Author Topic: Advice about CMS modules and parts  (Read 15303 times)

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Offline JavierMoreno

  • Posts: 67
  • Journalist and amateur woodworker
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #30 on: July 19, 2016, 08:30 AM »
Thanks @jobsworth. I din't know that because in Spain Festool website that was not list as CMS extension, but as CS50 extension. 
Apologizes for my very bad English

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Offline Reiska

  • Posts: 1175
  • Hackers build things, Crackers break them.
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #31 on: July 19, 2016, 08:30 AM »
@Bert Vanderveen, I like the idea of a separate CMS-Set for the router and a VL for the saw.

If you have not got neither, what would you buy first: the CMS-VL or the stand alone CMS?

Depends what you have and what you are going to do next.

Since you already own a TS55R saw and presumably the tracks to go with it, you can probably do most of the stuff a table saw can do with those.

So if you can get a deal on a package Like this one and you are thinking on doing both you might as well take the discount up front as I don't think there is a set for the MFT-VL and any CMS tool.
The sky's the limit in my workshop, literally. [big grin]

Offline Reiska

  • Posts: 1175
  • Hackers build things, Crackers break them.
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #32 on: July 19, 2016, 08:38 AM »
Oh, and one more thing came to mind while reading through the other comments about the saw module vs. a real table saw...

Adjusting the angle of the TS55 in the insert is a bit of a pita since you do need to tighten both front and rear knobs under that table or you need to flip the insert over to do the adjustment. Being lazy as I am, I usually end up on my knees reaching under the table trying to get the angle right with my Wixey on the blade and it's a lot less comfortable than a real table saw with a nice crank up front to twist to find the angle.

So as long as you usually cut just normal 90-degree cuts on the saw you're good to go. The moment you start doing more angled cuts and can't batch them out you will be cursing.
The sky's the limit in my workshop, literally. [big grin]

Offline Bert Vanderveen

  • Posts: 814
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #33 on: July 19, 2016, 08:39 AM »
@Bert Vanderveen, I like the idea of a separate CMS-Set for the router and a VL for the saw.

If you have not got neither, what would you buy first: the CMS-VL or the stand alone CMS?

Hard to answer, but I have never regretted buying the VL. It really adds to the MFT regarding stability and functionality, without using up too much space.
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

TS55 · TS55R · OF1010 · DF500 · MFT/3 + TSB1-MW 1000 + VL + CMS TS55 + CMS PS300 + LA-CS 70/CMS · CTL Midi · RTS400 · 2 x CXS Li 1,5 · T15+3 Li 4,2 · TI15 Impact Li 4,2 · Centrotec Sets 2008 + 2015 · PSB300 · LR32-SYS · RO150 · KS120 · 2 x MFK700 · RO90 · OFK700 · BS75 · OFK500 · OF2200 · CMS-GE · Vecturo 18 Li · TID 18 · TKS 80 EBS-Set · DTS 400 · ETS EC 125 w 150 pad · Surfix Set · CTL SYS · CT-VA-20 · … | Mirka 1230L P&C | Hammer: A3 31 Silent Power · N4400 · HS950 | TaigaTools: VacPods Pro Set
On order: … [ ! ]

Offline GarryMartin

  • Posts: 1885
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #34 on: July 19, 2016, 08:44 AM »
Also to attach the LS-fence to the MFT-3 table you'll need the Precision Dogs attachment plate Precision Plate and according to their web site Incra has changed their fence attachment since I got mine and you are adviced to purchase some kind of an LS-specific connector base as well since they have removed the screw holes which were still present in mine.

I've recently bought the Precision Dogs plate and ordered the connector base. It's the red plate shown in the attached photo. To my mind, it works better with the Precision Dogs plate as it lowers the overall height of the positioner.


Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 6723
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #35 on: July 19, 2016, 12:01 PM »
Thanks @jobsworth. I din't know that because in Spain Festool website that was not list as CMS extension, but as CS50 extension.

It's a nice extension better than the one I bought.

Offline Nigel

  • Posts: 641
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #36 on: July 19, 2016, 02:18 PM »
   I have pretty much the exact same as on your OP list except I got the 75 and module and I am glad I did as I frequently use the full capacity. I also have the widener extension and reckon it's pretty much essential although I do regularly think of getting the outfeed as well but I can get by with the MFT. As for the of1400 it's a cracking router and I use it for everything including some hefty spindle moulder size profiles. I would also say the sliding table is an excellent addition and can be used for very accurate work. I would also go for a bigger extractor. Anyway good luck with your list.

Offline DarrenB

  • Posts: 17
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #37 on: October 05, 2016, 01:27 PM »
Old thread but I'm thinking about a CMS setup similar to the original poster.
I have a fully equipped MFT3 and a separate Dewalt DW745 table saw. I was planning to sell the Dewalt as its fiddly to move around, takes a lot of space and have lousy dust collection.
I was concerned to read that it offers better precision than a CMS with a TS55 saw. If that's true its bad because the Dewalt is no wonder in regards to precision. For example my T-Track is not equally milled.

I was thinking of getting the extension MFT 3 - VL (495510), router module with an 1400, sliding table and the CMS TS75 module.
My plan was to have the VL table attached to the short side of the MFT but occasionally move it to one of the long side of the MFT to cut larger panels. I would have the saw in the VL part and the router module mounted in my home made work bench. If I need the sliding table for the router I will switch the CMS modules in the VL table.

A few questions.

1. If correctly set up will I be able to get the same precision in a CMS+TS55 like in my Dewalt table saw?

2. Can the MFT table be used as extension table to the VL table for very wide cuts? Can I even have the LA50 fence extending onto the MFT table?

3. Is the VL table easy to quickly remove from one end of the MFT and mount on the other side or should I consider the VL table to be a fixed part of my work table?

4. Will the CMS+TS75+standard Festool fence provide a good enough set up to get consistent results similar or better than my Dewalt table saw, without having to re-calibrate the fence and saw everytime I do a cut?

Offline GarryMartin

  • Posts: 1885
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #38 on: October 05, 2016, 01:38 PM »
1. Yes

2. The CS 50 LA fence is for the CMS GE and Precisio CS 50. If you want to use that type of fence on the MFT/3-VL you need the CS 70 LA which is designed to be used on the MFT/3, MFT/3-VL and the Precisio CS 70. The CS 70 LA fence will allow you to extend on to the MFT/3 table

3. Fairly easy to move from one end to the other, but don't forget it will then be reversed in orientation so the power switch will be at the back/front depending on which end you fit it

4. Yes, although the weak link in this is the CS 70 LA fence. I could never personally get on with it and have replaced it with an Incra fence that I am stupendously happy with

Offline DarrenB

  • Posts: 17
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #39 on: October 06, 2016, 06:00 AM »
1. Yes

2. The CS 50 LA fence is for the CMS GE and Precisio CS 50. If you want to use that type of fence on the MFT/3-VL you need the CS 70 LA which is designed to be used on the MFT/3, MFT/3-VL and the Precisio CS 70. The CS 70 LA fence will allow you to extend on to the MFT/3 table

3. Fairly easy to move from one end to the other, but don't forget it will then be reversed in orientation so the power switch will be at the back/front depending on which end you fit it

4. Yes, although the weak link in this is the CS 70 LA fence. I could never personally get on with it and have replaced it with an Incra fence that I am stupendously happy with

Thank you!

Oh so the wider CS 70 fence then... what are the challenges you see in the fence? Is it hard to align and get it square, or is it wobbly? I guess I would use a combination of the CS70 fence over the MFT3 in the rare cases when I need to cut a very wide panel.

Another question I had was whether the "standard" fence that comes with the CMS TS module can be used with the VL extension table or if the V-grooves of the tables will interact with the fastening of the fence?
I guess that is where the CS70 fence would come in?

Would the hole configuration of the MFT3 coupled with the VL extension table connection to the MFT provide good enough precision to set up your "shop made" MFT based fence, maybe using dogs or similar?

Offline GarryMartin

  • Posts: 1885
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #40 on: October 06, 2016, 03:35 PM »
For the money it costs, the CS 70 fence should be better than it is. It doesn't travel easily along the grooves and there's a very specific approach to tightening/adjusting to ensure it remains square. When used with the MFT/3-VL and MFT/3, you'll need to figure out a way to add your own rule and adjust it according to the plate position.

The "standard" fence uses the same protractor head that you get with your MFT/3, so it's usable in the MFT/3-VL and MFT/3 profiles from both the front and the sides (and the back if need be!)

If you square the MFT/3 accurately to the plate in the MFT/3-VL, then you can certainly come up with a "shop made" fence. I considered using an Original Incra Jig to put something together before using the Incra LS Positioner with the Precision Dogs Precision Plate.

Offline DarrenB

  • Posts: 17
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #41 on: October 07, 2016, 05:52 PM »
Another thing that popped up: I have the full MFT set with the fence, swiveling guiderail etc.
I'm planning to have a VL attached to the MFT with a TS75 in a CMS with the MFT to act as support table for when I cut larger panels. The MFT fence and guiderail would interfere with that.
I'm also planning tI add the sliding table to the CMS.
Wouldn't the existing MFT fence and swivelling guide rail setup with its limited cutting size capacity be handled by the CMS setup?
If that's the case I could retire the MFT fence and get a nice flat MFT back with out disturbing fences and I would do most of my cutting on the VL.
Or do you see a reason for keeping the MFT fence too?

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1752
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #42 on: October 08, 2016, 03:07 PM »
I'm planning to have a VL attached to the MFT with a TS75 in a CMS with the MFT to act as support table for when I cut larger panels. The MFT fence and guiderail would interfere with that.
I'm also planning tI add the sliding table to the CMS.
I would suggest a CMS instead of the VL:
First job would be to create some boards with triangular thingies at the bottom so you can use them to bridge the void between the MFT and the CMS (both are the same height) by simply dropping them into the V-groves of both. Making that bridge in several pieces allows to use the festool fence (which IMHO isn't that bad as some claim).

Quote
Wouldn't the existing MFT fence and swivelling guide rail setup with its limited cutting size capacity be handled by the CMS setup?
Depends on the use case, at times a rail is superiour to a table saw (not 90° cuts along markings).

Offline Coen

  • Posts: 1045
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #43 on: October 08, 2016, 09:39 PM »
Thanks @jobsworth. I din't know that because in Spain Festool website that was not list as CMS extension, but as CS50 extension.

CMS and CS50 are identical; same height, same depth, same width, same side profiles; whatever fits on the sides of the CMS, fits on the CS50, and vice versa.

The problem with the MFT 3-VL is that you can't get it complete with the module and machine and have the same discount. If you get the CMS-GE complete with module and OF-1400 or OF-2200, you save some serious money, like you already noted.

Depending on your local 'used' market, you might want to get the set, then sell the CMS-GE and buy the MFT 3-VL.

On the PS module; I still think they should have the OF module in such a way you can use the PS in it as well. But that's me. I just think €170 for an alu plate is quite expensive.

Offline jbiliter

  • Posts: 1
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #44 on: May 17, 2021, 10:23 AM »
Do you really need the CMS?

For a router table a dedicated table may work better. If you coupled a Triton router TR1 (?) to the table it may be pretty good.

I know this is an old thread, but since folks are always doing research on products I thought I'd drop my experience and thoughts here.  Early in my transition to furniture making form carpentry, I bought the Kreg router table set and used the large Triton router in the table.  I never was completely satisfied with the accuracy of the table/fence.  I had to always tinker with the fence to keep square to the table and the jointing offset is nearly impossible to set up accurately.  The fence width adjustment is 6 screws (3 on each side) and depending on how tight you crank on the screws, it effects the co planer of the fence.  The router mounting plate insert started sagging after a while.  I added braces under the table to help keep level with the table.  The Kreg set wan't cheap, but still less than half the price of the CMS.  I was lucky enough to snag a CMS VL off the Festool Recon site. It was worth every extra dollar I spent over the Kreg.  Plus, I have the Kreg table now for simple set ups when routing multiple features on a piece.  What you get with the CMS is accuracy.  I repeat - accuracy.  Once it is dialed in, it holds.  The adjustments are simp.  The sliding table is fantastic and a huge upgrade to traditional router tables.  I paid extra $ for less aggravation, and I get every dollars worth.  I do wish I had gotten the stand alone table vs. the VL which attaches to the MFT/3, but took what I could from the discounted Recon sale.  My next upgrade is to make mobile cabinets for both the MFT/3 and CMS.  When the CMS is attached to the MFT/3, it does take quite a bit of floor space, but that is my only negative.  I do wish the fence on the sliding table had more t track slots for setting up stops and shop built jigs, but I've just neglected to search for and buy an an aluminum fence replacement.

Offline Coen

  • Posts: 1045
Re: Advice about CMS modules and parts
« Reply #45 on: May 17, 2021, 03:32 PM »
You can use the MFT flipstop on the fence on the sliding table. But