Author Topic: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum  (Read 8466 times)

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Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« on: December 18, 2020, 10:18 AM »
My first post on the forum!

My wife is giving me some new tool money for Christmas and I am heavily considering a Festool sander.  Right now I get by with a Ridgid planer and a 5" Dewalt random orbit sander.  I am only a hobby woodworker and my projects involve mostly furniture such as bookshelves, dressers, chairs and benches for family, cutting boards and recently I've been doing some resin serving trays.  I HATE SANDING.... let me repeat... I HATE SANDING.

I was initially thinking of a Rotex RO 125 or 150 since I can still use the Dewalt for smaller detail stuff.  Then I started reading more articles about the ETS EC 125 and 150 and started leaning that way.   I can't afford both since I will also have to get a dust collection system for the Festool (I'm thinking of a CT 26).  I'm currently using a shop vac and air cleaning unit for dust collection. Here in Canada the Rotex 125 and CT 26 will run me about $2,000 with tax and that is definitely pushing my upper limit.

Any advice from the experts here on forum on either the sander choice or dust collection is greatly appreciated!

Thank you.


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Offline afish

  • Posts: 323
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2020, 11:55 AM »
Im no sander expert and newer to the festool sander line as well.  I guess Im wondering what you are looking for from a festool sander that you are not getting from your Dewalt.  I think that might help determine which sander is best.  I was in your situation and used mostly sanders from Dewalt.  My main need for switching was better dust control and I wanted a sander for getting into corners better.  So I landed on the ets 125 req and the dts 400 combo. 

Based on your post it sounds like you are looking for better dust control since you want to add a ct 26 and cut down on sanding time.  The cutting down on sanding time is where it gets tricky.  I dont see a big improvement in sanding time between dewalt 5" RO and festool 5" RO like I do with dust control and comfort from less vibration.  You will reduce sanding time moving from a 5" to 6" so if you sand a lot of large flat panels then a 6" will work well.  Smaller confined areas a 5" will be better.  The best part is in the case of the ETS EC 125 you get both a 5" and 6" in one sander since you can swap out the 150 pad onto the 125 but just FYI you CANNOT put the 125 pad on the 150

As far as a Rotex sander goes based on your projects Im not sure if its the right fit but I have no experience with them only what I have read.  Im sure other will weigh in on this but I do know if I was looking at getting a rotex sander I would be getting the Bosch GET65 or 75 many agree its 90-95% as good as the rotex for half the money.  Going this way it might free up enough cash to get 2 sanders.

So based on the info given thus far im leaning towards the ETS EC 125 for you with adding the 150 pad. 

Offline Stan Tillinghast

  • Posts: 168
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2020, 12:20 PM »
I’m a hobbyist with occasional experience but have a number of Festool sanders (RO 125, RO 90, ETS 125 EQ, ETS EC 125 + 150 mm pad).
I am surprised at how much I like the ETS EC 125 for lack of vibration, ergonomics, and dust collection; and there’s no doubt that you can change it to 150 mm (6 inch) with just changing the pad.
So I’d start with that.
For a second sander, the RO 90 gives you corner sanding capability together with Rotex sanding with its greater stock removal, but for smaller areas.
Festool’s dust collection makes it possible for me to do woodworking with power tools; I find sawdust extremely irritating to my nasal passages.
In addition, you can use your track saw and sander in your Sunday-go-to-meetin’ clothes :-).

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2020, 12:29 PM »
Im no sander expert and newer to the festool sander line as well.  I guess Im wondering what you are looking for from a festool sander that you are not getting from your Dewalt.  I think that might help determine which sander is best.  I was in your situation and used mostly sanders from Dewalt.  My main need for switching was better dust control and I wanted a sander for getting into corners better.  So I landed on the ets 125 req and the dts 400 combo. 

Based on your post it sounds like you are looking for better dust control since you want to add a ct 26 and cut down on sanding time.  The cutting down on sanding time is where it gets tricky.  I dont see a big improvement in sanding time between dewalt 5" RO and festool 5" RO like I do with dust control and comfort from less vibration.  You will reduce sanding time moving from a 5" to 6" so if you sand a lot of large flat panels then a 6" will work well.  Smaller confined areas a 5" will be better.  The best part is in the case of the ETS EC 125 you get both a 5" and 6" in one sander since you can swap out the 150 pad onto the 125 but just FYI you CANNOT put the 125 pad on the 150

As far as a Rotex sander goes based on your projects Im not sure if its the right fit but I have no experience with them only what I have read.  Im sure other will weigh in on this but I do know if I was looking at getting a rotex sander I would be getting the Bosch GET65 or 75 many agree its 90-95% as good as the rotex for half the money.  Going this way it might free up enough cash to get 2 sanders.

So based on the info given thus far im leaning towards the ETS EC 125 for you with adding the 150 pad.

Hmm, being able to switch backing pads to upsize makes the ETS EC 125 seem like the best option right now.  I'll also go check out the Bosch though thanks.

Offline Alex

  • Posts: 7056
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2020, 12:59 PM »
I'd also say the ETS EC 125 + 150 mm pad might be the best fit for you from the sanders you mention. DTS400 is always nice too. Out of the 13 different Festool sanders I've owned the DTS is my most used one.

Offline xedos

  • Posts: 451
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2020, 05:47 PM »
Based on what you're making , I don't see a real benefit for a Rotex, and a big drawback.

A rotex isn't likely to make you enjoy sanding.  It's a capable machine, but it's not a smooth performer, and it requires two hands.

As mentioned already, the EC125 is a great sander -and-  is one of those kinds of sanders guys say changes their mind about hating to sand.   I concur on the Bosch GET75 if you really need / want the capability of an aggressive sander.   Especially for the hobbyist.

Offline Stan Tillinghast

  • Posts: 168
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2020, 05:53 PM »
Hammy -
Are you near a Festool dealer? They all have demo tools, which for a beginner especially is a big advantage in making decisions.
Even if you buy it online, you still have 30 days to return the purchase without question, as I understand it.

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2020, 06:11 PM »
Hammy -
Are you near a Festool dealer? They all have demo tools, which for a beginner especially is a big advantage in making decisions.
Even if you buy it online, you still have 30 days to return the purchase without question, as I understand it.

Thanks, there is a local dealer but they have very limited demos on hand, basically a ETS 150 and that's it.  I like to buy local so maybe the ETS EC 125 and the adaptor hose is the way for me to go.  I don't plan on any other Festool purchases in the near future so $1,000 vacuum system would not be worth it if there's a viable alternative. 

Offline afish

  • Posts: 323
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2020, 09:25 PM »
I use a 6hp shop vac that I located in a shed and ran 2" sch40 approx. 30' worth and nine 90's in total to a cen-tec hose for 40 bucks that drops out of the ceiling.  It works great for all track saw, sander, router operations that I use it for.  Since its in another building I barely hear it.  If I did mobile work I would have a CT and still might depending on the Planex.  However, for shop use I actually love my setup. Plus it keeps it out of the shop area saving valuable floor space which is a huuuuge bonus. I trigger it with a 3 channel RF outlet from HD for like 30 bucks.  I was actually thinking about getting the CT48AC the last couple days but after more thought I really dont see a need.  You can always build an enclosure for the shop vac if you dont have a shed. 

Offline Mortiser

  • Posts: 75
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2020, 09:35 PM »
I have the ETS EC125 and the Rotex 125. I like them both, for building furniture. I bought the Rotex first. I use the the ETS EC 125 about 90% of the time. I love that sander. Get the ETS EC125 (and the 150 pad - later if necessary) and the CT26. You won't believe that sanding can be enjoyable and is no longer a chore.

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #10 on: December 19, 2020, 08:15 AM »
I have the ETS EC125 and the Rotex 125. I like them both, for building furniture. I bought the Rotex first. I use the the ETS EC 125 about 90% of the time. I love that sander. Get the ETS EC125 (and the 150 pad - later if necessary) and the CT26. You won't believe that sanding can be enjoyable and is no longer a chore.

Thanks Mortiser between the advice here and from other research I think I'm going to go with the ETS EC 125 and adaptor hose for my existing shop vac, all in I'll still be under $1,000 Canadian.

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 2031
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2020, 10:29 AM »
@hammy You mentioned an adapter hose. Rockler sells a kit with several adapters that adapted existing vac connections to Festool sanders (and other Festool tools).

The only thing I would say is that I notice a difference in results and wear and tear on my hands from using a Festool sander and the ETS 125 is a good one. I also notice a huge improvement in dust collection since using a Festool vac and sander together. I'm not sure whether the combo is what makes the most difference or just the sander or just the vac, but together they can't be beat for dust collection and sanding results.
Randy

Offline xedos

  • Posts: 451
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #12 on: December 19, 2020, 10:38 AM »
I see no one has talked about your vacuum dilemma. 

On one hand, a vacuum is a vacuum.  On the other, there are some good reasons some cost more than $500.

The price starts to climb when a better turbine is spec'd, and again when noise attenuation is built in so you don't hear that whine.  Add a cartridge filter - more $.  HEPA filter - still more $$$.   Most of the $500+ vacs have variable suction, which is very useful for sanding.  Especially finish sanding.    Then there's the tool triggered receptacle.   You'll wonder how you lived without one once you've tried it.

Festool takes it further and adds remote control (bluetooth) , an uber premium hose that's supple and smooth, onboard concealed hose storage , and the ability to stack the systainers for storage , transport and just general use.   Again , all add $ $ $ to the final cost.   Is all that worth it ?      That's a conversation as old as..............................

with no answer.

As to you getting a CT26.   I'd suggest looking smaller, like a mini/midi.   Same performance and features, only the capacity is reduced compared to the 26.   Still have plenty of capacity for the hobbyist.    I have them for professional install teams and we're not changing the bag every day because it's too small like some may have your believe.

Karcher makes a quiet vac at around $200, but not really in the same league.    Lots of guys like Fein, though it's still expensive and has less performance compared to FT. 

For an 'adapter" - I'd offer this:

https://www.amazon.com/Cen-Tec-Systems-94192-Universal-Collection/dp/B07NZZZ5ZL/ref=sr_1_31?dchild=1&keywords=powertec+hose&qid=1608390540&sr=8-31

Good hose, and it'll allow you to regulate the suction somewhat.  Something your other hose / adapter options are not going to do.   That Rockler offering looks spiffy at first blush, and the adapters are sweet.   However, the hose is terrible, just awful.


« Last Edit: December 19, 2020, 10:48 AM by xedos »

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 8017
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #13 on: December 19, 2020, 10:55 AM »
If you'll be using a regular Shop Vac with the ETS EC 125, you'll need to bleed off some of the suction and that could get noisy.

I run the ETS EC 125 on an older CT 22 at the 1/4 level or less. They don't like to be used at high vacuum levels.

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #14 on: December 19, 2020, 11:30 AM »
I see no one has talked about your vacuum dilemma. 

On one hand, a vacuum is a vacuum.  On the other, there are some good reasons some cost more than $500.

The price starts to climb when a better turbine is spec'd, and again when noise attenuation is built in so you don't hear that whine.  Add a cartridge filter - more $.  HEPA filter - still more $$$.   Most of the $500+ vacs have variable suction, which is very useful for sanding.  Especially finish sanding.    Then there's the tool triggered receptacle.   You'll wonder how you lived without one once you've tried it.

Festool takes it further and adds remote control (bluetooth) , an uber premium hose that's supple and smooth, onboard concealed hose storage , and the ability to stack the systainers for storage , transport and just general use.   Again , all add $ $ $ to the final cost.   Is all that worth it ?      That's a conversation as old as..............................

with no answer.

As to you getting a CT26.   I'd suggest looking smaller, like a mini/midi.   Same performance and features, only the capacity is reduced compared to the 26.   Still have plenty of capacity for the hobbyist.    I have them for professional install teams and we're not changing the bag every day because it's too small like some may have your believe.

Karcher makes a quiet vac at around $200, but not really in the same league.    Lots of guys like Fein, though it's still expensive and has less performance compared to FT. 

For an 'adapter" - I'd offer this:

https://www.amazon.com/Cen-Tec-Systems-94192-Universal-Collection/dp/B07NZZZ5ZL/ref=sr_1_31?dchild=1&keywords=powertec+hose&qid=1608390540&sr=8-31

Good hose, and it'll allow you to regulate the suction somewhat.  Something your other hose / adapter options are not going to do.   That Rockler offering looks spiffy at first blush, and the adapters are sweet.   However, the hose is terrible, just awful.

Thanks this is excellent info, the noise isn't really an issue since I'm always wearing hearing protection but I didn't consider the variable suction aspect, my shop vac obviously won't do that.  I am trying to keep dust down as much as possible and the Festool clearly does that.  I'd also like to have a little vac if just for the sander so I wouldn't have to drag the shop vac hose around as much. 

Thanks again this is excellent!

Offline xedos

  • Posts: 451
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #15 on: December 19, 2020, 11:38 AM »
For your situation as describe, I'd say : bite the bullet and get the MINI. 

Cry once. It'll last your for years and years without the need for an upgrade.   Plus, if you do; you'll be able to recoup most of your money.  It'll be, in effect, a long term rental.

Offline rvieceli

  • Posts: 1348
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #16 on: December 19, 2020, 11:49 AM »
Or opt for the MIDI. Same foot print as the MINI 50% more capacity in the bags for $50 USD more. Consumables are all the same price since it's its the same upper with a taller tub on the bottom.

another option is finding a used one of craigslist or one of the other marketplaces. I picked up a CT22 earlier this year in excellent shape for around 200USD. Works great and consumables are still available.

Ron
« Last Edit: December 19, 2020, 11:52 AM by rvieceli »

Offline Alex

  • Posts: 7056
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #17 on: December 19, 2020, 12:26 PM »
+1 on the Mini.

I have a Mini and a Midi. The darn Midi keeps toppling over when you pull the hose. The Mini, never.

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 4981
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2020, 12:53 PM »
+1 on the Mini.

I have a Mini and a Midi. The darn Midi keeps toppling over when you pull the hose. The Mini, never.

I understand about the extra height/leverage of the hose vs. the Mini and the more top heavy aspect of the higher motor (especially with an empty bag in the tub) but have you checked if the front wheels are rolling as easily as they should?

Offline mrB

  • Posts: 806
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #19 on: December 19, 2020, 01:04 PM »
I'd also agree on the mini/midi with  ETS EC 125 as being a good option.

For hobbyist sanding I think the smaller vac will be fine and the ETS EC 125 would be my choice of Festool sander for all round use.

That said I'd take my Mirka Deros over my ETE EC 125 personally, but I do wonder if the Festool is the wiser long term purchase given reliability histories of these products and my personal faith in the lifespan of Festool.
there's nothing like the right tool for the job

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #20 on: December 19, 2020, 01:38 PM »
I'd also agree on the mini/midi with  ETS EC 125 as being a good option.

For hobbyist sanding I think the smaller vac will be fine and the ETS EC 125 would be my choice of Festool sander for all round use.

That said I'd take my Mirka Deros over my ETE EC 125 personally, but I do wonder if the Festool is the wiser long term purchase given reliability histories of these products and my personal faith in the lifespan of Festool.

Thanks Mr. B, why do you prefer the Mirka?

Offline afish

  • Posts: 323
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #21 on: December 19, 2020, 02:30 PM »
The centec hosehas a adjustable port to bleed off some of the vacuum if its to much.  Works like an old school vacuum with a port and a cover you twist to cover all or a portion of the port.

remote outlet is the one I use and it has never given me any issues.  I put some velcro on it and the hose so I can keep it close by or remove if needed.  I have channel 1 as the shop vac Channel 2 works the shop fans and channel 3 will be used to trigger a 2-3hp dust collector when I get it.  It only works on 120 so a contactor will be needed but the remote can be used to trigger the contactor. 

Most obstacles can be mitigated it just depends on how you will be using it and budget.  I would hate to lug around a shop vac but for dedicated shop use is a different story.

Offline xedos

  • Posts: 451
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #22 on: December 19, 2020, 03:05 PM »
afish - those remotes are handy - but are no substitute for a tool actuated vacuum.   Especially for sanding where one tends to start, stop and check progress, and then start again.

Offline mrB

  • Posts: 806
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #23 on: December 19, 2020, 03:10 PM »
I'd also agree on the mini/midi with  ETS EC 125 as being a good option.

For hobbyist sanding I think the smaller vac will be fine and the ETS EC 125 would be my choice of Festool sander for all round use.

That said I'd take my Mirka Deros over my ETE EC 125 personally, but I do wonder if the Festool is the wiser long term purchase given reliability histories of these products and my personal faith in the lifespan of Festool.


Thanks Mr. B, why do you prefer the Mirka?
The Mirka feels lower, lighter, more powerfu. Can be had in 5mm orbit while still having both pad size choices. The Mirka has more constant forced rotation where the festool goes from relatively still to rotating depending on the pressure applied. Also the pads have holes to accept all paper types not just festool hole patterns.

As stated I have more faith in the long term reliability of the festool as well as the long term parts availability and speed of ordering/repair  etc. And this is why I bought the ETS EC as my second/backup sander. I prefer the Mirka without doubt, but whenever have the ETS EC with me instead I’m happy with it.

I’m a daily/weekly professional user so happy to spend money these things. If I were a hobbyist I would want the extra value of festool reliability beyond the warranty period.

EDIT: Thought I'd add that I definitely feel the ETS EC has better Dust Collection than the Deros. The Deros is fine, just not as good as the Festool. This is my opinion using 125mm paper, not mesh, with the festool hole pattern on each machine.
Also the Festool likes a reduced suction a little more than the Deros cares. If that makes sense. .
« Last Edit: December 21, 2020, 07:08 PM by mrB »
there's nothing like the right tool for the job

Offline afish

  • Posts: 323
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #24 on: December 19, 2020, 03:28 PM »
I do have a tool activated vac (Fein) its handy but Its been in storage for years.  As I mentioned My shop vac is in a different building so if im only stopping for a minute or less I tend to just leave it running since its barely audible, but Its easy to turn on and off since the remote is always at hand if needed. If im just switching board out then it just stays on.  They do make aftermarket tool triggered outlets too but its been working good this way for years so I cant say I really miss it.  If I didnt have have it located where I dont have to hear it or had to tote it around it would be different story so its not that I dont see a value in a CT and was actually thinking about buying it since I have some extra funds set aside and was looking at the 48ac but just couldnt justify the purchase and add a 4th vac so I'm holding off on a CT until an actual need arises. 

Offline Thompmd

  • Posts: 186
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #25 on: December 19, 2020, 05:04 PM »
Welcome to the Forum & Festool! Don’t go to another brand! I have the CT36/RO150. Using the FT dust extractor and sanders will change HATE to at least
hate, I think even more. As mentioned it will last for years and you’ve already got money allocated... don’t let the opportunity get away.

I promise a year from now you won’t have any regrets.
Sawstop Industrial Saw, TS75,2 1400 rails, CT36, Rotex RO 150 FEQ, CT-VA-20, Carvex PS 420 EBQ, Carvex acc. ZH-SYS-PS 400, Kapex KS 120, CT Cyclone Dust Collection Pre-Separator CT VA 20, DF 500 Q Set, Domino 1,060pc Tenon Assortment, UG-KA-SET Portable Imperial Stand & Extensions,OF1400 EQ-F-Plus, MFT/3, MFT-SP, FS-HZ 160

Offline xedos

  • Posts: 451
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #26 on: December 19, 2020, 07:14 PM »
I do have a tool activated vac (Fein) its handy but Its been in storage for years.  As I mentioned My shop vac is in a different building so if im only stopping for a minute or less I tend to just leave it running since its barely audible, but Its easy to turn on and off since the remote is always at hand if needed. If im just switching board out then it just stays on.  They do make aftermarket tool triggered outlets too but its been working good this way for years so I cant say I really miss it.  If I didnt have have it located where I dont have to hear it or had to tote it around it would be different story so its not that I dont see a value in a CT and was actually thinking about buying it since I have some extra funds set aside and was looking at the 48ac but just couldnt justify the purchase and add a 4th vac so I'm holding off on a CT until an actual need arises.

Few people have a setup like that, and even fewer new vacuum buyers are going to go to the trouble to setup such either.

They’re too busy figuring out how to get people to “click subscribe”  [big grin]

Offline somewhereinla

  • Posts: 7
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #27 on: December 19, 2020, 09:06 PM »
I have many Festool sanders, but if I had to only have one, I would get the RO150. One of the best and most versatile sander ever made imo.

Offline aloysius

  • Posts: 455
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #28 on: December 19, 2020, 09:44 PM »
I don't really think you need to go to the expense of a Festool extractor.  There's plenty of much less expensive auto start/stop alternatives on the market which will amply fulfil your non-demanding requirements.

As far as a new sander is concerned, as you already have a serviceable rando there seems little point in purchasing another.  Perhaps, as others have suggested, a "standard" orbital with a delta-shaped platen would be quite versatile.  It's just about the only type that will provide access to those inconvenient nooks & crannies.

The current state of the art in delta-shaped sanders is from Mirka.  If you spend a proportion of your budget on a Mirka DEOS Delta sander & a lesser proportion on an aftermarket auto vac, then you should have lots of spare change to accumulate a selection of mesh abrasives to suit without blowing your budget.  You can always upgrade to a 125/150 Mirka DEROS rando later.
FOG-wit since '95:  Some say since birth...

Offline afish

  • Posts: 323
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #29 on: December 19, 2020, 11:07 PM »
It really depends on what your main use is, no one sander will handle everything.  I chose the DTS over the Mirka for one really simple reason.  It has a shorter body in length.  My main need for a delta sander was for getting into drawers and a shorter body length really helps along with the angle of the hose port.  The deros looks a lot longer than the DTS so it was a no go right from the start for me. I was going to live with the 125req and dts for awhile then the 125 will most likely live in the edge sanding guide.  I was thinking of adding the ec125/150 later but I now have my eye on the 3m pneumatic RO sanders I can get almost 3 of them for the same price as the festool and I actually probably prefer pneumatic sanders for shop use but I already have a large compressor so if you dont you have to factor that in.  An electric sander is much more convenient if you do mobile work at all.   
« Last Edit: December 20, 2020, 08:24 AM by afish »

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #30 on: December 20, 2020, 03:49 AM »
@hammy

As others have said, ETS EC 125 or 150.

I have the ETS EC 150/3 and it does just about everything even some good progress coarse work with 60 or 80 grit Granat. After this you might want to look at a sander with a delta capability and the RO90 would be good as you get the bonus of Rotex mode or the DTS400.

Whatever you get, for wood I always recommend Granat and you do not (normally) need to go above 180 or 220 grit. I use 80 grit 15% of the time, 120 grit 35% of the time and 180 grit the remaining 50 %.

Peter

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Offline mcooley

  • Posts: 262
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #31 on: December 20, 2020, 04:31 PM »
No complaints with the ETS 125 REQ with the smaller vac. I professionally build furniture and this is my go to sander for doing a range of tasks. When I need to remove more material I go to the Rotex 125 but the ETS 125 REQ is a much better solution for 120 grit and up etc. The Rotex line is notoriously difficult to control and I find the sander less ergonomically satisfying. Plus the sanding stroke on ETS 125 REQ is 2mm which is pretty fine. Preventing "pigtails" on the Rotex requires more care. I do recommend on all of the sanders NOT to use the vacs on full suction. That is usually how "pigtails" get out of control etc. I have also found being very deliberate about the motion one chooses helps and making sure you sand in both the horizontal and vertical direction like on a grid. The orbital does a much finer job if the "swirl pattern" gets finer and finer. The easiest way to do this is to have the sander pass evenly in those two directions. Using the orbital in a random fashion and picking up and placing down the unit a lot during sanding will leave a less uniform surface. Keeping a consistent rate of motion on the sanding pad is also important so less suction and sand paper that isn't gummed up helps. And lastly if sanding above 320 I would transition over to hand only. The reason for this is at those very high grits it will be very hard not to get any swirl patterns. Therefore, hand finishing works best and in most cases like in furniture ending at 320 is usually fine. Going higher on small surfaces like boxes and the like is more common etc.

Offline Alanbach

  • Posts: 620
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #32 on: December 20, 2020, 10:31 PM »
Buying your first Festool sander can be a tough financial nut to swallow and the real problem comes when you realize that you need variable suction. That makes that first purchase much more expensive. The good news is that once you have a Festool sander and a Festool CT vac you have accomplished two things. 1. You now can get the full benefit of a level of dust free sanding ease and even enjoyment that is hard to come by otherwise. 2. From that point on you will own a Festool vac. So if you contemplate other Festool tool purchases you will already own the vac. It may not be the most sexy purchase since it is pricey but it can then be put to use with the entire Festool system of tools. From other specialty sanders, Track saws, routers, to the Domino, you will be ready.

Offline mino

  • Posts: 69
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #33 on: December 21, 2020, 04:39 AM »
I would vote for the ETS 125 with the angle guide (aka ES ETS 125).

The guide allows uses not possible otherwise.

And +1 on a proper dust extractor with variable suction.
Mini/Midi + the Bluetooth remote for the hose. That thing is worth its weight in gold-pressed latinum!

EDIT: Forgot the Bluetooth remote use case. Oh, how can one ..
« Last Edit: December 21, 2020, 04:59 AM by mino »
C 12, TSC 55, BHC 18, DRC 18/4, PSC 420, AGC 18 (mod@AGC 125), CTM 36
Narex: EFH 36@LR32, EBV 230 (RS200), EDH 82, EVP 13 H-2CA
My Precious: FS 376/2, FS 376/2, FS 376/2 LR32, FS 632, FS 1016/2 LR32, FS 2500/2, 2x GRS 16 PE, GECKO DOSH

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2020, 07:04 PM »
New question as a follow up.  If I get the ETS EC 125, what would be the drawback with using my regular shop vac?  Would a hobby woodworker like me even notice the difference from using a variable speed vac?  I mean I've only used a Dewalt ROS and Shop vac for the past five years.

Thanks again!

Offline mrB

  • Posts: 806
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #35 on: December 21, 2020, 07:22 PM »
New question as a follow up.  If I get the ETS EC 125, what would be the drawback with using my regular shop vac?  Would a hobby woodworker like me even notice the difference from using a variable speed vac?  I mean I've only used a Dewalt ROS and Shop vac for the past five years.

Thanks again!

Ha, Literally just edited my last post to include the following. .

EDIT: Thought I'd add that I definitely feel the ETS EC has better Dust Collection than the Deros. The Deros is fine, just not as good as the Festool. This is my opinion using 125mm paper, not mesh, with the festool hole pattern on each machine.
Also the Festool likes a reduced suction a little more than the Deros cares. If that makes sense. .


I can't say it's a deal breaker, but I have noticed I often reach to reduce the suction on my Mini with the ETS EC as it can feel a little jumpy. If your vac is really powerful and you can't turn it down you might find the ETS EC not the smoothest ride. The Deros handles full power on the extractor much better.
there's nothing like the right tool for the job

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 4981
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #36 on: December 21, 2020, 09:30 PM »
I would vote for the ETS 125 with the angle guide (aka ES ETS 125).

The guide allows uses not possible otherwise.

And +1 on a proper dust extractor with variable suction.
Mini/Midi + the Bluetooth remote for the hose. That thing is worth its weight in gold-pressed latinum!

EDIT: Forgot the Bluetooth remote use case. Oh, how can one ..

Not so.

I’ve been sanding edges with my 125 for more than a dozen years. But I do plan to buy the edge guide because it will make the task easier, and probably turn out better.

Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #37 on: December 22, 2020, 09:56 AM »
I have many Festool sanders, but if I had to only have one, I would get the RO150. One of the best and most versatile sander ever made imo.
.

I agree.  I’ll praise the virtues of the RO150.  I’ve used for well over 10 years and would never be without one again.  Its versatility and durability are tough to beat.  It’s difficult to put into words what a time saver the rotex mode is.  Using the rotex mode in lower grits (I always use rotex mode through 120 grit, which is the grit I usually start at with a planed surface), and random orbit mode in higher grits gives you the best of both worlds.  While rotex mode is a two-handed operation, it really isn’t difficult to control at all.  And it acts as an easy-to-control finish sander in higher grits, producing excellent results.  I don’t notice any difference in the end results of the 5mm stroke vs. 2mm of my ETS 125.

If weight isn’t an issue, especially if sanding your work flat on the bench, I would choose the 6” over the 5” every time.  It is just such a time saver.  I use the ETS 125 for narrow work and sanding vertically (which is a role your DeWalt can continue to fill), but I use the RO150 for everything roughly 4” and wider.  Using the hard pad, and being just a bit attentive, greatly helps in maintaining crisp edges on pieces narrower than the pad size.

As mentioned, once you have a tool actuated switch on a vac and variable suction, you’ll wonder how you lived without it

The RO150/vacuum package is a lot of cash, no doubt.  But it is an investment that will pay dividends for years to come.  If something happened to either, I would replace them tomorrow. 

Whatever you choose, good luck!
 

Offline Jim_in_PA

  • Posts: 181
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #38 on: December 22, 2020, 10:31 AM »
New question as a follow up.  If I get the ETS EC 125, what would be the drawback with using my regular shop vac?  Would a hobby woodworker like me even notice the difference from using a variable speed vac?  I mean I've only used a Dewalt ROS and Shop vac for the past five years.

Thanks again!

Aside from noise...the singular downside is that the sander might get "sticky" as you get to the finer abrasives if it doesn't have a way to vary the speed/vacuum. The CT extractors (and some other higher-end vacuums) have controls that allow you to vary the suction. You can use a bleeder attachment on the hose if need be to simulate a "speed/vacuum" control, of course, but I never found them to be quite as effective as the electronic control on the front of my CT.

The "sticky" effect can be a little more noticeable with the Festool sanders because of the increased air flow design includingn the center hole. The combination of very fine abrasive being somewhat "smooth" and high vacuum makes for what starts to emulate a "vacuum clamp".
----
ETS 150/3, Rotex 150, OF1010, OF1400, Trion PS 300, TDK-12, CT-22, MFT 1080, TS55, Domino XL DF 700, 8' track, (2) 55" tracks

SCM MiniMax S315WS, FS350, MM16, Camaster Stinger II SR-44 CNC

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #39 on: December 22, 2020, 04:02 PM »
New question as a follow up.  If I get the ETS EC 125, what would be the drawback with using my regular shop vac?  Would a hobby woodworker like me even notice the difference from using a variable speed vac?  I mean I've only used a Dewalt ROS and Shop vac for the past five years.

Thanks again!

Aside from noise...the singular downside is that the sander might get "sticky" as you get to the finer abrasives if it doesn't have a way to vary the speed/vacuum. The CT extractors (and some other higher-end vacuums) have controls that allow you to vary the suction. You can use a bleeder attachment on the hose if need be to simulate a "speed/vacuum" control, of course, but I never found them to be quite as effective as the electronic control on the front of my CT.

The "sticky" effect can be a little more noticeable with the Festool sanders because of the increased air flow design includingn the center hole. The combination of very fine abrasive being somewhat "smooth" and high vacuum makes for what starts to emulate a "vacuum clamp".

Thanks, I can live with the noise since I always use hearing protection anyway.  My Shop Vac probably only sucks with half the force of the Festool Vac so I might be fine there as well.  I guess the only way to find out is to buy a sander and give it a whirl. 

I went from leaning towards the Rotex to the ETS EC but now think I am back to the 6" Rotex.  As a previous post mentioned I always have my Dewalt for small jobs anyway.  I don't currently have any type of belt sander so I can kill two birds with one stone with the Rotex.

Offline Alex

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Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #40 on: December 22, 2020, 06:36 PM »
My Shop Vac probably only sucks with half the force of the Festool Vac so I might be fine there as well. 

Don't count on it. The suction of Festool vacs is terrible. Common household vacs have better suction, and your shop vac probably also.

If you don't want to buy a vac, make a bleeder valve, with some sanders lower suction is a must or it will stick so hard to your surface you can't do proper work with it.

Offline mrB

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Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #41 on: December 22, 2020, 10:02 PM »
Well now rotex is in the conversation it’s another story.

It’s bigger and heavier and no where near as nice (in reality) when you’re sanding for hours swaping between surfaces and edges etc. . But the speed of rotex mode makes quick work of sanding a surface in a rather game changing way. It’s an awesome machine.

But it’s heavy and cumbersome, and anyone saying it’s not either haven’t tried to use it as their only sander for entire days of varied sanding tasks or hasn’t used sanders like the ETS EC or DEROS by comparison.

Love my rotex, and honestly it would be and actually was my only sander for a few years, but it’s not always ideal. For material removal it’s basically unrivalled out side of belt sanders, and for covering lots of flat surface with precision nothing else comes close. But there are many many sanding tasks that don’t need the rotex at all, and for those tasks the rotex makes you work a lot harder than the others being debated.

Ultimately there is no sander to beat all others. I have 5 right now and there are two more I still really want.

If you want to rapidly speed up certain sanding tasks the rotex is awesome, it removes so much material so quickly it can often replace a plane or flush cut router for certain tasks if needed.

If you are mostly finish sanding on a variety of projects and size of pieces then the ETS EC will be a joy to use compared with almost any other sander.

Edit: I never really rated the standard random orbit mode of the rotex sanders. It’s fine but always seemed lacking compared to a quality regular random orbit.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2020, 10:12 PM by mrB »
there's nothing like the right tool for the job

Offline Alanbach

  • Posts: 620
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #42 on: December 22, 2020, 11:28 PM »
If you hate sanding as your original post conveys I am not sure that the Rotex is a great choice as a first sander. If I were you I would get an ETS EC 125/3. It is a comfortable, ergonomic, easy to use one handed sander and if coupled with a Festool CT vac will change your opinion of sanding forever. The Rotex is a great sander but it is two handed, heavy and must be driven precisely. It makes you work at becoming its friend. Simply said it is a beast. Don’t get me wrong, I have an RO125 and I love it but I only pick it up when I need the beast. I use the ETS EC 70 plus % of the time because it is easy to use and is a great finish sander, it is super comfortable to use and I can use it during long sanding sessions with ease.

Offline Cheese

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Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #43 on: December 23, 2020, 12:15 AM »
Whoa...before you put the Rotex back on your short list, I’d stop off at a local dealer and test drive one...they’re cool but strictly niche.

If you hate sanding, you’ll really hate sanding after being on the receiving end of a RO 125 for about 2-3 hours.

Nothing friendly about that sander...everything’s strictly business. Once the cool factor wears off, you’ll be better able to evaluate the usefulness of the Rotex.

Hate to say it but your latest choices will only lead to a future study in self flagellation. A large Rotex while using a conventional shop vac at max suction will not end well. Something has to give.

If you’re determined to purchase a RO then you must couple it with a variable suction vacuum.

My suggestion is to purchase a ETS EC 125 with a 150 pad and fabricate a vacuum release valve for your shop vac.

Offline Stan Tillinghast

  • Posts: 168
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #44 on: December 23, 2020, 01:52 AM »
Always listen to advice from Cheese...especially when he agrees with what I already wrote.

Offline Joebuck

  • Posts: 27
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #45 on: December 23, 2020, 09:41 AM »
Stan is right. Always listen to Cheese, and in this case Peter P as well. The Rotex while effective, is not a pleasure to use and can be rather difficult. The ETS EC 125 or 150 on the other hand is a joy to operate and with a vac is nearly dust free. I started with the RO125 as my first sander, and have not used it once since I bought the ETS EC 125/3.

Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #46 on: December 23, 2020, 11:24 AM »
I’ll second the recommendation of going to a dealer and sampling your considerations.  I don’t find the RO150 cumbersome or tiring (save for using it in rotex mode for extended periods, but that’ rare for me), others do.  You’ll likely know immediately what you prefer as far as weight, ease of use, speed of removal, etc., keeping in mind that you already have a sander for smaller pieces/vertical work, etc.   

Offline Jim_in_PA

  • Posts: 181
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #47 on: December 23, 2020, 11:31 AM »
I went from leaning towards the Rotex to the ETS EC but now think I am back to the 6" Rotex.  As a previous post mentioned I always have my Dewalt for small jobs anyway.  I don't currently have any type of belt sander so I can kill two birds with one stone with the Rotex.

Rotex is a two-handed tool most of the time and IMHO, not a good choice for general sanding, despite it having a lot of flexibility that comes from both rotary and random orbital actions being available. It's bigger, heavier and not balanced well for one-handing which is necessary for a lot of general sanding duties. I only pull mine out when it has a specific advantage or purpose.

The best value right now is the 5" ROS that can also take the 6" pad and abrasives. If I were buying another sander, that's what I'd choose because there are times when the smaller setup would be useful to me...both of my Festool sanders are 6" which covers the majority of my work, but the smaller setup would benefit my guitar work a lot.
----
ETS 150/3, Rotex 150, OF1010, OF1400, Trion PS 300, TDK-12, CT-22, MFT 1080, TS55, Domino XL DF 700, 8' track, (2) 55" tracks

SCM MiniMax S315WS, FS350, MM16, Camaster Stinger II SR-44 CNC

Offline hdv

  • Posts: 240
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #48 on: December 23, 2020, 12:17 PM »
Even though I love my RO150 (a lot!) I do agree with the others above.

I don't really think it is that hard to use, except when I need to sand above my head. I bought it when I was building my house and had many large surfaces of very rough wood to sand. It is unbeatable for that.

But for more subtle jobs I always turn to my ETS EC 150/3. At the time I didn't know you could add a 150 mm pad to the ETS EC125. If I had known, I probably would have bought that sander. Well, I am in for a rematch, because the ES-ETS 125 seems to be in my stars if I may believe my wife...  [cool]

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #49 on: December 24, 2020, 09:05 PM »
It's with a significant amount of shame I say I bought a Bosch GET75-6N today.  There were a number of reasons for this and I really appreciate all the feedback I have gotten from everyone.

1) They had a $75 discount on all purchases over $500 so with the Bosch vacuum hose I was right at $500 CAD all in
2) I do not have a belt sander or polisher so the dual action sander will meet a few of my needs at once
3) A lot of the feedback reinforced the need for a Festool vac and when I started my search I wasn't really counting on that
4) All my sanding to date has been on the bench so I have a nice stable surface for no need of overhead or otherwise hard to handle sanding surfaces
5) I am a 100% hobby woodworker and couldn't justify the investment at this point, I can buy several other decent tools with the $1,500 I saved over the Festool with dust extraction

Again thanks everyone, a lot of awesome feedback but in the end I just couldn't make the jump. 

Offline rvieceli

  • Posts: 1348
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #50 on: December 24, 2020, 10:36 PM »
@hammy

congrats on your purchase.

You still would benefit from a variable speed vac. Please take a look at the Bosch VAC090AH.

it's a quality vac, HEPA and auto clean. Here in the US Home Depot has it for $499. Plus you can attach an L-Boxx to the top.


https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bosch-9-Gallon-Corded-Wet-Dry-Dust-Extractor-Vacuum-with-Auto-Filter-Clean-and-HEPA-Filter-VAC090AH/303322609#product-overview

Ron
« Last Edit: December 25, 2020, 06:17 AM by rvieceli »

Offline Stan Tillinghast

  • Posts: 168
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #51 on: December 25, 2020, 02:25 AM »
No shame at all, Hammy. Don’t go away, there’s plenty to learn here, as I find every day.

Offline Cypren

  • Posts: 51
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #52 on: December 25, 2020, 02:40 AM »
Don't count on it. The suction of Festool vacs is terrible. Common household vacs have better suction, and your shop vac probably also.

This comment confuses me. Festool's rated stats for the CT series are very conservative on paper, but in practice their extractors perform extremely well. See e.g. the Toolbox Buzz shootout, which goes to great lengths to quantify the performance of a wide range of dust extractors in controlled tests. The only extractor that out-performed the tested CT 36 AC in raw power (either airflow or water column suction) was the Hilti VC 150-10 XE (which is about $200 more expensive), and it didn't win by much.

I think it's pretty fair to knock Festool's dust extractors for being overpriced given the existence of the Makita line that performs almost as well and has all the same features at 2/3 the cost of the Festool and almost half the cost of the Hilti. But I definitely wouldn't knock them on performance.

Offline craigsalisbury75

  • Posts: 6
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #53 on: December 25, 2020, 03:25 AM »
Theres a lot of mentions about fitting a 150 pad on an ETS EC 125, but why cant you put a 125 pd on an ETS EC 150 ? surely its the same fitting, is it the size of the sander body? which would not affect sanding on flat surfaces.

Offline Alex

  • Posts: 7056
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #54 on: December 25, 2020, 03:32 AM »
Don't count on it. The suction of Festool vacs is terrible. Common household vacs have better suction, and your shop vac probably also.

This comment confuses me. Festool's rated stats for the CT series are very conservative on paper, but in practice their extractors perform extremely well. See e.g. the Toolbox Buzz shootout, which goes to great lengths to quantify the performance of a wide range of dust extractors in controlled tests. The only extractor that out-performed the tested CT 36 AC in raw power (either airflow or water column suction) was the Hilti VC 150-10 XE (which is about $200 more expensive), and it didn't win by much.

I think it's pretty fair to knock Festool's dust extractors for being overpriced given the existence of the Makita line that performs almost as well and has all the same features at 2/3 the cost of the Festool and almost half the cost of the Hilti. But I definitely wouldn't knock them on performance.

Over the last 10 years I've had 4 different Festool vacs by now, the CTL 22, CTL 26, the Mini and The Midi. I have used them almost daily in very different circumstances. They are fine as long as you use them connected to a tool, that's what they are made for.

But as soon as you go do some general clean up, you're struggling to get your dirt from the floor with these Festool vacs. And guess what, if you're making things dirty you also have to clean them up so I consider clean up a very important duty for my vacs. Especially if you connect the tubes with a floor nozzle, suction is horrible and it is struggling to pick up larger lumps.

I don't know about your tests, they're always very limited in time and circumstances. My experience isn't. All nice and easy to test a tool when it's brand new, with new bags and filters, but did you know the suction of the Mini and Midi drops to half when the bag is only 1/4 full with dust?

Offline Euclid

  • Posts: 242
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #55 on: December 25, 2020, 03:43 AM »
Indeed... the performance of the CT as a dust collector is not in question here: just it's level of "grunt" compared to a good quality domestic vacuum cleaner. I love my CT Midi: it works wonderfully (though it's had so little to do this year, that's just from memory!), but for domestic cleaning duties it cannot compete for effectiveness with my compact Miele.

Now then, my few minutes of escape from the domestic mayhem of Christmas morning are nearly over...
Hope everyone is safe and well and having a happy time!

Offline Cypren

  • Posts: 51
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #56 on: December 25, 2020, 04:54 AM »
But as soon as you go do some general clean up, you're struggling to get your dirt from the floor with these Festool vacs. And guess what, if you're making things dirty you also have to clean them up so I consider clean up a very important duty for my vacs. Especially if you connect the tubes with a floor nozzle, suction is horrible and it is struggling to pick up larger lumps.

I think the confusion here may be the difference between suction and airflow. For scooping up lightweight dirt and dust over a wide area, as you've described, airflow reigns supreme. A heavy-duty shop vac like the Ridgid HD 1600 that I use as my general-purpose cleanup vacuum can pull much higher airflow than the Festool vacs, in this case about 200 CFM versus 150 CFM on my CT 26 (assuming both have clean filters). That translates into much better pickup performance over a dispersed area.

However, it doesn't exert as much actual suction (which would be its ability to lift and pull along heavier debris, or to break up blockages inside the hose). My Ridgid in this case pulls about 2/3 of the suction of the Festool in a water-lift test (which is the standard way of measuring suction power). A large part of the reason for the disparity is that the Festool is fully sealed and filtered across its entire mechanism, and the Ridgid is not. Adding filtration lowers airflow but improving sealing increases suction.

I can mount a HEPA filter in the Ridgid so that it has more comparable filtration to the Festool, and it loses about a third of its airflow if I do, which actually drops its performance below the CT. (I've got an anemometer and have actually measured this just for curiosity's sake.) Their motors are roughly equal in power, but the CT has a tighter seal so it's leaking less air from places other than the hose end.

If your argument is just that a HEPA-certified dust extractor isn't as good of a shop vac as a shop vac, then I don't think we have any disagreement. They're tools aimed at different purposes. Festool actually doesn't offer a filter as coarse as the Ridgid's (the coarsest filter they sell for the CT is equivalent to Ridgid's 1 micron "fine dust" filter, which has lower airflow than the default filter), but if they did, you could presumably slot that in and it would get slightly better airflow than the Ridgid since their motors are both 1200W and the seal is tighter. In that case, you'd have turned the dust extractor into a (very expensive) shop vac with both its strengths and weaknesses.
I don't know about your tests, they're always very limited in time and circumstances. My experience isn't. All nice and easy to test a tool when it's brand new, with new bags and filters, but did you know the suction of the Mini and Midi drops to half when the bag is only 1/4 full with dust?

The test I linked specifically accounts for that. They measured them with clean filters and then sucked up about 20 lbs. of drywall dust to deliberately clog the filters and tested them again. The CT 36 showed some of the lowest loss of suction and airflow of any vacuum in the shootout (only Makita did better). They didn't test the Mini/Midi, however, so maybe they have very different performance characteristics than the CT series.

Edited to add: one other factor I forgot to mention is the hose! Larger hoses increase airflow and reduce suction. Large shop vacs (at least in the US; I'm not sure about elsewhere) usually have a 2.5 inch/64mm hose, while the largest Festool hose is 50mm, and most people are going to be using a 27mm or 36mm for their tool hookups.
« Last Edit: December 25, 2020, 05:04 AM by Cypren »

Offline Alex

  • Posts: 7056
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #57 on: December 25, 2020, 05:46 AM »
If your argument is just that a HEPA-certified dust extractor isn't as good of a shop vac as a shop vac, then I don't think we have any disagreement. They're tools aimed at different purposes.

My vacs are not HEPA, I am in Europe and HEPA isn't used much here.

Second, I heavily disagree that they're tools aimed at different purposes. The Festool vacs should be able to handle general clean up like any other vac in its class. Because clean up is part of the building process just like DC of a tool is. Ever tore out a ceiling or chiseled all the plaster of a wall? Common tasks when you work on a home.

Other vacs of other brands can do both without problems, so the Festool vacs should also be able to do this.
 
Like I said about your test, you take one particular vac (an autoclean no less) and use it for one particular situation and then somehow extrapolate that to all Festool vacs. That's not how it works. I am talking about 4 different vacs over a 10 year period, working with them on an almost daily basis in every conceivable situation and they've had to handle almost any type of dust and debris out there. I know a lot better what these vacs can do then those test boys. And I am disappointed. I really like the features and form factor of the Festool vacs, but they just fall behind in suction.

Offline rvieceli

  • Posts: 1348
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #58 on: December 25, 2020, 06:13 AM »
Theres a lot of mentions about fitting a 150 pad on an ETS EC 125, but why cant you put a 125 pad on an ETS EC 150 ? surely its the same fitting, is it the size of the sander body? which would not affect sanding on flat surfaces.

@craigsalisbury75 the 125 pad will NOT fit on the ETS EC 150. The attachment is different. It only works for the 150mm pad on the ETS EC 125

Ron

Offline afish

  • Posts: 323
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #59 on: December 25, 2020, 07:11 AM »
Don't count on it. The suction of Festool vacs is terrible. Common household vacs have better suction, and your shop vac probably also.

This comment confuses me. Festool's rated stats for the CT series are very conservative on paper, but in practice their extractors perform extremely well. See e.g. the Toolbox Buzz shootout, which goes to great lengths to quantify the performance of a wide range of dust extractors in controlled tests. The only extractor that out-performed the tested CT 36 AC in raw power (either airflow or water column suction) was the Hilti VC 150-10 XE (which is about $200 more expensive), and it didn't win by much.

I think it's pretty fair to knock Festool's dust extractors for being overpriced given the existence of the Makita line that performs almost as well and has all the same features at 2/3 the cost of the Festool and almost half the cost of the Hilti. But I definitely wouldn't knock them on performance.

That was a well done shoot out and I thought it was very objective.  For me the clear winner was the Makita based of performance per dollar and I liked that it was much quieter than the Festool.  However that makita model is no longer available.  Which brings up an interesting question the Hilti which was the top performer looks very much like a Nilfisk made unit.  The new Makita units are also made by Nilfisk and look very similar as is the Mirka units.  So Im wondering if the Makita is now basically a 400 dollar cheaper Hilti unit? Im not a fan of the way the hose wraps around the outside of the vac but I do really like the db performance compared to the Festool. Anyone familiar with the Nilfisk made units by either Makita or Hilti.  The Makita has limited reviews and the biggest complaint I see was the banging noise made by the AC but Im aware of this and as far as I know all the AC units make this popping noise so that doesnt bother me unless the Makitas popping noise is considerably louder than the Festools. 

Offline Cypren

  • Posts: 51
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #60 on: December 25, 2020, 07:36 AM »
Like I said about your test, you take one particular vac (an autoclean no less) and use it for one particular situation and then somehow extrapolate that to all Festool vacs. That's not how it works. I am talking about 4 different vacs over a 10 year period, working with them on an almost daily basis in every conceivable situation and they've had to handle almost any type of dust and debris out there. I know a lot better what these vacs can do then those test boys. And I am disappointed. I really like the features and form factor of the Festool vacs, but they just fall behind in suction.

Not all Festool vacs, just the CT series, since they all use the same motor and operating mechanism design and the only real differences are the size of the container and the presence or absence of the autoclean feature. (The shootout I linked doesn't specify whether or not they used AC in their clogged-filter test, but since a number of the vacs have the feature, I would assume they probably did.)

The CT 15, SYS, Mini and Midi all use different internals than the main CT series and I wouldn't expect performance characteristics to generalize between them.

The main reason I don't weight personal experience very highly when making pronouncements about the capabilities of tools is that it's too heavily confounded by other variables. The way you personally handle the vacuum, how often you change bags and filters, what grade of filter you equip it with, the kinds of material you use it on, the hoses you use; all of this has a very substantial impact on performance. I completely believe you that the Festool vacuums have performed poorly for you given the way you've used them. But if I may borrow your own criticism, you can't extrapolate that to everyone else in the world. And so I tend to go by objective measurements that have done their best to control for personal differences in usage when evaluating what a tool can do.

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 8017
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #61 on: December 25, 2020, 11:40 AM »
Theres a lot of mentions about fitting a 150 pad on an ETS EC 125, but why cant you put a 125 pd on an ETS EC 150 ? surely its the same fitting, is it the size of the sander body? which would not affect sanding on flat surfaces.

Unfortunately, Festool uses 2 different sanding pad drive methods on the sanders. The ETS EC 125 utilizes a round drive with 2 flattened sides, while the ETS EC 150 adds 2 ears to the drive.

ETS EC 125 sander with round drive & 2 flats.




LH = 125 pad     RH = 150 pad with 2 ears.


Offline craigsalisbury75

  • Posts: 6
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #62 on: December 25, 2020, 01:06 PM »
Theres a lot of mentions about fitting a 150 pad on an ETS EC 125, but why cant you put a 125 pd on an ETS EC 150 ? surely its the same fitting, is it the size of the sander body? which would not affect sanding on flat surfaces.

Unfortunately, Festool uses 2 different sanding pad drive methods on the sanders. The ETS EC 125 utilizes a round drive with 2 flattened sides, while the ETS EC 150 adds 2 ears to the drive.

ETS EC 125 sander with round drive & 2 flats.

(Attachment Link)


LH = 125 pad     RH = 150 pad with 2 ears.

(Attachment Link)

thanks for the explanation, i guess i dont need the 125 pad, but the option would have been nice

Offline mrB

  • Posts: 806
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #63 on: December 25, 2020, 02:04 PM »
In reality I feel one could easily carve out a 125mm pad to fit the ETS EC 150.

But, I do remember (maybe incorrectly) something about the bolt not being long enough for the taller 125mm pad. No actual experience with the 150 machines myself, I only have the 125 sander.

Happy Christmas all. X
« Last Edit: December 26, 2020, 05:34 AM by mrB »
there's nothing like the right tool for the job

Offline Imemiter

  • Posts: 91
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #64 on: December 25, 2020, 03:19 PM »
It's with a significant amount of shame I say I bought a Bosch GET75-6N today.  There were a number of reasons for this and I really appreciate all the feedback I have gotten from everyone.

I like that sander! I was hovering on the brink of a Rotex until Bosch talked me off the ledge with a $50 off day.  [big grin] Now that I've used it back to back with an RO125 I'm not at all unhappy with my choice.
CSX, TID18, HKC55, OSC18, OF1010, DTS400, ETS125, RAS115, LR32, CTSys, CTMidi, CT-VA-20

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #65 on: December 25, 2020, 09:01 PM »
It's with a significant amount of shame I say I bought a Bosch GET75-6N today.  There were a number of reasons for this and I really appreciate all the feedback I have gotten from everyone.

I like that sander! I was hovering on the brink of a Rotex until Bosch talked me off the ledge with a $50 off day.  [big grin] Now that I've used it back to back with an RO125 I'm not at all unhappy with my choice.

That's great to hear, thanks!  Just as a point of interest I found an RO 150 at a local dealer and asked how much it was... they said $1,340 ..... holy mark ups!

Offline Jesse Cloud

  • Posts: 1752
  • Festooling at the end of a dirt road in New Mexico
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #66 on: December 26, 2020, 01:40 PM »
I make furniture.  I have a shop with a jointer and planer, so I never have to sand really rough wood.

Whats important to me is speed of getting the job done (not having to go back to remove curlicues mainly) and clean operation.  I have the 6 inch 150/3.  Remember that the area of a circle is pi times the radius of a circle.  A 5 inch disk has a 2.5 inch radius, so r squared is 6.25, where the 6 inch disk radius is three so r squared is 9 - a 44 percent improvement in area and in speed.

I find the dust extraction excellent, which saves a lot of cleanup time and sandpaper.

A variable speed vac is great if you often sand light things, eg thin panels. 

I do have a Rotex I use for sculpting.  It gets about 1 percent of the usage the RTS does.

If I had to sand stuff upside down, I would definitely want the lightest sander on offer.

Just another data point, your mileage may vary.


Offline Michael Kowalenko

  • Posts: 11
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #67 on: December 28, 2020, 06:17 PM »
Hello everyone. Based on all of this discussion, today I purchased the ETS EC 125/3 and a 150 hard pad. I am looking forward to using this sander in either the 5” and 6” mode as needed. However, I cannot loosen the bolt to remove the installed 125 pad. Hopefully it won’t need Festool service. Comments? Help?

Offline Alex

  • Posts: 7056
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #68 on: December 28, 2020, 07:17 PM »
Hello everyone. Based on all of this discussion, today I purchased the ETS EC 125/3 and a 150 hard pad. I am looking forward to using this sander in either the 5” and 6” mode as needed. However, I cannot loosen the bolt to remove the installed 125 pad. Hopefully it won’t need Festool service. Comments? Help?

It is normal it is tight from the factory. Just try to hold the pad securely and use more force with a wrench. If you have an impact driver that will help greatly.

Offline afish

  • Posts: 323
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #69 on: December 28, 2020, 08:55 PM »
I do not know but is it possibly a left/reverse threaded bolt?

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #70 on: December 28, 2020, 09:41 PM »
Just an update... I’ve cancelled my Bosch order, after some reflection on all the feedback I think I’m going ets ec 125! Still mulling over the vac option.

Offline Michael Kowalenko

  • Posts: 11
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #71 on: December 28, 2020, 09:48 PM »
Hi Hammy, from Edmonton ... almost on the other coast and a few time zones away. Another reason I went with the ETS EC 125/3 and 150 pad is that I already have the CT48E. As it turns out, buying that item back then with the OF1400 made this decision today easier, as I wanted to capitalize on the great dust extraction of the system.

Offline xedos

  • Posts: 451
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #72 on: December 28, 2020, 11:43 PM »
Just an update... I’ve cancelled my Bosch order, after some reflection on all the feedback I think I’m going ets ec 125! Still mulling over the vac option.

It would appear analysis paralysis has set in. 

Just get the EC125 and a MINI.  Be done with it and get onto making stuff.  You can always return either or both within 30days if you don’t take a shine to them. 

Offline mino

  • Posts: 69
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #73 on: December 29, 2020, 05:21 AM »
Not so.

I’ve been sanding edges with my 125 for more than a dozen years. But I do plan to buy the edge guide because it will make the task easier, and probably turn out better.
The point of the guide - as I see it - you can "make" or correct an edge where there is none proper and avoid "unmaking one" via uneven pressure etc. All that even on a finished piece.
One would need a stationary disc sander to get the precision the guide can provide via other means.
C 12, TSC 55, BHC 18, DRC 18/4, PSC 420, AGC 18 (mod@AGC 125), CTM 36
Narex: EFH 36@LR32, EBV 230 (RS200), EDH 82, EVP 13 H-2CA
My Precious: FS 376/2, FS 376/2, FS 376/2 LR32, FS 632, FS 1016/2 LR32, FS 2500/2, 2x GRS 16 PE, GECKO DOSH

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #74 on: December 29, 2020, 10:43 AM »
Just an update... I’ve cancelled my Bosch order, after some reflection on all the feedback I think I’m going ets ec 125! Still mulling over the vac option.

It would appear analysis paralysis has set in. 

Just get the EC125 and a MINI.  Be done with it and get onto making stuff.  You can always return either or both within 30days if you don’t take a shine to them.

I think you are right, I just need to go buy one and get it over with.

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #75 on: December 29, 2020, 03:31 PM »
Hello everyone. Based on all of this discussion, today I purchased the ETS EC 125/3 and a 150 hard pad. I am looking forward to using this sander in either the 5” and 6” mode as needed. However, I cannot loosen the bolt to remove the installed 125 pad. Hopefully it won’t need Festool service. Comments? Help?

That's great Michael, at least one of us listened to the good advice here!  I'm pretty sure I'm going to do the same.

Offline SoonerFan

  • Posts: 476
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #76 on: December 29, 2020, 04:58 PM »
Hello everyone. Based on all of this discussion, today I purchased the ETS EC 125/3 and a 150 hard pad. I am looking forward to using this sander in either the 5” and 6” mode as needed. However, I cannot loosen the bolt to remove the installed 125 pad. Hopefully it won’t need Festool service. Comments? Help?

That's great Michael, at least one of us listened to the good advice here!  I'm pretty sure I'm going to do the same.

If I were you I would do it.  I have the ETS EC 125 and it is a great sander. Only caution is many of us did not stop at one sander.  I now also an RO125 and a DTS400 and am looking at a cordless for quick jobs. 

Offline Alanbach

  • Posts: 620
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #77 on: December 29, 2020, 10:14 PM »
@hammy - ok one last comment since you have switched back to the ETS EC 125. I would continue to strongly encourage you to bite the bullet and choose one of the Festool CT vacs. I have given you my opinion in a couple of posts here so I will just wrap it up by going back to your original post. You said that you did not like sanding and you wanted to find something that would make you like it. I have been here and on other forums for years now and I have heard from countless people (including myself) about how they always hated sanding until they got a Festool sander and CT vac combo. The sander you have chosen coupled with a Festool vac will almost certainly change the way you feel about sanding. If that is still what you want I suggest that you pull the trigger. You can thank us later😊. Yes, it is crazy money for a sander but it works crazy good and like I said earlier once you have the vac you will be ready for all those other Festools that are going to buy in the future.

Offline Cypren

  • Posts: 51
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #78 on: December 30, 2020, 07:12 AM »
I'll note that if the CT series is too expensive for your tastes, the Makita VC4210L offers similar benefits to the CT 36 AC HEPA (41 liter capacity, similar airflow/suction, HEPA filtration, passthrough power with automatic activation, filter autoclean, and even systainer docking) at about 2/3 of the cost. What you give up is integration with the rest of the Festool system: the fitted, twist-lock hoses, the Bluetooth integration with cordless tools, and the accessories like the boom arm that Makita doesn't offer. Depending upon your use cases, this may be a pretty worthwhile tradeoff to save $300, even moreso if you already have Makita power tools that are compatible with their own Bluetooth module system.

Offline Alex

  • Posts: 7056
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #79 on: December 30, 2020, 07:33 AM »
I'd just like to add that you can use any vac with your sander, you don't need to have a Festool vac if you don't want to spend money on that. Before I had my first Festool vac I used my home vac for years.

Offline Bert Vanderveen

  • Posts: 741
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #80 on: December 30, 2020, 08:05 AM »
Hello everyone. Based on all of this discussion, today I purchased the ETS EC 125/3 and a 150 hard pad. I am looking forward to using this sander in either the 5” and 6” mode as needed. However, I cannot loosen the bolt to remove the installed 125 pad. Hopefully it won’t need Festool service. Comments? Help?

That's great Michael, at least one of us listened to the good advice here!  I'm pretty sure I'm going to do the same.


I ordered the same end of November. Delivery has been set back to end of January… : ( But I took delivery of a DTS400 and the 150 pad(s) for the 125.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2020, 09:48 AM by Bert Vanderveen »
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

TS55 · TS55R · OF1010 · DF500 · MFT/3 + TSB1-MW 1000 + VL + CMS TS55 + CMS PS300 + LA-CS 70/CMS · CTL Midi · RTS400 · 2 x CXS Li 1,5 · T15+3 Li 4,2 · TI15 Impact Li 4,2 · Centrotec Sets 2008 + 2015 · PSB300 · LR32-SYS · RO150 · KS120 · 2 x MFK700 · RO90 · OFK700 · BS75 · OFK500 · OF2200 · CMS-GE · Vecturo 18 Li · TID 18 · TKS 80 EBS-Set · DTS 400 · ETS EC 125 w 150 pad · … | Mirka 1230L P&C | Hammer: A3 31 Silent Power · N4400 · HS950 | TaigaTools: VacPods Pro Set
On order: Surfix Set + CTL SYS with CT-VA-20

Offline rj_mccall

  • Posts: 37
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #81 on: December 30, 2020, 08:54 AM »
I'd just like to add that you can use any vac with your sander, you don't need to have a Festool vac if you don't want to spend money on that. Before I had my first Festool vac I used my home vac for years.

I’d advise against going down this path OP. Using “any vac” with your sander will create problems with your finished product. Attaching something like a shop vac to your sander creates too much suction leading to swirl marks and a poor finish. Having the ability to adjust the suction level to the tools need is beneficial. With the 125 you purchased you want the suction turned down low. Even adjusting the settings and experimenting on a scrap piece will show you the difference. Anyway, do not just use any vacuum, do some research and make an informed decision! Good luck!

Offline Alex

  • Posts: 7056
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #82 on: December 30, 2020, 10:35 AM »
I'd just like to add that you can use any vac with your sander, you don't need to have a Festool vac if you don't want to spend money on that. Before I had my first Festool vac I used my home vac for years.

I’d advise against going down this path OP. Using “any vac” with your sander will create problems with your finished product. Attaching something like a shop vac to your sander creates too much suction leading to swirl marks and a poor finish. Having the ability to adjust the suction level to the tools need is beneficial. With the 125 you purchased you want the suction turned down low. Even adjusting the settings and experimenting on a scrap piece will show you the difference. Anyway, do not just use any vacuum, do some research and make an informed decision! Good luck!

Oh blimey, I forgot I was living in a place where ALL vacs have variable suction. My bad. But OP could make a bleeder valve to lower suction without having to spend another $1000 as you guys are all so adamant about.

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #83 on: December 30, 2020, 12:51 PM »
Late breaking news..... the Festool ETS EC 125/3 EQ-Plus is now ordered along with the CT Mini I HEPA!!!

Delivery will be 3 to 4 weeks.

Total $CAN is $1,558.

Let the fun begin!  Thanks for all the awesome feedback everyone.

Offline Imemiter

  • Posts: 91
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #84 on: December 30, 2020, 01:00 PM »
Sorry to hear you've abandoned the brotherhood of Bosch.  [big grin]
But good call. You're going to love both of those tools.
CSX, TID18, HKC55, OSC18, OF1010, DTS400, ETS125, RAS115, LR32, CTSys, CTMidi, CT-VA-20

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #85 on: December 30, 2020, 08:10 PM »
And for next Christmas... a Rotex HA!

Online mkasdin

  • Posts: 449
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #86 on: December 31, 2020, 03:54 AM »
Look at the ct-15 dust extractor.  For the price it’s a good buy. Festool wants new buyers dipping their toes into the green (swamp) water... you’ll save some Festool Cash to get you half way into a track saw ts-55, a router, down payment on a domino.

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #87 on: December 31, 2020, 05:25 AM »
Look at the ct-15 dust extractor.  For the price it’s a good buy. Festool wants new buyers dipping their toes into the green (swamp) water... you’ll save some Festool Cash to get you half way into a track saw ts-55, a router, down payment on a domino.
Thanks, I didn’t look very closely at the ct 15 but it is over $300 cheaper!  I could live without the Bluetooth and stacking for sure.  It also holds a bit more than the mini, maybe I’ll just switch and get the ct 15. Id be losing the better hose but $300 can get me lots of sandpaper and a 6” pad.

Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #88 on: December 31, 2020, 08:09 PM »
Look at the ct-15 dust extractor.  For the price it’s a good buy. Festool wants new buyers dipping their toes into the green (swamp) water... you’ll save some Festool Cash to get you half way into a track saw ts-55, a router, down payment on a domino.
Thanks, I didn’t look very closely at the ct 15 but it is over $300 cheaper!  I could live without the Bluetooth and stacking for sure.  It also holds a bit more than the mini, maybe I’ll just switch and get the ct 15. Id be losing the better hose but $300 can get me lots of sandpaper and a 6” pad.

Just because I like to complicate matters I went the other way and changed my order to a CT 26.  I recently bought a Bosch Glide Mitre Saw that I will also use with the new vac. 

Online mkasdin

  • Posts: 449
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #89 on: December 31, 2020, 09:11 PM »
Look at the ct-15 dust extractor.  For the price it’s a good buy. Festool wants new buyers dipping their toes into the green (swamp) water... you’ll save some Festool Cash to get you half way into a track saw ts-55, a router, down payment on a domino.
Thanks, I didn’t look very closely at the ct 15 but it is over $300 cheaper!  I could live without the Bluetooth and stacking for sure.  It also holds a bit more than the mini, maybe I’ll just switch and get the ct 15. Id be losing the better hose but $300 can get me lots of sandpaper and a 6” pad.
yep and if you want you could probably sell the ct-15 in a year or two and not loose too much. It would still have some warranty remaining. By then the midi will see another upgrade ?

Offline mino

  • Posts: 69
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #90 on: January 01, 2021, 08:43 AM »
Just because I like to complicate matters I went the other way and changed my order to a CT 26.  I recently bought a Bosch Glide Mitre Saw that I will also use with the new vac.
I would advise to get the Bluetooth control module + remote for it if budget allows for the CT26.

You will only realize how useful and indispensable that little thing is once you have used it ...

CT15 is great value, but with no Bluetooth, no stand, no Systainer stacking and not manual filter clean, etc. it is geared more to the "dedicated static vac for a Mittresaw/worktable/etc." where those features would be wasted. It is a good value as a secondary semi-static vac. But would not go for it for a "do-it-all" main vac role.
C 12, TSC 55, BHC 18, DRC 18/4, PSC 420, AGC 18 (mod@AGC 125), CTM 36
Narex: EFH 36@LR32, EBV 230 (RS200), EDH 82, EVP 13 H-2CA
My Precious: FS 376/2, FS 376/2, FS 376/2 LR32, FS 632, FS 1016/2 LR32, FS 2500/2, 2x GRS 16 PE, GECKO DOSH

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline hammy

  • Posts: 23
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #91 on: January 10, 2021, 08:38 PM »
It's worse than waiting for Santa to arrive .....  Come on ETS EC 125 and CT 26!

Online mkasdin

  • Posts: 449
Re: Which sander to buy first! - First Post in the Forum
« Reply #92 on: January 10, 2021, 08:56 PM »
Just because I like to complicate matters I went the other way and changed my order to a CT 26.  I recently bought a Bosch Glide Mitre Saw that I will also use with the new vac.
I would advise to get the Bluetooth control module + remote for it if budget allows for the CT26.

You will only realize how useful and indispensable that little thing is once you have used it ...

CT15 is great value, but with no Bluetooth, no stand, no Systainer stacking and not manual filter clean, etc. it is geared more to the "dedicated static vac for a Mittresaw/worktable/etc." where those features would be wasted. It is a good value as a secondary semi-static vac. But would not go for it for a "do-it-all" main vac role.
I use that ct-15 vac 95% of the time. The midi is the show horse and lives in a closet. I do remodeling and such so  the brunt of abuse goes to the cheaper vacuum. I would go with the cheaper 15 and putting the $400 savings into a Festool tool. I think it’s money well spent and should serve you well for the next 3-5 years. I basically wanted two vacuums I don’t have to cart vacuums around to two job sites.