Author Topic: Festool CXS Brushless  (Read 26996 times)

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Offline TelcoRandy

  • Posts: 230
Festool CXS Brushless
« on: September 28, 2013, 12:00 PM »
Does anyone know if Festool plans to make a brushless CXS? I scoured the forums and I found a quote from Shane Holland stating that:
It would have no longer been a compact drill if it had a brushless motor. It would have been a C12/15, which we will have later this year.

If brushless is what you want, we have a broad range of drills with brushless motors with more coming soon.  [wink]

If you want compact, technology has not progress to the point of being able to (at least at a reasonable price point) fit a brushless motor in a compact drill form factor.

However, Bosch is coming out with a 12V compact brushless drill/driver with the same weight as the CXS (.9kg or 1.98lbs). So since the technology is here now (2 years later), does this mean Festool will release an improved CXS?
http://toolguyd.com/bosch-12v-brushless-drill-screwdriver/

- Randy
« Last Edit: September 28, 2013, 12:06 PM by TelcoRandy »

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Offline Alex

  • Posts: 6563
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2013, 02:29 PM »
I think it is perfectly possible to make a brushless drill of any size. But if Festool will be making one is another matter. I wouldn't count on it on the short term.

Festool also won't be making any statements about it, they never tell anything about tools in development, until they hit the stores.

Offline TelcoRandy

  • Posts: 230
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2013, 12:23 AM »
I just don't like the idea behind the CXS having a disposable motor. In the same post that Shane made that quote, Johnny Round Boy showed a print of the CXS parts and stated that the motor had self-contained non-serviceable brushes and speculated that you would need to replace the entire motor if they ever wore out. This personally doesn't sit well with me. I think I'll hold out for the next Festool compact drill or maybe go with a competitor... I was hoping that someone might have some inside information to entice me to hold out for a new CXS but I guess that'll never happen.

Offline mrB

  • Posts: 712
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #3 on: October 03, 2013, 04:53 AM »
I love the size, weight, ergonomics of my CXS so much - that I often end up using it when I should probably have a bigger drill in my hand.

I would like festool to make this drill brushless, and if they do, i'll add one to my gear.

I am not really worried, however, about it wearing out.  It has an intelligent electronic cut out to protect the motor from 'self harm' and should therefore last as long/longer than any other normal cordless I've had.

It really is the best drill i've ever held and what I really wish, is that they come out with a more powerful version in the same form factor. If/When possible. I don't like the ergonomics of the C12/C15 sadly.
there's nothing like the right tool for the job

Offline TelcoRandy

  • Posts: 230
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2013, 12:39 PM »


This Bosch Brushless may be calling my name...

Offline Davej

  • Posts: 630
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2013, 01:44 PM »


This Bosch Brushless may be calling my name...

Not a true comparison , he should have shown all of the drills screwing a screw in each , as far as possible , not swapping over with the same screw.TThe cxs may not be brushless but it is brilliant.
I dont mind growing old but i refuse to grow up

Offline kieran62

  • Posts: 12
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2013, 01:48 PM »
Hi everyone, been a while since I've posted.

I've been using the brushed version of the Bosch for the last eighteen months and it is a powerful little drill.
However, in that time I've had the trigger repaired and been through four batteries (all Bosch originals), and today my fith battery failed  [mad]
I'm going to buy a CXS, not because I'm a fanboy, but a three year warranty on the drill and batteries will make it an investment
against downtime.
If Bosch sort out their issues with batteries (and I know I'm not the only person to have had problems), it will be a handy sized drill with lots of torque,
but until I see some reviews of real world use, I'll be steering clear.

Kieran

Offline mike68au

  • Posts: 213
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2013, 06:56 PM »
I recently sold 2 of the Bosch Models after trying and buying the CXS.  The balance comfort and control of the drill is way better / superior. 
The Bosch's were great but i definitely prefer the CXS

As for driving in those big screws,  not a chance i would consider doing that with a small 10.8v drill..... thats what my bigger drills are for. 

Offline PreferrablyWood

  • Posts: 916
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2013, 03:44 AM »
I'll be in the market for th CXS as a handy go everywhere tool, the handling seems to be it's strong point. I would not worry about it not being brushless at all.
Vecturo OSC, BHC SDS, RO 150, 850 HL E Planer rustic head standard head angle fence, MFS 400x2, MFS extensions MFS VB 700 x 1 MFS VB 1000 x 2 . CMS GE, sliding fence, VB and 2x VL extension tables, OF 2200, Accessory Set ZS OF 2200 M,36mm 5m antistatik hose, CMS OF+ CMS TS 75 insert modules. SYS-MFT Fixing-Set,  3.5m sleeved hose, Syslite duo, Sys 4 sort 3 x3, Sys Roll, Sys 1 Box x2 , classic Sys 3-Sort 4, classic Sys 3 Sort 6 x2, Sys Cart x3 Systainer 4 x2  as toolbox with selfmade inserts Systainer 5 as toolbox with insert.
Festool 18V HKC 55 Li 5.2 EB Plus FSK 420,FSK 250, Extra blade for the HKC 55 W32.TI 15, CXS 2.6 Ah version, RO 90 DX, PDC 18/4 plus DC UNI FF depth stop chuck,AD 3/8 square socket holder FF chuck, Centrotec Bits; -->Bit holder and bit selection BHS 65 CE TL 24x, ,Bradpoint DB WOOD CE SET ,Zobo (Forstner) D 15-35 CE-Zobo SET ,Masonary/stone bits DB STONE CE Set,Extender BV 150 CE, Countersink QLS D2-8 CE Hook turner HD D18, end centrotec<--.  TS 75 EBQ, PSC 420, OF 1010, RS 300 EQ, CTL Midi, MFT 3, Parf dogs x2pair +Bench dogs x2pair, FS 1080, FS 1900 .  will get Domino DF 700 XL,  CMS insert BS 120 Belt sander.

Offline Holz-Her

  • Posts: 50
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #9 on: December 13, 2013, 03:54 PM »
i like both :)


Offline SMJoinery

  • Posts: 530
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #10 on: December 13, 2013, 04:02 PM »
I've had my CXS for 2 weeks and love it.
This week it's been pre drilling and fixing oak door linings and hinges to doors etc
It's driving 70mm (4x70) screws no problem at all and swapping between Jacobs churck with centre drill / countersink and centrotec driver has been superb.
Batteries charge very quickly and last ages.
Balance and power are amazing for 10.8v but I have found that I prefer dewalt pz2 bits to festool!
Scott

Offline Jon Hilgenberg

  • Posts: 1113
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2013, 06:11 PM »
Love my cxs, but it's time to send the batteries in.  I've owned it since it came out and have abused it daily on cabinet installs.  Greatest festool I own, besides the ts55.

Jon
The more Festools I buy, the more money I earn.  The more money I earn, the more Festools I buy.  The more...
TS 55, TS 75, Domino, CT22, OF 2000, C12, CXS, RAS, Trion, Fogtainers!

Offline rl4020

  • Posts: 2
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #12 on: April 04, 2014, 07:02 AM »
love the cxs had one for about a year until someone stole it.  But I don't think I would get another one until it has more power.  They need to make a brushless one with as much power or more than the milwaukee fuel 12v brushless

Offline toolslut

  • Posts: 1
    • TheFrenchEscape
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2014, 11:40 AM »
For what it's worth I currently own a set of the Bosch 10.8 including drill driver/impact/reciprocating and mult-tool and I wouldn't buy them again.
The drill driver is powerful but has intermittent faults (light comes on and won't go off, stuttering power). The multitool makes my ears bleed (it's unbelievable) and the reciprocating saw won't eject the blades as the mechanism is prone to fouling with dust. The impact is fine but all of the batteries have lost the clips due to rather rubbishy plastic and fall out unless held in with tape (not good). One of the 3 batteries lasts a while but the others I use in the torch which is OK.
So after 1 and a bit years of use I'm not impressed.
I intend to buy the CXS as I need a decent angle attachment, i'll keep the Bosch impact until it gives up.
I would like to see a 3 or 4Ah battery for the CXS in an ideal world.
Good luck either way. Maybe I've been unlucky.
Measure twice, cut when no one's looking.

Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #14 on: June 06, 2014, 04:14 PM »
I love my CXS, but it needs to get a bigger capacity battery. The larger drills have been developing in that area, so should the CXS.

Some more Ah in the batteries would be nice to have on the CXS. The rest can stay the way it is.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline w802h

  • Posts: 221
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #15 on: June 06, 2014, 04:36 PM »
I bought the Milwaukee Fuel 12v Brushless Screwdriver.  It is a real tool, not a toy and I'm very happy with it.  It's weight isn't noticeable hanging from my belt, yet it has a lot of power for it's size, and a tight chuck.  I would have gotten the CSX if the battery was compatible with my Syslite, but I like my choice.  The CSX has angle attachments, but they have more plastic than the larger Festool drills - and for the amount that I need 90 degree technology I have a manual attachment, plus the M12 has a shorter length.  Also, I wanted to use standard bits and not get locked into Centrotec, but each their own. 

Re:
« Reply #16 on: June 06, 2014, 11:04 PM »
+1Milwaukee M12 Fuel , CXS is a fine drill dont get me wrong.

Offline festivus

  • Posts: 176
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #17 on: June 07, 2014, 06:46 AM »
love the cxs had one for about a year until someone stole it.  But I don't think I would get another one until it has more power.  They need to make a brushless one with as much power or more than the milwaukee fuel 12v brushless

I'm glad that I'm not the only one who finds the CXS a little underpowered. It's a great drill - don't get me wrong. But with the amount of rave reviews it gets I thought initially I'd got a dud! I think it's great cabinet making tool. Can imagine it's great for kitchens also (although I don't do this). But really struggles with any general purpose use and more often than not I just pick up the PDC since I know it'll handle any task.


Offline Ajax

  • Posts: 194
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #18 on: June 07, 2014, 04:46 PM »
Was thinking about getting the CSX, but I'm happy with my Bosch 12v lineup.  At $295 for a CSX kit, switching out of Bosch was cost prohibitive.

I have the PS20 (driver), PS31 (drill), PS41(impact), PS11 (right angle), and two LED flash lights.  They have served me well and I have 6 x 12v batteries on hand.  They charge fast. 
I also have a Bosch 18v drill and an impact driver with a number of high capacity batteries and flashlights.  Again, I'm very happy with them.

I just ordered the PS22 (brushless driver).  The PS20 has served me well, but the price was right on the newer PS22 driver after the $20 Bosch instant rebate.  So now I have 2 more batteries and a charger for ~$130.

Festool needs to show me something unique that I can't get in Bosch to justify the great cost.
Kapex KS120, MFT/3, TS55 REQ, LS130, RTS400, RO90 DX FEQ, D90 Assortment, RO150 REQ, ETS 150/3, PRO5, D150 Assortment, DF 500, Domino 4/5/8/10 Assortment, DF700 XL, Domino 12/14 Assortment,  CT Midi, MFT/3, Kapex MFT, 2 x SysRoll

Offline h.gil

  • Posts: 111
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #19 on: June 07, 2014, 05:53 PM »
I am still on the fence regarding the CSX. I've been long waiting for the C15 to come with 4.2 ah packs, as I could use them on the SysLite. I too have several Bosch 12v tools, though I lost the right-angle driver, I still have the impact, driver, and multitool. I've had them since they first came out sometime in 2006~7. I used to have 8 battery packs but they all died prematurely I would say, only one was left and I would id' it by the white fast cap I stuck on the bottom; the retaining tabs had gone on it so I would use green tape to hold it in place. The other day noticed it wouldn't come out of the multi-x, it was then that I noticed someone had switched on me; the one I had was 1.5ah and they left a 1.3ah (first gen). So now I have and unknown old battery and I am eager to either replace the kit with a CXS and a corded Fein, or keep buying into Bosch.

If Festool comes out with a 2ah+ battery pack then it would be a far easier decision, but until then, I'll just wait it out. 

Offline epicxt

  • Posts: 427
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2014, 06:08 PM »
I am still on the fence regarding the CSX. I've been long waiting for the C15 to come with 4.2 ah packs, as I could use them on the SysLite.
Quick question- couldn't find the answer from a brief search: can the 3.0 Ah batteries that come stock with the c15 be used with the syslite? Seems like they should be compatible.
n = number of Festools I've got.  (n + 1) = Festools I want

Offline Brice Burrell

  • Posts: 7384
  • Remodeling Contractor
    • The Green and Dark Blue blog
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #21 on: June 07, 2014, 08:42 PM »
I am still on the fence regarding the CSX. I've been long waiting for the C15 to come with 4.2 ah packs, as I could use them on the SysLite.
Quick question- couldn't find the answer from a brief search: can the 3.0 Ah batteries that come stock with the c15 be used with the syslite? Seems like they should be compatible.

Yes, all Festool batteries from the last 6-7 years work with the syslite with the exception of the CXS batteries and some really old style Festool batteries.
Check out my new blog, The Green and Dark Blue Blog.

Offline Ajax

  • Posts: 194
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #22 on: June 07, 2014, 09:28 PM »
I am still on the fence regarding the CSX. I've been long waiting for the C15 to come with 4.2 ah packs, as I could use them on the SysLite.
Quick question- couldn't find the answer from a brief search: can the 3.0 Ah batteries that come stock with the c15 be used with the syslite? Seems like they should be compatible.

Wow.  That stinks.  I have about 6 batteries and they all are still working.
Kapex KS120, MFT/3, TS55 REQ, LS130, RTS400, RO90 DX FEQ, D90 Assortment, RO150 REQ, ETS 150/3, PRO5, D150 Assortment, DF 500, Domino 4/5/8/10 Assortment, DF700 XL, Domino 12/14 Assortment,  CT Midi, MFT/3, Kapex MFT, 2 x SysRoll

Offline epicxt

  • Posts: 427
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2014, 12:59 PM »
I am still on the fence regarding the CSX. I've been long waiting for the C15 to come with 4.2 ah packs, as I could use them on the SysLite.
Quick question- couldn't find the answer from a brief search: can the 3.0 Ah batteries that come stock with the c15 be used with the syslite? Seems like they should be compatible.

Yes, all Festool batteries from the last 6-7 years work with the syslite with the exception of the CXS batteries and some really old style Festool batteries.
Thanks Brice! I figured they would but from a previous post it sounded like they wouldn't. Going to have to replace my old nicad c12 sometime soon and wanted to be sure!
n = number of Festools I've got.  (n + 1) = Festools I want

Offline Brice Burrell

  • Posts: 7384
  • Remodeling Contractor
    • The Green and Dark Blue blog
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #24 on: June 08, 2014, 01:31 PM »
I am still on the fence regarding the CSX. I've been long waiting for the C15 to come with 4.2 ah packs, as I could use them on the SysLite.
Quick question- couldn't find the answer from a brief search: can the 3.0 Ah batteries that come stock with the c15 be used with the syslite? Seems like they should be compatible.

Yes, all Festool batteries from the last 6-7 years work with the syslite with the exception of the CXS batteries and some really old style Festool batteries.
Thanks Brice! I figured they would but from a previous post it sounded like they wouldn't. Going to have to replace my old nicad c12 sometime soon and wanted to be sure!

NiCad batteries work in the Syslite. if anyone out there is wondering.
Check out my new blog, The Green and Dark Blue Blog.

Offline h.gil

  • Posts: 111
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #25 on: June 09, 2014, 07:38 PM »
I was just looking on amazon.ca and it seems the desicion is easier now: (2)12v-2ah batteries+charger+L-boxx1 for only $84.00 CAD.

I am still on the fence regarding the CSX. I've been long waiting for the C15 to come with 4.2 ah packs, as I could use them on the SysLite.
Quick question- couldn't find the answer from a brief search: can the 3.0 Ah batteries that come stock with the c15 be used with the syslite? Seems like they should be compatible.

Yes, all Festool batteries from the last 6-7 years work with the syslite with the exception of the CXS batteries and some really old style Festool batteries.
Thanks Brice! I figured they would but from a previous post it sounded like they wouldn't. Going to have to replace my old nicad c12 sometime soon and wanted to be sure!

I meant as opposed to the CXS packs.

Offline PreferrablyWood

  • Posts: 916
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #26 on: October 14, 2014, 10:01 AM »
To buy or not to buy, all this dicussing to and fro about the CXS is slowly eroding all my perspective, I just want it to stop, stop to just STOP ! , I get the CXS okay okay OKAY.....?

oh ah hmmm,, whelle excuse me,,,  but I erhh ah I have to admit I have another hidden motive that is eating me on up from th inside out on this subject CXS versus whoever else,  yup makes the dicussion a little jarring on my nerves, i admit I feel a sense of growing unease, well it's kind of like this you know , I better own up it and get to the point, it just seems plain wrong to have all those centrotec bits I've been harping on about and only have ONE drill to use them in.. Yes it is just pathetic, I think I'll go get me a CXS at the first operatunity..
« Last Edit: October 14, 2014, 10:13 AM by PreferrablyWood »
Vecturo OSC, BHC SDS, RO 150, 850 HL E Planer rustic head standard head angle fence, MFS 400x2, MFS extensions MFS VB 700 x 1 MFS VB 1000 x 2 . CMS GE, sliding fence, VB and 2x VL extension tables, OF 2200, Accessory Set ZS OF 2200 M,36mm 5m antistatik hose, CMS OF+ CMS TS 75 insert modules. SYS-MFT Fixing-Set,  3.5m sleeved hose, Syslite duo, Sys 4 sort 3 x3, Sys Roll, Sys 1 Box x2 , classic Sys 3-Sort 4, classic Sys 3 Sort 6 x2, Sys Cart x3 Systainer 4 x2  as toolbox with selfmade inserts Systainer 5 as toolbox with insert.
Festool 18V HKC 55 Li 5.2 EB Plus FSK 420,FSK 250, Extra blade for the HKC 55 W32.TI 15, CXS 2.6 Ah version, RO 90 DX, PDC 18/4 plus DC UNI FF depth stop chuck,AD 3/8 square socket holder FF chuck, Centrotec Bits; -->Bit holder and bit selection BHS 65 CE TL 24x, ,Bradpoint DB WOOD CE SET ,Zobo (Forstner) D 15-35 CE-Zobo SET ,Masonary/stone bits DB STONE CE Set,Extender BV 150 CE, Countersink QLS D2-8 CE Hook turner HD D18, end centrotec<--.  TS 75 EBQ, PSC 420, OF 1010, RS 300 EQ, CTL Midi, MFT 3, Parf dogs x2pair +Bench dogs x2pair, FS 1080, FS 1900 .  will get Domino DF 700 XL,  CMS insert BS 120 Belt sander.

Offline GOT8SPD

  • Posts: 230
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #27 on: October 14, 2014, 09:47 PM »
To buy or not to buy, all this dicussing to and fro about the CXS is slowly eroding all my perspective, I just want it to stop, stop to just STOP ! , I get the CXS okay okay OKAY.....?

oh ah hmmm,, whelle excuse me,,,  but I erhh ah I have to admit I have another hidden motive that is eating me on up from th inside out on this subject CXS versus whoever else,  yup makes the dicussion a little jarring on my nerves, i admit I feel a sense of growing unease, well it's kind of like this you know , I better own up it and get to the point, it just seems plain wrong to have all those centrotec bits I've been harping on about and only have ONE drill to use them in.. Yes it is just pathetic, I think I'll go get me a CXS at the first operatunity..

This is quite the rant.  I'm not even sure what you said.

Offline PreferrablyWood

  • Posts: 916
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #28 on: October 16, 2014, 05:09 AM »
To buy or not to buy, all this dicussing to and fro about the CXS is slowly eroding all my perspective, I just want it to stop, stop to just STOP ! , I get the CXS okay okay OKAY.....?

oh ah hmmm,, whelle excuse me,,,  but I erhh ah I have to admit I have another hidden motive that is eating me on up from th inside out on this subject CXS versus whoever else,  yup makes the dicussion a little jarring on my nerves, i admit I feel a sense of growing unease, well it's kind of like this you know , I better own up it and get to the point, it just seems plain wrong to have all those centrotec bits I've been harping on about and only have ONE drill to use them in.. Yes it is just pathetic, I think I'll go get me a CXS at the first operatunity..

This is quite the rant.  I'm not even sure what you said.

Yup I've spent too much time on forums so my brain overheated..

But to sum up, I think the Festool drills are superior to most drills out there because of the egronomics, and the Centrotec system. So during this whole long thread the Centrotec aspect is really never mentioned, the egronomics aren't either, notice for example the small 10v bosch drills don't have light, they are stubby as opposed to the CXS that is more sleek and narrow, the aright angle chuck and the centrotec chuck allow it to get into smaller spaces, the smaller jacobs chuck is brilliant for using smaller bits..

So I'd say the biggest attraction to the other non festool offerings in the 10v-12v range are basic they are cheaper, or that there are more choices of tool types like the recipro saw etc.

For me the Centrotec and the egronomics are what push to the Festool Drills, and the CXS is the ONE to get according to most users here.. The one gripe seems to be the low capacity of the batteries, but having two or three as well as the relatively fast charging time solves that problem. For heavier more demanding drilling and screwing jobs I have the PDC 18..
Vecturo OSC, BHC SDS, RO 150, 850 HL E Planer rustic head standard head angle fence, MFS 400x2, MFS extensions MFS VB 700 x 1 MFS VB 1000 x 2 . CMS GE, sliding fence, VB and 2x VL extension tables, OF 2200, Accessory Set ZS OF 2200 M,36mm 5m antistatik hose, CMS OF+ CMS TS 75 insert modules. SYS-MFT Fixing-Set,  3.5m sleeved hose, Syslite duo, Sys 4 sort 3 x3, Sys Roll, Sys 1 Box x2 , classic Sys 3-Sort 4, classic Sys 3 Sort 6 x2, Sys Cart x3 Systainer 4 x2  as toolbox with selfmade inserts Systainer 5 as toolbox with insert.
Festool 18V HKC 55 Li 5.2 EB Plus FSK 420,FSK 250, Extra blade for the HKC 55 W32.TI 15, CXS 2.6 Ah version, RO 90 DX, PDC 18/4 plus DC UNI FF depth stop chuck,AD 3/8 square socket holder FF chuck, Centrotec Bits; -->Bit holder and bit selection BHS 65 CE TL 24x, ,Bradpoint DB WOOD CE SET ,Zobo (Forstner) D 15-35 CE-Zobo SET ,Masonary/stone bits DB STONE CE Set,Extender BV 150 CE, Countersink QLS D2-8 CE Hook turner HD D18, end centrotec<--.  TS 75 EBQ, PSC 420, OF 1010, RS 300 EQ, CTL Midi, MFT 3, Parf dogs x2pair +Bench dogs x2pair, FS 1080, FS 1900 .  will get Domino DF 700 XL,  CMS insert BS 120 Belt sander.

Offline festivus

  • Posts: 176
Re: Festool CXS Brushless
« Reply #29 on: October 16, 2014, 05:32 AM »
The combination of CXS and PDC is very hard to beat!

I do have the installer's kit too which is expensive and many items in it get unused - but the items I do use ooze quality except the long bits which seem to be made of plastic and have to be used with caution - I only use if absolutely have to!