I had the good fortune to have grown up (for 6 formative years) on a small dairy farm. You live with thoughts of safety. you end up expanding your horizons very quickly. If more kids today had such advantages, there would be far less drugs problems and far less delinquency. times were tough financially in those days; but the experiences generated responsibilities. Today, such experiences generate whistle blowers.

Tinker

Holmz · « **Reply #67 on:** August 25, 2015, 05:10 PM »

There are always people willing to lend their sage advice on child rearing, whether in your area or with respect to European ways.

Cheese · « **Reply #68 on:** August 26, 2015, 12:26 AM »

@Tinker
You're discussion is something that transcends the internet, I have so much to say and yet I'm speechless...political correctness, a pox on society. I may be a product of my generation but that's ok...I think I have an easier time living within my skin than some from other generations. Soul searching is the correct terminology and I perform it every day as would anyone who has a conscience.

Enough...back to the Farmall and the Beezer...and happier times.

Tinker · « **Reply #69 on:** August 26, 2015, 03:37 AM »

As I was driving along with my Kabota Tractor/Loader yesterday, I came around a corner and there was a man trimming a high hedge with a Stihl pole trimmer. If it had not been for my reading of this thread, i would not have given it a second thought. The trimmer was making absolutely no noise. a big pile of clippings was showing on the ground all around the hedge and I could see the blade was quickly adding more clippings as it was being drawn across the top of the hedge. BUT>>> no noise. It was a narrow road and a tight corner, so I could not stop, but I now know cordless electric trimmers are around. I will be on the lookout from now on. I am leaving for work a little early this morning and will be at my Guru's shop as he opens. I will check with him if he knows about battery op tools on the Husky horizon. Or Jonsored.
Tinker

Cheese · « **Reply #70 on:** May 21, 2023, 11:26 AM »

I purchased the Stihl RMA 510 V battery powered lawnmower recently. It was ordered July 2022 and finally arrived in March 2023. I picked it up the last week of April and gave it a spin...impressed...waaaay impressed.

Hold in a button and squeeze a lever & it starts, squeeze another lever and the rear drive wheels engage and you're off. It couldn't be easier to use. It also has a continuously variable lever to adjust the speed of the mower from .6 mph to 2.8 mph.

I've always had either Lawnboy or Toro lawnmowers and never had a complaint. However, after using the Stihl 3 times, I'd never go back to a gas mower.

Really easy to push if you want to because all 4 wheels rotate on a pair of ball bearings. Tons of power and it cuts the grass faster and better than the old gas powered mowers. The lawn now looks more manicured.

The entire lawn is cut on a single charge of the AP 500 S battery and the battery is charged within 45 minutes on the AL 500 charger. The AL 500 charger is like an Air Stream charger in that it uses an internal fan to cool down the battery and shorten the charging time.
The AP 500 S is a 36 volt, 9.4 Ah battery which gives 337 Wh. That's enough juice to run a Stihl MSA 300 chain saw continuously for about 30 minutes. The MSA 300 uses a .325" pitch chain, the same size chain as the Wood Boss & Yard Boss saws.

https://www.stihlusa.com/products/lawn-mowers/push-mowers/rma510v/

Tinker · « **Reply #71 on:** May 24, 2023, 05:40 PM »

Quote from: SRSemenza on August 24, 2015, 10:07 AM

Quote from: Tinker on August 24, 2015, 03:38 AM
Quote from: SRSemenza on August 23, 2015, 11:23 PM
Quote from: cliffp on August 23, 2015, 03:24 PM
Had another days productive gardening with the pole pruner and the strimmer. I hacked down as much stuff with the pruner in half an hour as my wife managed to achieve in a day last year.

Yeah the pole pruner is great (I have a gas model)! BUT be careful you can make a big mess to pick up real fast. One of the first times I used it I spent maybe an hour cutting all around the property. When I got done I looked around and thought Oh cr.. Took me about six hours the next day to clean it all up.

Seth

@SRSemenza, I don't think you are cutting real HEAVY stuff with the pole pruner. You should put your Grasshopper to good use along with the pruner. When i do a pruning job, large or small, i use my Skag to clean up the brush. A few minutes with the mower and a few minutes with the sweep rake, and the mess has disappeared. You would be surprised how large diameter twigs/branches can disappear in a hurry with no damage to the mower blades.
Tinker

Yes, I do use the Grasshopper to get rid of a lot of the twigs now. But that first time was a lot 2" -4" limbs from about 20 big pine trees. It is mostly smaller stuff now. I just got the hedge trimmer attachment and use that for the forsythia , willow tree and such. That debris was quickly windrowed with a rake and then ground up with the Grasshopper. I try to stay under 1" for Grasshopper "shredding".

Seth

@seth I forgot the new blades yesterday while reading the conversation. Do you know about the "rockface blades". They have extra welding along the cutting edge. They are also made with spring steel (I think). You can mow over rocks without damage. When I started using the blades, I get a whole season with them on my Skag. I have a job where I destroy blades with so many rocks. I get awhole season out of the blades.
Tinker

SRSemenza · « **Reply #72 on:** May 24, 2023, 11:44 PM »

Quote from: Tinker on May 24, 2023, 05:40 PM

Quote from: SRSemenza on August 24, 2015, 10:07 AM
Quote from: Tinker on August 24, 2015, 03:38 AM
Quote from: SRSemenza on August 23, 2015, 11:23 PM
Quote from: cliffp on August 23, 2015, 03:24 PM
Had another days productive gardening with the pole pruner and the strimmer. I hacked down as much stuff with the pruner in half an hour as my wife managed to achieve in a day last year.

Yeah the pole pruner is great (I have a gas model)! BUT be careful you can make a big mess to pick up real fast. One of the first times I used it I spent maybe an hour cutting all around the property. When I got done I looked around and thought Oh cr.. Took me about six hours the next day to clean it all up.

Seth

@SRSemenza, I don't think you are cutting real HEAVY stuff with the pole pruner. You should put your Grasshopper to good use along with the pruner. When i do a pruning job, large or small, i use my Skag to clean up the brush. A few minutes with the mower and a few minutes with the sweep rake, and the mess has disappeared. You would be surprised how large diameter twigs/branches can disappear in a hurry with no damage to the mower blades.
Tinker

Yes, I do use the Grasshopper to get rid of a lot of the twigs now. But that first time was a lot 2" -4" limbs from about 20 big pine trees. It is mostly smaller stuff now. I just got the hedge trimmer attachment and use that for the forsythia , willow tree and such. That debris was quickly windrowed with a rake and then ground up with the Grasshopper. I try to stay under 1" for Grasshopper "shredding".

Seth

@seth I forgot the new blades yesterday while reading the conversation. Do you know about the "rockface blades". They have extra welding along the cutting edge. They are also made with spring steel (I think). You can mow over rocks without damage. When I started using the blades, I get a whole season with them on my Skag. I have a job where I destroy blades with so many rocks. I get awhole season out of the blades.
Tinker

I will have to check them out. I have an extra high lift old set that I use for shredding yard debri.

Seth

Tinker · « **Reply #73 on:** May 26, 2023, 06:25 AM »

I don't know who makes them. I just specify "Rock Face". My 'guru' knows. He is the one who put me on to "rock face" blades
Tinker

Cheese · « **Reply #74 on:** May 26, 2023, 10:16 AM »

Quote from: SRSemenza on May 24, 2023, 11:44 PM

Quote from: Tinker on May 24, 2023, 05:40 PM
Quote from: SRSemenza on August 24, 2015, 10:07 AM
Quote from: Tinker on August 24, 2015, 03:38 AM
Quote from: SRSemenza on August 23, 2015, 11:23 PM
Quote from: cliffp on August 23, 2015, 03:24 PM
Had another days productive gardening with the pole pruner and the strimmer. I hacked down as much stuff with the pruner in half an hour as my wife managed to achieve in a day last year.

Yeah the pole pruner is great (I have a gas model)! BUT be careful you can make a big mess to pick up real fast. One of the first times I used it I spent maybe an hour cutting all around the property. When I got done I looked around and thought Oh cr.. Took me about six hours the next day to clean it all up.

Seth

@SRSemenza, I don't think you are cutting real HEAVY stuff with the pole pruner. You should put your Grasshopper to good use along with the pruner. When i do a pruning job, large or small, i use my Skag to clean up the brush. A few minutes with the mower and a few minutes with the sweep rake, and the mess has disappeared. You would be surprised how large diameter twigs/branches can disappear in a hurry with no damage to the mower blades.
Tinker

Yes, I do use the Grasshopper to get rid of a lot of the twigs now. But that first time was a lot 2" -4" limbs from about 20 big pine trees. It is mostly smaller stuff now. I just got the hedge trimmer attachment and use that for the forsythia , willow tree and such. That debris was quickly windrowed with a rake and then ground up with the Grasshopper. I try to stay under 1" for Grasshopper "shredding".

Seth

@seth I forgot the new blades yesterday while reading the conversation. Do you know about the "rockface blades". They have extra welding along the cutting edge. They are also made with spring steel (I think). You can mow over rocks without damage. When I started using the blades, I get a whole season with them on my Skag. I have a job where I destroy blades with so many rocks. I get awhole season out of the blades.
Tinker

I will have to check them out. I have an extra high lift old set that I use for shredding yard debri.

Seth

Are you guys familiar with Marbain blades? They're supposed to be tougher and last longer than regular blades.

https://www.fisherbarton.com/products/turf-care/marbain/

https://www.fisherbarton.com/blog/why-you-need-marbain-blades/

The other blade that's of interest to me is their LaserEdge® Eversharp™ blade where the metal wears away so that it continually produces a new edge, similar to how 3M Cubitron abrasives behave. It may not be for everyone but for a battery powered lawnmower I'd bet it helps battery run time considerably.

https://www.fisherbarton.com/products/turf-care/laseredge/

squall_line · « **Reply #75 on:** May 26, 2023, 10:32 AM »

One of the most interesting parts of this conversation is the reminder of just how quickly a mower blade can dull. I think every freshly-sharpened blade I've installed on my 21" push mower has been dull enough not to worry about slicing a finger by the time I'm done with my first full pass of the front and backyard of our ~.3 acre lot.

Michael Kellough · « **Reply #76 on:** May 26, 2023, 11:25 AM »

I don’t have a mower so I’m asking in total ignorance does it matter whether bevel is on the top or bottom of the blade on a mower?

I’m thinking if the bevel is on the bottom of the blade, and the mower is electric instead of gas, you could turn the mower on it’s side and quickly re-sharpen with a cordless grinder.

Cheese · « **Reply #77 on:** May 26, 2023, 11:41 AM »

Quote from: Michael Kellough on May 26, 2023, 11:25 AM

I don’t have a mower so I’m asking in total ignorant does it matter whether bevel is on the top or bottom of the blade on a mower?

I’m thinking if the bevel is on the bottom of the blade, and the mower is electric instead of gas, you could turn the mower on it’s side and quickly re-sharpen with a cordless grinder.

The blades usually have a pair of "lift stations" somewhere along the blade to lift the grass when cutting it. That lift also promotes better bagging when using a grass catcher bag.

Here's the standard Stihl blade and then a Fisher Barton mulching/shredder blade.

Michael Kellough · « **Reply #78 on:** May 26, 2023, 12:44 PM »

A lot more complex than I imagined.