Author Topic: Dovetail Jigs - Which one?? (Read 15149 times)

jordanrossbell · « **on:** June 10, 2023, 01:41 PM »

I want to get into making dovetails for my cabinet drawers. I have a few projects coming up and i would like to have this feature in my builds. I will be very new at this so user friendly is key. I have researched and found Leigh and Porter Cable to be the most widely used that I can find. I am looking at the D4 Pro and the RTJ 400. Obviously the latter is used on my router table. The width of cut is 16 inches on the RTJ400 which may limit me in the future if i want to make cabinets with dovetail joints on the carcass. It appears to be a no hassle way of doing smaller drawers though.

Leigh D4 Pro vs Porter Cable. I would assume that the Leigh is better quality. The videos ive been watching appears to tout the adjustability of the Leigh. That honestly will probably be a draw back for me. I want uniformity in my spacing and i cant imagine wanting to make it offset of each other. I like that the Porter cable will cut the pins and tails with one pass.

With all that said, what jig would you guys recommend that will give good results and is user friendly for a first time user.

ChuckS · « **Reply #1 on:** June 10, 2023, 02:45 PM »

The Keller jig is the only one that doesn't require a "rocket scientist-like mind" to figure out and operate for beginners. Watch some YouTube videos on this and others (such as Porter Canle, Leigh, etc.) to see if you agree to this observation.

Peachtree has a jig that seems to be based on Keller's design. The Leigh jig has very good dust collection option. Of course, if you use a jig long enough over and over again, even the imported bare-bone dovetail jig can do the job.

Crazyraceguy · « **Reply #2 on:** June 10, 2023, 03:09 PM »

The one I have is the Leigh, though I haven't used it for a while. I have been on a box joint kick lately.
Plus, I am just the opposite with dovetails. I just don't like the "everything equal" aspect of machine-cut half-blinds. I like them bigger, with smaller pins, and not so equal looking.

Packard · « **Reply #3 on:** June 10, 2023, 03:28 PM »

I have a Porter-Cable jig. I use if for drawers only. If you can live with the 12” maximum width capacity, this is a robustly built and easy to use jig.

I was never tempted to make custom dovetail spacing, so this jig worked perfectly. Very little that can go out o adjustment.

Mine came with the guide bushing, and two router bits (1/2” shank). I have a P-C 690, but any 1/2” collet router will work.

I see it advertised for about $135.00 as a complete kit.

It won’t make fancy spaced joints, but the standard will make a stronger joint anyway and I got it for the strength of the joint.

Sparktrician · « **Reply #4 on:** June 10, 2023, 04:10 PM »

I use a Leigh Super 18". It's a piece of cake to set up, once one understands the overall scenario of usage. Since I seldom use it, I have to retrain myself every time I get it out. The OF 1010 is delightful to use with this jig.

Mark37 · « **Reply #5 on:** June 10, 2023, 07:05 PM »

I have the Porter Cable 42xx with the half blind and through dovetail templates.
One thing to be aware of with the fixed spacing is the optimum widths are 1 1/4”, 2 1/4”, 3 1/4”, etc. other widths are doable but the proportions may look weird.
I added the Leigh Vrs1200 which works great for dust collection and helps support the router as work progresses.

As far as the PC jig itself, to get good results, cut a bunch of extra stock and make test joints until you are satisfied with the fit and the boxes don’t come out wider or narrower than intended

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

bigshaw929 · « **Reply #6 on:** June 10, 2023, 07:42 PM »

Quote from: Mark37 on June 10, 2023, 07:05 PM

I have the Porter Cable 42xx with the half blind and through dovetail templates.
One thing to be aware of with the fixed spacing is the optimum widths are 1 1/4”, 2 1/4”, 3 1/4”, etc. other widths are doable but the proportions may look weird.
I added the Leigh Vrs1200 which works great for dust collection and helps support the router as work progresses.

As far as the PC jig itself, to get good results, cut a bunch of extra stock and make test joints until you are satisfied with the fit and the boxes don’t come out wider or narrower than intended

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Mark,
I have the same set up. I like that I don’t have to over think like I did previously with the Leigh jig. Just have to plan properly and make the drawers in inch increments like you stated. I’ll gladly grab the PC while I did everything not to use the Leigh.
Bill

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

derekcohen · « **Reply #7 on:** June 10, 2023, 09:50 PM »

Quote from: jordanrossbell on June 10, 2023, 01:41 PM

I want to get into making dovetails for my cabinet drawers. I have a few projects coming up and i would like to have this feature in my builds. I will be very new at this so user friendly is key. I have researched and found Leigh and Porter Cable to be the most widely used that I can find. I am looking at the D4 Pro and the RTJ 400. Obviously the latter is used on my router table. The width of cut is 16 inches on the RTJ400 which may limit me in the future if i want to make cabinets with dovetail joints on the carcass. It appears to be a no hassle way of doing smaller drawers though.

Leigh D4 Pro vs Porter Cable. I would assume that the Leigh is better quality. The videos ive been watching appears to tout the adjustability of the Leigh. That honestly will probably be a draw back for me. I want uniformity in my spacing and i cant imagine wanting to make it offset of each other. I like that the Porter cable will cut the pins and tails with one pass.

With all that said, what jig would you guys recommend that will give good results and is user friendly for a first time user.

Jordan, to be blunt, ALL dovetail jigs produce dovetails that look terrible. Bland, mechanical and really, really scream out “made by machine”. Yet dovetails are prized joinery .., because they are associated with handwork and craftsmanship. So learn to make them by hand. Cheaper too.

Yes, I know this sounds daunting, but really it is not. You could do it as I did 25 years ago: I started with a jig from Lee Valley (Veritas) and this gave me an understanding of what was involved. Then I progressed to using a dovetail saw, and it just got better. Now it is automatic (I am just a hobbiest) but I can add dovetails where machine jigs cannot go. There are no limitations.

Here is an example of my current project, twin nightstands …

Note that these drawers have curved fronts.

There is another “tiny” drawer at the rear …

Regards from Perth

Derek

ChuckS · « **Reply #8 on:** June 11, 2023, 12:57 AM »

Quote from: bigshaw929 on June 10, 2023, 07:42 PM

Snip.
I’ll gladly grab the PC while I did everything not to use the Leigh.
Bill

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I did a similar thing by...selling my Leigh jig. It was frustrating to relearn the steps everytime I wanted to cut some dovetails after not using the jig for months.

Cutting dovetails by hand suits me because I use the joinery not more than once or twice a year. If I had to do a lot of dovetails on an ongoing basis, I'd sure use a router and jig, and became an expert in that jig (regardless of what brand it was).

Mark37 · « **Reply #9 on:** June 11, 2023, 01:48 AM »

[ Specified attachment is not available ] [ Specified attachment is not available ]To add to my earlier post, here is the PC dovetail jig with the Leigh attachment. Without it, dust & chips are real mess. Leigh did a great job designing it to work with the PC setup.

I mentioned that test cuts are needed to make sure you have the template positioned, and the bit at the right depth of cut. The instructions cover this. The second photo is an example of what happens if you don't have it dialed in.

jeffinsgf · « **Reply #10 on:** June 11, 2023, 07:03 AM »

If you're looking to follow the KISS principle, any half-blind comb-style jig will do. My suggestion is to not fall into capacity envy. If you want dovetails for things like a blanket chest, you will not want half-blinds. So, if you're using this jig strictly for drawers, how many are you going to make that are more than 12" deep?

Check out the used market on Facebook Marketplace and Craigslist. If I were looking for a new comb jig, I would buy an older used Porter-Cable OmniJig. I found an ELU on FBM about a year ago, and it's a nice unit, but I sometimes wish I had held out for the OmniJig I was watching for. On the other hand, I'm making very nice half-blind dovetails for less than $50.

Steve1 · « **Reply #11 on:** June 11, 2023, 07:55 AM »

I have the Leigh SuperJig (similar style to D4 Pro).
It works. Makes decent dovetail joints.
Hard for me to compare it to others because I have not used them.
But it is true that it is a bit complex. Any time I use it (not frequently) I have to go back to review the instructions because set-up and use is not obvious. Make extra pieces of scrap the same thickness as your drawers because test cuts are required.

I had not see the RTJ400 before, but it looks like an interesting device. For what I do, I wouldn't worry about being limited to 16".

twistsol1 · « **Reply #12 on:** June 11, 2023, 08:58 AM »

I've been using the Sommerfeld Katie Jig for about 15 years and it is nearly foolproof. Marc Sommerfeld has videos on youtube that have complete instructions, but they are about 50/50 instruction/sales. I highly recommend it as a much cheaper alternative to the Leigh, and nearly as capable. You can even string 2 or 3 of them together to make 24 or 36 inch dovetails.

I also have an old Porter Cable 4112 that only does fixed spacing half blind dovetails. I don't used it often, but if I need the one trick it does, it works well.

smorgasbord · « **Reply #13 on:** June 11, 2023, 11:50 AM »

I've been experimenting with using the tablesaw for cutting tails. Using a thin kerf blade, may get one reground to have a flat bottom. There are lots of videos on the process. You can also use the tablesaw for cutting pins, or you can match a router dovetail bit angle and cut the pins (which are usually spaced further apart) with a router. Someday I dream of using my small CNC to cut them.

4nthony · « **Reply #14 on:** June 11, 2023, 12:37 PM »

Not sure where the OP is located but I found this D4R with accessories on my local Craigslist for $400.

https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/tls/d/fullerton-leigh-d4r-pro-dovetail-jig/7611366503.html

Seems like a pretty good price.

Crazyraceguy · « **Reply #15 on:** June 11, 2023, 05:32 PM »

Quote from: derekcohen on June 10, 2023, 09:50 PM

Quote from: jordanrossbell on June 10, 2023, 01:41 PM
I want to get into making dovetails for my cabinet drawers. I have a few projects coming up and i would like to have this feature in my builds. I will be very new at this so user friendly is key. I have researched and found Leigh and Porter Cable to be the most widely used that I can find. I am looking at the D4 Pro and the RTJ 400. Obviously the latter is used on my router table. The width of cut is 16 inches on the RTJ400 which may limit me in the future if i want to make cabinets with dovetail joints on the carcass. It appears to be a no hassle way of doing smaller drawers though.

Leigh D4 Pro vs Porter Cable. I would assume that the Leigh is better quality. The videos ive been watching appears to tout the adjustability of the Leigh. That honestly will probably be a draw back for me. I want uniformity in my spacing and i cant imagine wanting to make it offset of each other. I like that the Porter cable will cut the pins and tails with one pass.

With all that said, what jig would you guys recommend that will give good results and is user friendly for a first time user.

Jordan, to be blunt, ALL dovetail jigs produce dovetails that look terrible. Bland, mechanical and really, really scream out “made by machine”. Yet dovetails are prized joinery .., because they are associated with handwork and craftsmanship. So learn to make them by hand. Cheaper too.

Yes, I know this sounds daunting, but really it is not. You could do it as I did 25 years ago: I started with a jig from Lee Valley (Veritas) and this gave me an understanding of what was involved. Then I progressed to using a dovetail saw, and it just got better. Now it is automatic (I am just a hobbiest) but I can add dovetails where machine jigs cannot go. There are no limitations.

Here is an example of my current project, twin nightstands …

Note that these drawers have curved fronts.

There is another “tiny” drawer at the rear …

Regards from Perth

Derek

@derekcohen
Those are some good looking dovetails, just like I like them, wide tails and small pins. Those are obviously hand-cut, a router can't get them that small. Fantastic.
I still do mine with a Leigh jig, but adjusted to make the pins as minimal as can be.
We do some at work, once in a while. It's usually quite a few each time though, so the company bought a Grizzly machine. They are the usual machine made, equal spacing, but it's fast.
Lately, I have been into box-joints, which the Leigh can also do, but I never have.
I do them with the Shaper Origin, but that is way beyond the scope of this thread.
The real beauty of it though is that the width of the parts doesn't matter at all. It can be any random size you want and the machine compensates for it. You could literally make drawer parts that are 6 3/8" wide and cut box-joints to exactly match that. All it takes is a bit diameter that is smaller than the pins themselves.

jordanrossbell · « **Reply #16 on:** June 11, 2023, 06:28 PM »

Some great suggestions here! Thank you! I will probably go with the porter cable jig with leigh attachment. Really appreciate all the help!

morts10n · « **Reply #17 on:** June 12, 2023, 01:13 PM »

You might look into the Akeda dovetail jig as well. A completely different approach with that one

Packard · « **Reply #18 on:** June 12, 2023, 02:50 PM »

Quote from: smorgasbord on June 11, 2023, 11:50 AM

I've been experimenting with using the tablesaw for cutting tails. Using a thin kerf blade, may get one reground to have a flat bottom. There are lots of videos on the process. You can also use the tablesaw for cutting pins, or you can match a router dovetail bit angle and cut the pins (which are usually spaced further apart) with a router. Someday I dream of using my small CNC to cut them.

Dovetail joints cut with a dovetail jig will be faster and easier than a box joint or a dovetail made on the saw.

The table saw is perfectly suited to make box/finger joints, and they are generally more than strong enough for drawers.

But cutting the dovetails with a saw blade would leave the bottom of the cut looking a bit rough. It would probably require some cleaning up with a chisel.

If all I had available was a table saw, then I would make finger joints. Lots of videos on that too.

smorgasbord · « **Reply #19 on:** June 13, 2023, 05:02 PM »

Quote from: Packard on June 12, 2023, 02:50 PM

But cutting the dovetails with a saw blade would leave the bottom of the cut looking a bit rough. It would probably require some cleaning up with a chisel.

For cutting pins, all you need is a flat bottom rip blade - pretty easily available.

As I said, for cutting the tails I'm considering having an 8º bottom ground into a thin kerf blade. Today, yes, I do clean up with a chisel but I don't know any method other than the tablesaw with ground bottom blade that can cut pins just 1/16" wide at the narrowest part that doesn't need a chisel.

Here's the thin kerf blade I'm currently using: https://www.infinitytools.com/10-laser-thin-kerf-saw-blade-1-16-kerf

kfitzsimons · « **Reply #20 on:** August 12, 2023, 09:19 PM »

I have a Keller 1601 jig with bits (plus the box joint bit) for sale. I've used it once. $200 + shippiing. I can send photos.

krudawg · « **Reply #21 on:** September 10, 2023, 06:30 PM »

I bought a Leigh D4 Pro jig with all the accessories. I've used it twice and found it to be on the "fussy" side, so it sits on a shelf in my shop. Some day, I will decide to force myself to make all my drawers with dovetails with the Jig but I'm really not in a hurry to do that yet

Mini Me · « **Reply #22 on:** September 10, 2023, 08:05 PM »

A Bandsaw is another option which works very well but Frank Klausz's method is also great and all done with zero measuring.

Watch the two top videos at this link https://www.google.com/search?q=frank+klause+dovetails&oq=frank+klause+dovetails&aqs=edge..69i57j0i13i512.18545j0j4&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&bshm=rimc/1

DynaGlide · « **Reply #23 on:** September 11, 2023, 08:10 AM »

Quote from: derekcohen on June 10, 2023, 09:50 PM

Jordan, to be blunt, ALL dovetail jigs produce dovetails that look terrible. Bland, mechanical and really, really scream out “made by machine”. Yet dovetails are prized joinery .., because they are associated with handwork and craftsmanship. So learn to make them by hand. Cheaper too.

Regards from Perth

Derek

@derekcohen Derek I disagree here. What is cheaper about all the niche hand tools I've bought from Lie Nielsen and Veritas and my new obsession with nice hand tools.

It all started with a simple Veritas LAJ. Then I had to build a bench (obviously). And I blacked out afterwards and here we are. Cheaper my ass.

Matt

Mini Me · « **Reply #24 on:** September 11, 2023, 08:27 AM »

Quote from: DynaGlide on September 11, 2023, 08:10 AM

Quote from: derekcohen on June 10, 2023, 09:50 PM

Jordan, to be blunt, ALL dovetail jigs produce dovetails that look terrible. Bland, mechanical and really, really scream out “made by machine”. Yet dovetails are prized joinery .., because they are associated with handwork and craftsmanship. So learn to make them by hand. Cheaper too.

Regards from Perth

Derek

@derekcohen Derek I disagree here. What is cheaper about all the niche hand tools I've bought from Lie Nielsen and Veritas and my new obsession with nice hand tools.

It all started with a simple Veritas LAJ. Then I had to build a bench (obviously). And I blacked out afterwards and here we are. Cheaper my ass.

Matt

Why do you need all those tools to do a dovetail? A single saw and a chisel is all that is needed add a pencil which is optional and cut a DT.

Sparktrician · « **Reply #25 on:** September 11, 2023, 08:34 AM »

Quote from: DynaGlide on September 11, 2023, 08:10 AM

What is cheaper about all the niche hand tools I've bought from Lie Nielsen and Veritas and my new obsession with nice hand tools.

It all started with a simple Veritas LAJ. Then I had to build a bench (obviously). And I blacked out afterwards and here we are. Cheaper my ass.

Matt

"My name is Matt, and I'm a tool-a-holic."

"Welcome, Matt!"

BA-HAHAHAHA!!!!

ChuckS · « **Reply #26 on:** September 11, 2023, 10:11 AM »

Quote from: Mini Me on September 11, 2023, 08:27 AM

Snip.
Why do you need all those tools to do a dovetail? A single saw and a chisel is all that is needed add a pencil which is optional and cut a DT.

Perhaps for the similar reason why some Festool owners have spent so much on a track saw, dust extractor, MFT table and after-market accessories while all my old neighbor Don had was a circular saw and a shop-made fence to do everything he wanted with sheet goods.

squall_line · « **Reply #27 on:** September 11, 2023, 10:46 AM »

Quote from: Mini Me on September 11, 2023, 08:27 AM

Quote from: DynaGlide on September 11, 2023, 08:10 AM

@derekcohen Derek I disagree here. What is cheaper about all the niche hand tools I've bought from Lie Nielsen and Veritas and my new obsession with nice hand tools.

It all started with a simple Veritas LAJ. Then I had to build a bench (obviously). And I blacked out afterwards and here we are. Cheaper my ass.

Matt

Why do you need all those tools to do a dovetail? A single saw and a chisel is all that is needed add a pencil which is optional and cut a DT.

I think Matt was being a little tongue-in-cheek here.

Cheese · « **Reply #28 on:** September 11, 2023, 11:46 AM »

This really is a FWIW answer...I used a Porter Cable 4210 to cut these. I just needed some simple storage boxes that are never seen...because they're always in storage.

They get pulled out maybe 2-3 times a year.

Even though these are never seen, I wanted something a bit more elegant than the Domino storage boxes I usually make.

cpw · « **Reply #29 on:** September 11, 2023, 07:34 PM »

I have the Porter Cable jig. It works well, but just be prepared to go through a bunch of scrap stock to get it dialed in right. Once you do, you can make drawers non-stop. Make sure you dedicate a router to the jig, so that you don't need to make any adjustments after dialing it in.