Author Topic: What to do with two guide rails that are out (Read 9036 times)

Boski · « **on:** September 05, 2023, 03:17 PM »

I have 2 x 1.4m Festool guide rails that are both out by about 3mm.

I have since bought 2 x Makita rails that I use.

I’m at a bit of a loss of what I should do with them? Bin them, keep them etc.
.

Does the router guide rail run on Makita rails?

I do have another Festool 800mm rail I can use for that I suppose.

bwehman · « **Reply #1 on:** September 05, 2023, 03:42 PM »

Quote from: Boski on September 05, 2023, 03:17 PM

I have 2 x 1.4m Festool guide rails that are both out by about 3mm.

I have since bought 2 x Makita rails that I use.

I’m at a bit of a loss of what I should do with them? Bin them, keep them etc.
.

Does the router guide rail run on Makita rails?

I do have another Festool 800mm rail I can use for that I suppose.

How did you measure their bend? If it's a kink at one end, you could just cut the rail just before it starts to skew.

Boski · « **Reply #2 on:** September 05, 2023, 04:12 PM »

Well it was a long drawn out painful process with the TSO parallel guides , which turned out to be my rails.

I could try and see where its out and what length will be left, good shout, what would you cut them with?

woodbutcherbower · « **Reply #3 on:** September 05, 2023, 04:24 PM »

Buy a 2700mm or 3000mm rail. Game-changer.

Lincoln · « **Reply #4 on:** September 05, 2023, 05:07 PM »

3mm is a LOT over 1400mm. Are the ends touching when you join them together? That can cause issues, as the ends might not be square and it prevents the rails aligning.

Sparktrician · « **Reply #5 on:** September 05, 2023, 05:49 PM »

Where is the deviation? Is it on the long side or in the angle at the cut across the short end? If the long side is good, recut the end to 90 degrees. If it's on the long side, is there a bend in a short section that you could cut out and get a couple of shorter sections?

woodferret · « **Reply #6 on:** September 05, 2023, 06:57 PM »

Again, on a flat piece of plywood/MDF, strike a line along the cut guide. Flip your rails end over end and see where the bend is. You can rock it back and forth like you would a normal straight edge checking a surface. If it's a shock deformation, it'll likely be very localized with most of the rail still straight. You can cut your rail around both sides of that bend.

It'll be rare for it to leave the Festool factory with a full gradual bend that's more than the <1mm tolerance, but it's been known to happen. If you don't see straight line matches along any part and it's just a gradual bow, then the rail is junk - still useful for very rough cuts, but I'd mark it with a sharpie just to never use it on final cuts.

edit: cut it with your mitre saw.

derekcohen · « **Reply #7 on:** September 05, 2023, 07:51 PM »

Place against a long straight edge. If the bend is a gentle curve, straighten by epoxying to a substrate, such as 3mm MDF or Ply.

Regards from Perth

Derek

bwehman · « **Reply #8 on:** September 05, 2023, 11:28 PM »

Quote from: Boski on September 05, 2023, 04:12 PM

Well it was a long drawn out painful process with the TSO parallel guides , which turned out to be my rails.

I could try and see where its out and what length will be left, good shout, what would you cut them with?

Hmm. In my shop, I'd use the Kapex and my aluminum cutting blade, with the blade speed turned down to 3, clamped on both sides firmly.

Cheese · « **Reply #9 on:** September 06, 2023, 12:00 AM »

Quote from: bwehman on September 05, 2023, 11:28 PM

Hmm. In my shop, I'd use the Kapex and my aluminum cutting blade, with the blade speed turned down to 3, clamped on both sides firmly.

I think you meant to say one side firmly.

Boski · « **Reply #10 on:** September 06, 2023, 04:07 AM »

Quote from: Lincoln on September 05, 2023, 05:07 PM

3mm is a LOT over 1400mm. Are the ends touching when you join them together? That can cause issues, as the ends might not be square and it prevents the rails aligning.

It is both rails unfortunately, I didn't check them when I got them and only come to light when I couldn't get the TSO parallel guides to work.

Boski · « **Reply #11 on:** September 06, 2023, 04:08 AM »

Quote from: Sparktrician on September 05, 2023, 05:49 PM

Where is the deviation? Is it on the long side or in the angle at the cut across the short end? If the long side is good, recut the end to 90 degrees. If it's on the long side, is there a bend in a short section that you could cut out and get a couple of shorter sections?

Thanks will investigate and see what I can salvage.

Boski · « **Reply #12 on:** September 06, 2023, 04:12 AM »

Quote from: woodferret on September 05, 2023, 06:57 PM

Again, on a flat piece of plywood/MDF, strike a line along the cut guide. Flip your rails end over end and see where the bend is. You can rock it back and forth like you would a normal straight edge checking a surface. If it's a shock deformation, it'll likely be very localized with most of the rail still straight. You can cut your rail around both sides of that bend.

It'll be rare for it to leave the Festool factory with a full gradual bend that's more than the <1mm tolerance, but it's been known to happen. If you don't see straight line matches along any part and it's just a gradual bow, then the rail is junk - still useful for very rough cuts, but I'd mark it with a sharpie just to never use it on final cuts.

edit: cut it with your mitre saw.

Hi WF, yep I remember your suggestion now, I'll try and get to that this afternoon.

Just to clarify, do you recommend removing the splinter guard and then marking the line?

Boski · « **Reply #13 on:** September 06, 2023, 04:13 AM »

Quote from: bwehman on September 05, 2023, 11:28 PM

Quote from: Boski on September 05, 2023, 04:12 PM
Well it was a long drawn out painful process with the TSO parallel guides , which turned out to be my rails.

I could try and see where its out and what length will be left, good shout, what would you cut them with?

Hmm. In my shop, I'd use the Kapex and my aluminum cutting blade, with the blade speed turned down to 3, clamped on both sides firmly.

I'm taking a look at that blade now. Not cheap, and I probably won't use it a lot, but I'm guessing its always handy to have and will last a while.

woodferret · « **Reply #14 on:** September 06, 2023, 06:06 AM »

Quote from: Boski on September 06, 2023, 04:12 AM

Quote from: woodferret on September 05, 2023, 06:57 PM
Again, on a flat piece of plywood/MDF, strike a line along the cut guide. Flip your rails end over end and see where the bend is. You can rock it back and forth like you would a normal straight edge checking a surface. If it's a shock deformation, it'll likely be very localized with most of the rail still straight. You can cut your rail around both sides of that bend.

It'll be rare for it to leave the Festool factory with a full gradual bend that's more than the <1mm tolerance, but it's been known to happen. If you don't see straight line matches along any part and it's just a gradual bow, then the rail is junk - still useful for very rough cuts, but I'd mark it with a sharpie just to never use it on final cuts.

edit: cut it with your mitre saw.

Hi WF, yep I remember your suggestion now, I'll try and get to that this afternoon.

Just to clarify, do you recommend removing the splinter guard and then marking the line?

Keep the splinter guard. That should be parallel to the rail center if you cut it clean earlier.

squall_line · « **Reply #15 on:** September 06, 2023, 09:34 AM »

Keep in mind as well that the one part that is supposed to be straight is the top rib, as that is what actually guides the saw, router, etc. The part of the rail next to the splinter guard is neither guaranteed straight nor should be relied on as such, which is why the recommendation is to leave on the splinter guard. The back side of the rail can't be guaranteed straight, either, but it should be more coplanar with the rib than the splinter guard side.

Also, since the splinter guard is pliable and can move or fall off, it's not recommended to use that as a reference surface for determining straightness.

bwehman · « **Reply #16 on:** September 06, 2023, 12:49 PM »

Quote from: Cheese on September 06, 2023, 12:00 AM

Quote from: bwehman on September 05, 2023, 11:28 PM
Hmm. In my shop, I'd use the Kapex and my aluminum cutting blade, with the blade speed turned down to 3, clamped on both sides firmly.

I think you meant to say one side firmly.

Nah, I clamp both sides and keep my left hand a little farther away from the blade that way.

bwehman · « **Reply #17 on:** September 06, 2023, 12:51 PM »

Quote from: Boski on September 06, 2023, 04:13 AM

Quote from: bwehman on September 05, 2023, 11:28 PM
Quote from: Boski on September 05, 2023, 04:12 PM
Well it was a long drawn out painful process with the TSO parallel guides , which turned out to be my rails.

I could try and see where its out and what length will be left, good shout, what would you cut them with?

Hmm. In my shop, I'd use the Kapex and my aluminum cutting blade, with the blade speed turned down to 3, clamped on both sides firmly.

I'm taking a look at that blade now. Not cheap, and I probably won't use it a lot, but I'm guessing its always handy to have and will last a while.

It's one of those things where you might not use it much, but when you *do* need it, there's nothing else that'll work. TBH, I'm never stoked to cut metal on the Kapex, so literally anything I can do to make the experience less frightening (i.e., clamps, using the correct blade, etc.) I'll absolutely do.

Coen · « **Reply #18 on:** September 06, 2023, 05:54 PM »

Quote from: derekcohen on September 05, 2023, 07:51 PM

Place against a long straight edge. If the bend is a gentle curve, straighten by epoxying to a substrate, such as 3mm MDF or Ply.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Wait what?

mino · « **Reply #19 on:** September 07, 2023, 04:53 AM »

Guys, you are really overcomplicating.

1) Ideally, you need an aluminum blade for your TS 55/TS 60 but an MDF/Chipboard blade will do wonderfully for a few cuts. Forget about the Kapex for now.

2) You needs to use a piece of offcut *), bout 8mm thick to support the rail (you will cut it placed upside down)

3) Take a square (GRS-16 works great, but any will do) and aligh your rail on the rail you want to cut (the "bottoms) of both rails will be in contact

*) if you had 3 rails, a better aproach is to use the second rail to "complete" the one you are cutting. Two rails upside down create an even board-like assembly and are a non-issue to cut with a tracksaw, no complications needed, and you can use your "standard" MDF/Chipboard blade for this if it is just a single cut ...

Boski · « **Reply #20 on:** September 07, 2023, 06:31 AM »

Quote from: mino on September 07, 2023, 04:53 AM

Guys, you are really overcomplicating.

1) Ideally, you need an aluminum blade for your TS 55/TS 60 but an MDF/Chipboard blade will do wonderfully for a few cuts. Forget about the Kapex for now.

2) You needs to use a piece of offcut *), bout 8mm thick to support the rail (you will cut it placed upside down)

3) Take a square (GRS-16 works great, but any will do) and aligh your rail on the rail you want to cut (the "bottoms) of both rails will be in contact

*) if you had 3 rails, a better aproach is to use the second rail to "complete" the one you are cutting. Two rails upside down create an even board-like assembly and are a non-issue to cut with a tracksaw, no complications needed, and you can use your "standard" MDF/Chipboard blade for this if it is just a single cut ...

Brilliant - this makes life a lot easier.

alltracman78 · « **Reply #21 on:** September 07, 2023, 07:53 PM »

Your router guide may not run on the Makita rails. I know the Carvex one won't.
The Makita rails have an extra "lip" on the outer edge that the lock tab for the saw slides under. This prevents some things that work on the Festool rails from working on the Makita ones.

The Makita rails also have a tendency to wear "ribs" in your saw plate where they run on the plastic part of the rail, due to the Makita design.

Boski · « **Reply #22 on:** September 08, 2023, 01:06 AM »

Quote from: alltracman78 on September 07, 2023, 07:53 PM

Your router guide may not run on the Makita rails. I know the Carvex one won't.
The Makita rails have an extra "lip" on the outer edge that the lock tab for the saw slides under. This prevents some things that work on the Festool rails from working on the Makita ones.

The Makita rails also have a tendency to wear "ribs" in your saw plate where they run on the plastic part of the rail, due to the Makita design.

Great info. Will the ribs have any detrimental affect on the saw in the long run?

Coen · « **Reply #23 on:** September 08, 2023, 07:26 PM »

Quote from: Boski on September 08, 2023, 01:06 AM

Quote from: alltracman78 on September 07, 2023, 07:53 PM
Your router guide may not run on the Makita rails. I know the Carvex one won't.
The Makita rails have an extra "lip" on the outer edge that the lock tab for the saw slides under. This prevents some things that work on the Festool rails from working on the Makita ones.

The Makita rails also have a tendency to wear "ribs" in your saw plate where they run on the plastic part of the rail, due to the Makita design.

Great info. Will the ribs have any detrimental affect on the saw in the long run?

Yes, they eat into the base of the saw. The saw then sits lower on the rail and the pivot point for angled cuts shifts down.

But I have no clue about how quickly the ribbed glide strips cut into the base. The steel bases of older saws will be less effected than the newer magnesium ones.