Author Topic: Plantation shutter madness  (Read 5755 times)

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Online DynaGlide

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Plantation shutter madness
« on: July 11, 2019, 01:13 PM »
With each project I take on I look to grow my skill set and occasionally use it as an excuse for new tools. This one was motivated by my desire for a CMS router table. After getting new windows in our home the boss and I realized our old interior shutters didn't quite look right anymore. Full of confidence and lacking in wisdom I told the boss I can make new ones. After plenty of mistakes I have a pair of mating shutters mocked up and am going through the monotony of making the remaining pieces to build the rest. I have lots of respect for anyone that does this sort of work often as I'm starting to question my sanity.

Pictures in no particular order





























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Offline TSO Products

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2019, 01:31 PM »
@DynaGlide  - you are a brave soul to tackle a project like this. Seeing what's involved makes it easy to leave it to a production shop for our place when it comes place to retire the plastic ones on our Condo.

thanks for sharing what's involved and what is possible!

Hans
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE  plus TPG Parallel Guide -  the MTR-18 Triangle - TDS-10 Dog Stop and GRC-12 Guide Rail Connector; Work Holding solutions plus AXMINSTER UJK in the USA

Offline ear3

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2019, 01:36 PM »
That's fantastic -- looks like you really figured out the process.  How long do you think it took to bust those out?
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS-EC 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • RS 2 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/BT module • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2019, 07:30 AM »
@TSO Products Thank you Hans. It's been a learning experience but I think I've got it all down.

@ear3 I don't even want to speculate  :-X Most of it was figuring out machine setup. All the little details just take time. Like drilling out each louver right in the middle for the control arm fasteners, and again on each end for the louver pins. I haven't even gotten to sanding yet. I can see why custom shutters would cost a lot of money.
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Offline ear3

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2019, 07:36 AM »
@DynaGlide What's the mechanism you're using to open and close them?

@TSO Products Thank you Hans. It's been a learning experience but I think I've got it all down.

@ear3 I don't even want to speculate  :-X Most of it was figuring out machine setup. All the little details just take time. Like drilling out each louver right in the middle for the control arm fasteners, and again on each end for the louver pins. I haven't even gotten to sanding yet. I can see why custom shutters would cost a lot of money.
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS-EC 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • RS 2 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/BT module • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2019, 07:46 AM »
They will have a control arm going down the middle like standard shutters. If you're interested in more these are based on Rockler's Shutter Design Wizard: https://www.rockler.com/shutter

My mocked up set isn't complete those were for taking width and length measurements. I hadn't routed the mouse holes on the top rails or attached the control arms in that picture.
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Offline BarneyD

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2019, 10:22 AM »
Your timing is perfect, @DynaGlide. I'm pretty sure that some of these will shortly be on my radar. Daughter in law has made some  comments. So I've been doing some research and I'm questioning whether I want to tackle something like these. Seems like a whole lot of tedious work. Did you buy the slats from Rockler? They look to be the 3" versions, correct? Were you happy with their jigs, etc.? Thanks for posting.
Barney

Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2019, 11:10 AM »
Your timing is perfect, @DynaGlide. I'm pretty sure that some of these will shortly be on my radar. Daughter in law has made some  comments. So I've been doing some research and I'm questioning whether I want to tackle something like these. Seems like a whole lot of tedious work. Did you buy the slats from Rockler? They look to be the 3" versions, correct? Were you happy with their jigs, etc.? Thanks for posting.

@BarneyD Tedious doesn't quite do it justice. While I'm glad to be doing this myself I don't think I'll be doing it again. Although I did agree to do a pair for the upstairs bathroom when I'm done. . .  [doh]

The main movable/fixed jig is all but a necessity as is the louver and control arm jig that comes in the same package. The mouse hole jig is worthless and doesn't work. The jigs work and do their job but if you aren't careful you'll be scrapping one of your stiles (or 2 or 3. .) because you didn't orient the face of the boards properly to the jig. This was an issue for me mainly because my setup requires mating shutter panels but the two middle stiles that come together are different widths to create the illusion that they're the same when the rabbets come together. If you tackle this yourself just make certain to think about all the things that can go wrong and idiot proof the process as much as possible so you don't have to think about what goes where.

If your daughter in laws windows only require one shutter per window then the whole job is much, much easier. Mine require two shutters per window which took the complexity up several notches. 3 1/2" louvers are being used, purchased from Rockler. The cost adds up fast on those. Something to consider if you are capable of making them yourself.

Here are some videos I watched several times while doing my research that I think will help you:





« Last Edit: July 12, 2019, 11:26 AM by DynaGlide »
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Offline neilc

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2019, 01:14 PM »
Matt -

Those look great!  Nice work. Thanks for all the photos.

Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2019, 08:37 AM »
@neilc Thank you!

I made some more progress. Drilling the 96 louvers and keeping all of the stiles oriented the right way was really not fun but i got through it with plenty of breaks along the way. Felt a bit like I was addressing Christmas cards. Still need to do Domino joinery then dry fit, sanding, glue up and paint. But that all can wait as I'm headed to the Cape for a week.  [big grin]





« Last Edit: July 13, 2019, 08:42 AM by DynaGlide »
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Offline six-point socket II

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2019, 08:45 AM »
One word, amazing! Looking forward seeing them finished. :)

Thanks for sharing!

Kind regards,
Oliver
Kind regards,
Oliver

Online Green Mojo

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2019, 09:51 AM »
Those look great. I did shutters for my house also using that Rockler setup. The first few I did totally from scratch including routing the louvers. Not much fun there. Then I found out we had a moulding shop nearby that sold louver slats and also premilled style pieces. With those, it was a breeze to crank them out. Now hanging them was a definitely not a breeze. I’m sure you will enjoy them for many years to come.

Offline BarneyD

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2019, 10:06 AM »
Thanks for the links, @DynaGlide.  I'll certainly check them out. Please continue with updates. I'm looking forward to seeing the finished product. Looks great so far. Cheers.
Barney

Offline Bob D.

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2019, 04:02 PM »
Speaking of finish, now that the easy part is done (building the shutters), it's time to paint.

Will you do that before you assemble of afterward?

I remember on the NYW Norm built some plantation shutters a few years back.

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Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2019, 09:39 PM »
Speaking of finish, now that the easy part is done (building the shutters), it's time to paint.

Will you do that before you assemble of afterward?

I remember on the NYW Norm built some plantation shutters a few years back.



Wow that was involved. Hats off to Norm. I think I'll follow his advice and prime the louvers and probably the rest before assembly and spray everything after glue up. Maybe tape off any glue areas before spraying.
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Offline Kevin C.

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #15 on: July 13, 2019, 10:00 PM »
 First off, your shutters look really good! There is an insane amount of work involved in them.
 I can tell ya that you will get a much better result if you prime your parts ahead of time. Getting the ends of the louvers and the inside of the styles after they're assembled wont look nearly as good. The shop that I have been installing for (about 20 years now) primes all the parts before it gets assembled.
 When it is time to paint them, put a hook in the top of the panel and hang it so you can spray both sides of the panel at the same time.

Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #16 on: July 14, 2019, 07:49 AM »
First off, your shutters look really good! There is an insane amount of work involved in them.
 I can tell ya that you will get a much better result if you prime your parts ahead of time. Getting the ends of the louvers and the inside of the styles after they're assembled wont look nearly as good. The shop that I have been installing for (about 20 years now) primes all the parts before it gets assembled.
 When it is time to paint them, put a hook in the top of the panel and hang it so you can spray both sides of the panel at the same time.

Thank you for the kind words and the wisdom. I think I'll do just that. I'll setup a clothes hanger rod for drying and prime everything except glue surfaces before assembly. Lots of firsts for me but I have all the right equipment just need to do some practice runs.
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Offline TSO Products

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #17 on: July 14, 2019, 09:24 AM »
- do I hear any votes for Shellac as a sanding sealer before any painting and assembly?

Hans
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE  plus TPG Parallel Guide -  the MTR-18 Triangle - TDS-10 Dog Stop and GRC-12 Guide Rail Connector; Work Holding solutions plus AXMINSTER UJK in the USA

Offline Sparktrician

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2019, 07:32 AM »
- do I hear any votes for Shellac as a sanding sealer before any painting and assembly?

Hans

Can't address the use of pure shellac, @TSO Products, but I have used Zinsser B-I-N primer which is shellac-based.  It lays down well when sprayed and sands out to a very smooth base for top coats.   [smile]
- Willy -

 "Remember, a chip on the shoulder is a sure sign of wood higher up." - Brigham Young

Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #19 on: July 26, 2019, 02:11 PM »
Back at it a little. I waited to do any further Domino work until I got my TDS-10 in from @TSO Products . I had previously done one set of stiles and found it awkward enough that I wanted to wait until these were available to do the rest. For narrow stock getting it to hang off the bench they're perfect. I think they'll find lots of uses around the shop.






For a project of this scope with so many parts when it comes to steps like this I like to take my time doing the first piece, then I keep it nearby for reference so I don't get turned around on which face goes up, at which end, etc. It's easy to catch mistakes before they happen when I work this way. The first stile I did I went off the wrong face and ended up having to repair the mortises by gluing a domino in and flush trimming it off.

Example, I'll grab one of the stiles with the rabbet on the outside to the right that I've already dry fitted and know to work and set it on the bench. Then I go and grab the other stiles with a rabbet on the outside to the right. I match it up with my already Domino'd stile, move it to position and clamp it down and do my mortises. Put it back where I got it and grab the next one. Even though I labeled all the tops, bottoms, fronts, backs it all but eliminates human error from the equation. Less thinking = more better.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2019, 02:43 PM by DynaGlide »
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Offline ear3

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #20 on: July 26, 2019, 03:12 PM »
Making progress!

Those TSO stops are pretty slick -- hadn't seen those before.  For situations like dominoing the edge of a long narrow piece basically use the same setup as you do with the clamps, except in place of the TSO I use the veritas stop fences -- they have a lower, sub-1/4" profile, and so when I move over to handplaning or sanding they allow me to work on thinner pieces: http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/page.aspx?p=69837&cat=1,41637
 
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS-EC 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • RS 2 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/BT module • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #21 on: July 29, 2019, 04:53 PM »
Not much shop time as we prepare for my son's 2nd birthday today. I did do a little Weber kettle maintenance though.

I decided to dry fit the shutters and label the matched parts. It's a pretty great feeling when you grab parts from a pile and they all go together perfectly. Lots of sanding ahead of me but I can start to see the finish line. These 36" quick clamps from Bessey I received as a gift for my upcoming birthday came in real handy for fitting each shutter together. Easy to give the handle a little squeeze at a time as you line up all the louvers.









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Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #22 on: July 29, 2019, 05:06 PM »
And the obligatory Weber picture
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Offline Bob D.

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #23 on: July 29, 2019, 08:14 PM »
Looking good, you've got some time into these already and a ways to go but they are looking great. Yeah, it's nice when you can pick up a random set of pieces and they all fit together like they were milled and fit for each other. You've got your process and machine setup tweaked I would say.

Good to take a break today and spend some time with your Son on his birthday.
-----
It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?

Offline Sparktrician

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #24 on: July 30, 2019, 08:38 AM »
And the obligatory Weber picture

What's that wearing the burka to the left of the "obligatory Weber"?   [big grin]
- Willy -

 "Remember, a chip on the shoulder is a sure sign of wood higher up." - Brigham Young

Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2019, 08:46 AM »
And the obligatory Weber picture

What's that wearing the burka to the left of the "obligatory Weber"?   [big grin]

@Sparktrician Why do I get the feeling you already know the answer to this question  ;D
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Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #26 on: August 23, 2019, 03:31 PM »
Finally getting off my butt to make a push to finish these up. I've been avoiding the sanding task as I just couldn't figure out a good way to do it. The stiles all have a beading profile on them and I knew I'd have to be careful not to sand off the rounded portion of the bead. I already partially did one on accident so I stopped what I was doing and came up with a fix.

I took one of the scrap test stiles and routed out a rabbet so when clamped it would cover the beading detail and provide a shoulder for my sander to butt up against. Works great. Now just wish I owned the RTS400. I have to do two sides of 16 stiles. . .so 32 times probably starting at 180 and going up to 220. . .hmmmmmm might be time to start shaking some piggy banks. @Sparktrician I know you have every Festool ever made. .mind if I 'ahem' borrow yours?  ;D





« Last Edit: August 23, 2019, 03:36 PM by DynaGlide »
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Offline Sparktrician

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #27 on: August 23, 2019, 06:18 PM »
Finally getting off my butt to make a push to finish these up. I've been avoiding the sanding task as I just couldn't figure out a good way to do it. The stiles all have a beading profile on them and I knew I'd have to be careful not to sand off the rounded portion of the bead. I already partially did one on accident so I stopped what I was doing and came up with a fix.

I took one of the scrap test stiles and routed out a rabbet so when clamped it would cover the beading detail and provide a shoulder for my sander to butt up against. Works great. Now just wish I owned the RTS400. I have to do two sides of 16 stiles. . .so 32 times probably starting at 180 and going up to 220. . .hmmmmmm might be time to start shaking some piggy banks. @Sparktrician I know you have every Festool ever made. .mind if I 'ahem' borrow yours?  ;D

Well, @DynaGlide, I really don't have every tool Festool ever made.  I just have those that I use.  I do have the RTS 400, and if you need to borrow it, you know how to get in touch.   [smile]
- Willy -

 "Remember, a chip on the shoulder is a sure sign of wood higher up." - Brigham Young

Online DynaGlide

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #28 on: September 10, 2019, 04:15 PM »
Hi my name is Matt and I have a problem. I bought another tool.

After trying to sand these stiles with what I had (ETS EC 125 and Pro5) I realized the RTS 400 REQ would probably work better and it's like it was designed for this task. Using the included edge guard and my scrap piece as a buffer to keep the sander away from the beading profile, it's just perfect. Maybe I'll actually finish these soon?  [big grin] I know, time to join the comedy tour.

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Offline JimD

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Re: Plantation shutter madness
« Reply #29 on: September 15, 2019, 08:45 PM »
You are doing a good job, the shutters look great!  I put them in all the windows of my last house but haven't started them in this one.  I put in new plantation blinds in both houses and made the shutters when the blinds started to yellow in the last one.  Hopefully I will get the other projects complete and make them for this one too.

I made a jig like norm uses to staple the control rod to the shutters.  I used MDF for most of them but used softwood for the center where I used a screw instead of a pin to help hold the shutters dimensions.  I don't remember what I did at the corners, I did not have a domino then so it wasn't that.  I might have made loose tenons with a plunge router.  As you said, the big issue is all the louvers.  It takes awhile if you do not have a shop set up to machine them and then sand them, including after finish is applied.

I used white tinted Resisthane and their primer on mine.  It worked very well.  Very durable and easy to apply.  I am using the same finish on a crib now, changing table is complete and crib is done except for final sanding and then finish.  Everything has been sanded but assembly and a few weeks time means it needs a bit of touchup. 

Anyway, good job.