Author Topic: More dust control for domino xl  (Read 10262 times)

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Offline cgraham

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More dust control for domino xl
« on: April 22, 2013, 08:46 PM »
Not being known for having the cleanest shop, festool has definitely helped me in that area. Putting tools back in their systainers and superior dust control are two things festool has helped me with.  That being said, I think the domino could have better dust removal from the mortise pocket. This could be accomplished by the bit having a hole in the center. The hole would be the entire length of the bit. The vac would pull the last bit of sawdust out of the mortise.  I am not a design or engineer type so I don't know how it could be built but it sure would be nice to not have those little piles of sawdust when you are finished

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Offline Tom Bellemare

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Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2013, 10:43 AM »
My observation of the Domino is that with proper dust extraction, CT w/ 27mm hose, it gets virtually all of the dust and leaves none in the mortise(s).

Maybe you have a partial plug?


Tom

Offline Brice Burrell

  • Posts: 7392
Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2013, 04:06 PM »
My observation of the Domino is that with proper dust extraction, CT w/ 27mm hose, it gets virtually all of the dust and leaves none in the mortise(s).

Maybe you have a partial plug?


Tom
Tom, I don't have the Domino XL but I remember other members mentioning that there is dust left in deep mortises.

Offline Tom Bellemare

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Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2013, 04:32 PM »
I'll have to check it out more carefully next time. Thanks for pointing that out, Brice.


Tom

Offline ccarrolladams

  • Posts: 1466
Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2013, 05:39 PM »
We now own 3 of the Domino 700 XL in addition to many Domino 500. One of my Domino 500 was the first delivered by my local dealer the minute that was legal.

Never in all those years has dust removal with 27mm AS hose and CT22s been an issue with either Domino machine.

Was the problem a kinked hose? Or the vac being turned to low suction?

As for a radical redesign of the bit, I will follow the opinion of Festool engineers. Considering that the bit rotates ate high speed while oscillating, it would be fascinating to lear a proposed engineering solution to hooking a hollow bit to the suction and moving dust through such a small hole.

Offline Alan m

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Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2013, 06:12 PM »
i think you would be better off blowing air down the bit that trying to suck the dust through it. the air would blow the dust back to where the dc can suck it up
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

Offline Tom Bellemare

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Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2013, 06:51 PM »
You just described a gun drill, Alan, except a gun drill uses cutting fluid down the center of the bit. They can drill incredibly deep in quite hard metals, depending on how high the fluid pressure is. Machine shops that specialize in drilling deep and straight use specially designed pumps because the fluid pressure stiffens otherwise relatively flacid bits.

The air pressure would have to be incredibly high (it's a gas) to mimic the characteristics of a gun drill filled with cutting "fluid". Oil well drill bits also have drilling mud running down the drill pipe and into the bits but I don't think it would be very practical in the case of a Domino bit. A Domino bit is a router bit and that requires a lot more structure than even a twist drill, much less a gun drill.

I also don't think it's necessary or of any significant value.


Tom

Offline cgraham

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Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2013, 08:06 PM »
I originally wrote this post as more of a " wow, wouldn't that be cool" than as a serious problem with the domino.  I get a kick out of the responses to various posts about how important dust control is to people. That is why I commented on how much dust is left in the domino mortises. Just finished a cedar table and the mortises were 50mm deep and the pile of sawdust left in each mortise was very substantial.  Not a big deal. Just flipped the posts over and knocked it out.

Offline ScotF

  • Posts: 2895
Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2013, 11:26 PM »
At the Festool Road School Allen kept the Domino 700 in place fully plunged for a couple of seconds on each cut and that cleared virtually all of the chips and dust from the mortises.  If you go quickly I think that it leaves more in the holes.

Scot

Offline greg mann

  • Posts: 1907
Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2013, 01:53 PM »
At the Festool Road School Allen kept the Domino 700 in place fully plunged for a couple of seconds on each cut and that cleared virtually all of the chips and dust from the mortises.  If you go quickly I think that it leaves more in the holes.

Scot


Good advice here. Just dwell a bit at the bottom of the cut to give the suction time to work. The physics of trying to get dust down the middle of the tool would require extreme levels of negative pressure and would be defeated by the far easier flow of air external to the tool, not to mention the vacuum would somhow need to be connect to the opposite end of the spindle which is oscillating back and forth at a good clip. I get the tongue in cheek part. This is somewhat like suggesting the use of skyhooks in place of a boom arm.
Greg Mann
Oakland, Michigan

Offline jacko9

  • Posts: 2381
Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2013, 08:45 PM »
You just described a gun drill, Alan, except a gun drill uses cutting fluid down the center of the bit. They can drill incredibly deep in quite hard metals, depending on how high the fluid pressure is. Machine shops that specialize in drilling deep and straight use specially designed pumps because the fluid pressure stiffens otherwise relatively flacid bits.

The air pressure would have to be incredibly high (it's a gas) to mimic the characteristics of a gun drill filled with cutting "fluid". Oil well drill bits also have drilling mud running down the drill pipe and into the bits but I don't think it would be very practical in the case of a Domino bit. A Domino bit is a router bit and that requires a lot more structure than even a twist drill, much less a gun drill.

I also don't think it's necessary or of any significant value.

Tom

I agree with Tom and I have a lot of experience with gun drilling and the center hole is very small which would necessitate high pressure gas to get the desired results and I'm not sure that can do that in wood machining.

Jack

Offline alkaline

  • Posts: 418
Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2013, 02:14 AM »
...I like to share with you the joy of a new member my Festool collection...
...its appearance reminds me of a war spaceship...
...and together with the Kapex I consider it the most impressive pair of Festool...
...which promises great entertainment...
...in this picture is spotless but just moment will be change...
...as with dust extraction I'll know in a minute  )))...

...good (next) day to all...


 [wink]

I have several boxes Festool, one MTF, four guide rails and big taste to play. )))

Offline SittingElf

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Re: More dust control for domino xl
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2013, 04:05 AM »
The German Festool TV guy on YouTube has a video demo'ing the XL. On every mortise, there is dust left which he pours out on the floor.   Not exactly the image that Festool wants to give I would think! 

Nonetheless, the mortises can just be vacuumed out pretty easily...no muss, no fuss....

Check out the video below at about 4:10 into the demo.



Woodworking is 3% talent and 97% paying attention to the FOG! 

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