Author Topic: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...  (Read 3255 times)

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Offline Rich Kline

  • Posts: 109
I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« on: August 01, 2022, 10:48 PM »
Hi,

About 18 months ago, I bought my dream house.  It's on Lake Tahoe in Nevada, and the only reason I looked at it was that the owner had pictures of his woodshop.  I told my wife, we can't afford it, but we need to look at it!  In the end, we did afford it, and now it's ours.  The house was designed by the father and built by the son (over three years), and there are no right angles in the house.  Everything is a hexagon.

Anyway, my next project is refinishing the deck.  Here's what I know.  We are in Nevada, and it snows and is cold in the winter.  I also know that the previous owner used paint Not Available in California.  According to him, "The good stuff."

The deck is about 500 sq ft. (not small), and most of it looks like the pictures.

I own all the sanders...  RO90, RO125, RAS115.04, RS2, ETSEC125 (with both the 125 and 150MM pads) with a CT26 ready to go.  I also have a 4" Porter Cable Belt sander.

How would you attack sanding this deck?  I also have a pressure washer, but I'm concerned about having all the paint fly into the woods and ultimately to the lake.

All thoughts appreciated!

Rich




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Offline mino

  • Posts: 1035
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2022, 06:34 AM »
First make a call if you want to paint it again or want to oil/varnish etc.

It the former, you should catch with previous owner to ask what the paint /and anyting under the paint/ is. Then you would ideally remove only the paint which does not hold and just put another "layer" where it does. If it is some organic/harmless stuff, you may not need to worry abou contaminating surrounds either.

If the latter, then you want to rough-sand only, and need a second decision to make - what to do with the the gaps. Either way you may want to look into some brushing after/instead of sanding.

The key take is:
Do it the way that aligns with what you want/plan to do with it afterwards. Not the other way around.

My main concern would be the uneven gaps, so I would tend to shoot for sanding top to wood + lightly brushing the gaps and oil for a natural wood look. But that is me.
When The Machine has no brains, use yours.

Offline oberlin1

  • Posts: 35
  • Larry
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2022, 07:52 AM »
Trex.  You will cry once but it will be done forever...and you can address the gaps.

CXS, ETC-125, TS-75, CT-26E, LS-130, RO-150 FEQ

Online Richard/RMW

  • Posts: 2317
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2022, 08:30 AM »
I have a ~700SF PT deck that was in similar condition, we'd used a semi-transparent stain that was peeling. Rented the large floor belt sander from HD and spent a day wrestling it around and perhaps 8 belts to get back to raw wood.

I little hand work on my knees with a sanding pad on 4-1/2" grinder and it was done. I was whipped for a week afterwards but it was worth the effort.

Dream view you have there!

RMW
As of 10/17 I am out of the Dog business and pursuing other distractions. Thanks for a fun ride!

Offline Peter_C

  • Posts: 1377
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2022, 12:03 PM »
^Same I would rent a sander for flooring. Nails and screws can be a problem though. How many square feet? I use Superdeck Duckback in a custom color on our painted deck which is one of the better paints, but even still it needs to be pressure washed and repainted every 4 years, but my redwood deck is very old and dry.

Beautiful view, but if it is was me I would start dropping trees for fire prevention, which would also give a better view. If you ever rebuild the deck switch to non flammable materials too. We almost lost our house to fire, and fire is one of my largest concerns. Plus I self insure my tools and equipment as insurance only covers $3,000, and an over rider policy would be thousands a year.

Offline Yardbird

  • Posts: 343
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #5 on: August 02, 2022, 12:37 PM »
I always wondered if the Festool drywall sander would work on a deck, or is it too light?? 

Offline cpw

  • Posts: 360
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #6 on: August 02, 2022, 12:59 PM »
I have a 42x12' deck.  After the first time power washed and painted it with the Behr deck paint.  It started flaking off the horizontal surfaces the next year.  I got it back to bare wood with an angle grinder and 3M Sandblaster pads, this wasn't cheap and was a lot of work, but did work well.  Safety glasses and long sleeves are a must.

After getting it down to bare wood I covered with Arborcoat custom tinted to match the failed paint, which lasts several years without any flaking; and have now recoated the surface twice and the spindles once.

Our next deck will be Trex or another composite.

Offline guybo

  • Posts: 384
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2022, 02:34 PM »
I always wondered if the Festool drywall sander would work on a deck, or is it too light??
remember this see the reply right after yours #13https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/festool-wish-list/deck-sander/

Online Mike Goetzke

  • Posts: 894
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2022, 02:52 PM »
Ha - forget the deck how about some pics of the woodshop?

Offline twistsol1

  • Posts: 19
    • Sawdustzone
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2022, 03:05 PM »
I just did this on an 800 sq ft cedar deck in Superior WI at my daughters house. Hours with an RO150 and managed about 25 square feet total. Rent a deck sander. The one we got weighed around 125 pounds and were able to do the entire deck in about 10 hours.

Use the smaller sanders on the rails  and stairs.

If you are in a windy area, do no use Trex until you search for the Trex Howl. We live on a bluff in southern Minnesota and every time the wind kicks up over about 15 MPH, it sounds like ships coming into dock in our back yard. It is loud enough to wake the neighborhood. We've been able to minimize it with rugs on the deck.

A shop full of tools and no talent

Offline Rich Kline

  • Posts: 109
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2022, 03:30 PM »
@twistsol1 thanks for the heads up on the Trex.  My contractor just suggested TimberTech AZEK, I wonder if they have the same problem.  We regularly get 30+ mile an hour winds off the lake

Here's a fun video of the house, it has a picture of the shop as it was and I'll post the Festool upgrade photo below.  There's so much storage that my 30 systainers are all in cabinets!




Online Richard/RMW

  • Posts: 2317
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2022, 04:29 PM »
Aww that's just unfair. My entire shop would fit inside the cabinets...

Enjoy!

RMW
As of 10/17 I am out of the Dog business and pursuing other distractions. Thanks for a fun ride!

Offline twistsol1

  • Posts: 19
    • Sawdustzone
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2022, 06:47 PM »
Absolutely stunning home. Those views beat the heck out of my Mississippi River Valley view.

Nice shop space also.
A shop full of tools and no talent

Offline Peter_C

  • Posts: 1377
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2022, 08:40 PM »
Love the fact they didn't blast the rocks out but instead incorporated the granite :) Stunning views all around.

Now you just need to find a new place to park the cars and take over the whole garage as a shop. 

Offline thudchkr

  • Posts: 202
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2022, 07:36 AM »
@twistsol1 thanks for the heads up on the Trex.  My contractor just suggested TimberTech AZEK, I wonder if they have the same problem.  We regularly get 30+ mile an hour winds off the lake


Might also take a look at https://www.advantagelumber.com/ .  I’ve been pricing out decking materials for a client and can get most of their decking varieties cheaper than I can get the desired Trex. And if one goes with Ipe, (the one decking more expensive than the Trex), it has a fire rating similar to steel and/or concrete.

Clint

Offline Peter Kelly

  • Posts: 131
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #15 on: August 03, 2022, 01:56 PM »
Looks like you're near South Lake? Conveniently close to the Stagecoach Lodge entrance to Heavenly. Great choice.

Offline Rich Kline

  • Posts: 109
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #16 on: August 03, 2022, 02:48 PM »
Looks like you're near South Lake? Conveniently close to the Stagecoach Lodge entrance to Heavenly. Great choice.

You are correct and have a great eye.   15 minutes to the lift.

Offline JimH2

  • Posts: 1153
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #17 on: August 03, 2022, 05:30 PM »
Trex.  You will cry once but it will be done forever...and you can address the gaps.

Trex is not a solution to a home with that view. Need to stick with real wood and refinish it occasionally. Do it right and it will last well more than three years. 

Offline Peter Kelly

  • Posts: 131
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #18 on: August 03, 2022, 05:49 PM »
An old friend has a place just up the road from you in Glenbrook so I'm pretty familiar with that side of the lake. Similar views to yours. 




Offline Rich Kline

  • Posts: 109
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #19 on: August 03, 2022, 09:00 PM »
So I spoke to the original owner.  The wood is heart redwood from 1980.  He replaced boards as necessary due to rot from the water on the upper deck falling onto the lower deck

He originally used translucent stain but switched to the solid "when the translucent wasn't working anymore"  I wasn't able to really understand what that meant.

It also sounds like without reinforcing the deck I can't switch to trex (or similar) as my joists are 33" on center.  They are 4" X 8" beams more than joists but I guess that's a requirement for that stuff.

I have a painting contractor coming who says you will ruin the deck if you use a big deck sander so he's going to quote a "this old house" kind of restoration.  Not sure I will go that route, and I might grab my RO125 and see how hard it is to get down to bare wood.

Rich

« Last Edit: August 03, 2022, 11:10 PM by Rich Kline »

Offline JimH2

  • Posts: 1153
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #20 on: August 03, 2022, 09:07 PM »
So I spoke to the original owner.  The wood is heart redwood from 1980.  He replaced boards as necessary due to rot from the water on the upper deck falling onto the lower deck

He originally used translucent stain but switched to the solid "when the translucent was working anymore"  I wasn't able to really understand what that meant.

It also sounds like without reinforcing the deck I can't switch to trex (or similar) as my joists are 33" on center.  They are 4" X 8" beams more than joists but I guess that's a requirement for that stuff.

I have a painting contractor coming who says you will ruin the deck if you use a big deck sander so he's going to quote a "this old house" kind of restoration.  Not sure I will go that route, and I might grab my RO125 and see how hard it is to get down to bare wood.

Rich

You are right about Trex. I think you need 12" on center and even then you might still see some flex. Keep the wood it is the right thing to do. That redwood once cleaned up is going to look infinitely better than Trex, which is basically the vinyl siding of decking.

Offline Yardbird

  • Posts: 343
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #21 on: August 03, 2022, 10:48 PM »
So I spoke to the original owner.  The wood is heart redwood from 1980

WOW!  That redwood is definitely worth saving.  Please test sanding it carefully as an aggressive sander will cut into that redwood quickly.  I sure would try to use a translucent stain to show off that wood.  How thick is the decking?  At 33" o.c. even locust or white oak would be bouncy at normal decking thickness.  It would cost a fortune to build that deck today. 

Offline Rich Kline

  • Posts: 109
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #22 on: August 03, 2022, 11:13 PM »
So I spoke to the original owner.  The wood is heart redwood from 1980

WOW!  That redwood is definitely worth saving.  Please test sanding it carefully as an aggressive sander will cut into that redwood quickly.  I sure would try to use a translucent stain to show off that wood.  How thick is the decking?  At 33" o.c. even locust or white oak would be bouncy at normal decking thickness.  It would cost a fortune to build that deck today.

The boards are 2" x 6"  I was just under the lower deck (not easy to get to) and he actually stained (translucent) the bottoms to protect the wood.

What festool sander / grit would you start with?  this redwood, is much denser than I'm use to

Offline Yardbird

  • Posts: 343
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #23 on: August 04, 2022, 12:00 AM »
I am new to Festool and have not used Redwood in over 20 years, so do not feel qualified to recommend sander, grit, etc.  I just know redwood is very soft, that you can make a finger nail indention in it easily enough. Hopefully someone else can give you proper direction.  It should be relatively easy sand, outside of the dust.

I have used One Time Deck stain before, which is suppose to last seven years (it does not) but you do get more than one  year.  My main reason I like it is I have allergic reactions to it as I get boils and my throat tightens from using it.  Therefore My wife had to do the staining. i do not like their tints-I mix cedar and natural together as the cedar is too red otherwise-in my opinion the tints are all too dark. One time should be able to soak into redwood rather easily for a longer lasting stain. 

Offline mino

  • Posts: 1035
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #24 on: August 04, 2022, 05:02 AM »
So I spoke to the original owner.  The wood is heart redwood from 1980

WOW!  That redwood is definitely worth saving.  Please test sanding it carefully as an aggressive sander will cut into that redwood quickly.  I sure would try to use a translucent stain to show off that wood.  How thick is the decking?  At 33" o.c. even locust or white oak would be bouncy at normal decking thickness.  It would cost a fortune to build that deck today.
Not sure how are you on finances, but I would consider re-decking it with the original boards. The boards are too close to each other at places which will cause water to stay between them. Additional paint/stain layers will make it only worse. Also without removing them, there is not really a way to apply proper protective coats on the sides and bottom.

If you can pull the boards, you can properly treat them on all sides, fix any heavily damaged places AND you can place them at appropriate distances - say 1/2" - from each other so that when there is rain it will not stay between them.

I would look to use either oils or oil-y stains which will get deep into the wood and protect it from the elements. Translucent stain would look better, but it will not hold more than a few years - same as the current situation - while oil can be refreshed regularly so will better protect the wood.

There is no way you can "close" the wood as with the temperature differences any firm film would crack fast not to mention being disrupted by walking over it. So you need something which is elastic enough that it can handle the contract/expand cycles and still protect the wood from water rot. Classic stain is really only good for a year or two, if you wanted to sell on the house ..

About the floor sander, you got an honest contractor there. Good luck!
When The Machine has no brains, use yours.

Offline Vtshopdog

  • Posts: 141
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #25 on: August 04, 2022, 09:14 AM »
I went all in on part of my mid 80's redwood deck a couple years ago and pulled then planed down boards from one section.  This was a ton of work and only went this route as I needed to replace framing.  If you want the beauty of the redwood your are stuck doing maintenance on a fairly frequent cycle.  I like Penofin red can, (some sort of rosewood oil) will last 2-3 years in my sunny Utah climate. 

I.M.O. paint type coatings on a deck will never last, expansion will crack it and then water will peel it.  Also, a neglected oil coating will still look ok while peeling paint will look bad.

Thread link here:
https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/home-improvement-other-projects/how-to-save-early-90's-redwood-decking-rotting-framing-rusting-screws-stuck/

For maintenance I've had good luck with gentile power washing then scrubbing with commercial deck cleaner (Penofin again) followed by sanding with 60 or 80 grit. (Makita Rotex knockoff or my ETS 150)  If you go this route getting the paint off will be major bit of back breaking work, but you have full suite of Festool sanders so at least you won't be all dusty. 
« Last Edit: August 04, 2022, 09:17 AM by Vtshopdog »

Offline mino

  • Posts: 1035
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #26 on: August 04, 2022, 09:31 AM »
If you go this route getting the paint off will be major bit of back breaking work, but you have full suite of Festool sanders so at least you won't be all dusty.
One thing that I found gold when floor sanding is to have a very low "trolley", like 5cm above the floor, which one can sit on and let the sander do (most) of the work itself. I used it by sitting on it, using legs to move around, and either working "between" my legs when I wanted to apply force or - usually- holding the sander "to my side" just by one hand and letting the vac suction do the work. Made a night-day difference to me.

I made one ad hoc but no longer have it. Looked something like this:

One can make one also with back support, for even more comfort.
When The Machine has no brains, use yours.

Offline Rich Kline

  • Posts: 109
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #27 on: August 04, 2022, 12:53 PM »
thanks for all the help here.  I really enjoyed reading @Vtshopdog post. I might steal some ideas!

Online Bob D.

  • Retailer
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  • Posts: 2852
    • My Cordless Workshop
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #28 on: August 04, 2022, 01:36 PM »
Anyone used the Diamabrush attachment for your angle grinder from Sherwin-Williams?

I was in SW the other day picking up some paint and spied a brochure on the counter for this tool and it made me think of this thread. I looked online and found the 4.5 and 7 inch versions are for sale at HD and they have the large floor maintainer size for sale and rent.

www.diamabrush.com



There is even a version to fit large floor maintainers.



-----
It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?

Offline Walter Cronkat

  • Posts: 3
Re: I bought my dream house, now I need to sand it...
« Reply #29 on: August 04, 2022, 04:52 PM »
Congrats on the house, amazing view!
I'm a carpentry contractor in Reno, NV, and do a fair amount of work in Tahoe also. If you are going to try to refinish, I would use RO 125 (RO150 would be better) and 80 grit Granat paper. I would caution you that I have yet to see a wood deck in Reno or Tahoe that is in good shape, the weather here is just so intense. I would go the timber tech route, of course the framing would have to be redone. Honestly you should any way with the snow loads you get. Depending on the condition of the deck boards, Id just do a good powerwash and paint, to buy a year or two to save up for a new rebuilt deck..