Author Topic: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316  (Read 8062 times)

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Offline pfkiel

  • Posts: 5
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #30 on: December 06, 2020, 04:50 PM »
Thanks Cheese thats good news.  Nice to have a definitive answer.
Paul


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Offline 08G8V8

  • Posts: 146
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #31 on: December 06, 2020, 04:55 PM »
Ordered one today from Woodcraft for my RTS 400 REQ.   thanks


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Offline ben_r_

  • Posts: 1333
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #32 on: December 06, 2020, 05:28 PM »
Man this makes me wish I would have kept my Pro5 all this time. Who'd have thought.
If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

Offline promark747

  • Posts: 487
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2020, 07:58 PM »
Man this makes me wish I would have kept my Pro5 all this time. Who'd have thought.

Ditto

Offline Peter_C

  • Posts: 1222
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #34 on: December 06, 2020, 09:31 PM »
Man this makes me wish I would have kept my Pro5 all this time. Who'd have thought.
I was ready to dump my Pro5 and upgrade it to an ETS EC 125, right when Festool announced the "edge guide", so plans changed, and the Pro5 will be dedicated to edge sanding.

Has anyone come up with a way to store them assembled together in a Systainer? Sys3 size needed?

Roughly how long does it take to put on, and take off? Wish it was some type of quick latch, or thumb type screw. 

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 9117
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #35 on: December 07, 2020, 10:35 AM »
FWIW...I've mounted the ETSC 125 in the Positioning Aid and have been sanding Ambrosia maple drawer front edges. I wanted to remove these blade marks made with a MT 55 and a new blade.  They look worse than they really are, some can be caught with your finger nail while others cannot be caught at all. I'd say they're in the .001"-.003" range.




It was relatively slow going using 240 grit Granat, so I decided to swap out the ETSC for the DTSC...still using 240 Granat the job went 50%-70% faster, Then I noticed this.




I never noticed this amount of sawdust when using the ETSC, then again with the ETSC I had to make several passes, wipe the edge, check for marks and then make several passes a 2nd time and sometimes a 3rd time.
Using the DTSC I just ran it down the edge forwards, then backwards and 95% of the blade marks were removed.

I also noticed this when I turned the DTSC over, sawdust being evacuated through only 2 holes...that makes sense. I'm sure paper usage is not optimal and wonder if the RTSC would be better because the paper can be rotated 180º.



All of these drawer fronts were cut to length using a Kapex with a sharp clean blade. The ends were really nice & smooth. I decided to sand the ends anyways and they became like velvet, just incredibly smooth. That's good news for you @ChuckM for your end grain usage.

Finally, I took a piece of Birdseye maple, adjusted the positioner to 45º and took a quick light pass on the edge with 240 Granat. The outcome was a really nice clean, smooth edge break about .035" wide.


Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 3033
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #36 on: December 07, 2020, 11:29 AM »
Snip.
All of these drawer fronts were cut to length using a Kapex with a sharp clean blade. The ends were really nice & smooth. I decided to sand the ends anyways and they became like velvet, just incredibly smooth. That's good news for you @ChuckM for your end grain usage.


Thanks, Cheese, for sharing that observation. [thumbs up] I plan to pick up my sanding aid along with a few other online orders by the weekend.

I wonder if the dust collection will perform better with the use of mesh-type sandpaper.

Offline xedos

  • Posts: 522
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #37 on: December 07, 2020, 11:45 AM »
Cheese - wonder if mesh abrasive would be a better choice on the DTS ?

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 9117
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #38 on: December 08, 2020, 10:01 AM »
Cheese - wonder if mesh abrasive would be a better choice on the DTS ?

Xedos both you and ChuckM came up with the same idea  [scratch chin]...and I think it's a great one. I'm going to get some net material and try it out.  [big grin]

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 5307
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #39 on: December 08, 2020, 10:25 AM »
“ It was relatively slow going using 240 grit Granat, so I decided to swap out the ETSC for the DTSC...still using 240 Granat the job went 50%-70% faster, Then I noticed this.”

Seriously? The tiny orbit sander was faster that the random orbit sander?

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 9117
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #40 on: December 08, 2020, 10:50 AM »
“ It was relatively slow going using 240 grit Granat, so I decided to swap out the ETSC for the DTSC...still using 240 Granat the job went 50%-70% faster, Then I noticed this.”

Seriously? The tiny orbit sander was faster that the random orbit sander?

Unfortunately that was the case Michael.  [sad]

My original thought was to clamp the Pro 5 in the unit and use it exclusively for edge sanding...the reason being if you remove the bottom insert from the Systainer, everything fits inside as a nice package. There's also room for sandpaper and some extra bases with extra covers.

« Last Edit: December 08, 2020, 11:11 AM by Cheese »

Offline afish

  • Posts: 764
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #41 on: December 08, 2020, 11:16 AM »
“ It was relatively slow going using 240 grit Granat, so I decided to swap out the ETSC for the DTSC...still using 240 Granat the job went 50%-70% faster, Then I noticed this.”

Seriously? The tiny orbit sander was faster that the random orbit sander?

Yes this seems to go against any of my logic as well. I agree if the DTS/RTS works better the RTS is probably the better choice paper wise you can probably get 3-4 uses from one sheet if you really wanted. Plus more surface contact with the edge.  What  hardness pads are you using?

Cheese was the small 45° break put on with the DTS too? looks good.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 9117
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #42 on: December 08, 2020, 11:39 AM »
What  hardness pads are you using?

Cheese was the small 45° break put on with the DTS too? looks good.

Unfortunately the ETS/DTS/RTS series only have soft pads available.  [sad]

Yes, the 45º break was using the DTS with 240 Granat. You have to be real careful and use a light touch or you'll remove more material than you want. Although you could go up to a 320 or 400 grit. I think for this application using the ETS would be a better option.

Offline Peter_C

  • Posts: 1222
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #43 on: December 08, 2020, 04:57 PM »
My original thought was to clamp the Pro 5 in the unit and use it exclusively for edge sanding...the reason being if you remove the bottom insert from the Systainer, everything fits inside as a nice package. There's also room for sandpaper and some extra bases with extra covers.
Well if it still fits in a Sys2 that is perfect. I can make a plastic insert to secure the edge guide and sander as a unit, fit out a section to hold sandpaper that will be used and call it a day. Thanks!

Offline neilc

  • Posts: 3058
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #44 on: December 08, 2020, 09:33 PM »
Just a thought - could you not make a 1” wood block or even one from a cork sanding block that would elevate the RTS / RTSC to better use the width of the sandpaper as you worked.  Not sure if you could use Velcro to adhere one to the base of the positioning aid.  But that would maintain a perpendicular edge guide while allowing more of the sandpaper to be used.


Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 9117
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #45 on: December 09, 2020, 09:24 AM »
Well if it still fits in a Sys2 that is perfect. I can make a plastic insert to secure the edge guide and sander as a unit, fit out a section to hold sandpaper that will be used and call it a day. Thanks!

It's a tight fit but it does fit inside and the cover will close with a little persuasion.

If you make an insert I'd be interested in what it looks like. [big grin]

I really like the idea of being able to hold extra sheets of paper in the Systainer. I've done that with the SurFix Systainer, a 10-pack of 150 discs and a 10-pack of 240 discs always at hand, convenient is an understatement.

Offline Alan m

  • Posts: 3323
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #46 on: December 09, 2020, 04:27 PM »
Just a thought - could you not make a 1” wood block or even one from a cork sanding block that would elevate the RTS / RTSC to better use the width of the sandpaper as you worked.  Not sure if you could use Velcro to adhere one to the base of the positioning aid.  But that would maintain a perpendicular edge guide while allowing more of the sandpaper to be used.



great idea.
you could make it like a craidle around the normal pad that would slide on and off easily.

"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
- Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

Offline 08G8V8

  • Posts: 146
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #47 on: December 10, 2020, 03:49 PM »
Looks like a small amount of trimming will be required to fit the RTS 400 REQ.







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Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 5307
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #48 on: December 10, 2020, 04:14 PM »
“ It was relatively slow going using 240 grit Granat, so I decided to swap out the ETSC for the DTSC...still using 240 Granat the job went 50%-70% faster, Then I noticed this.”

Seriously? The tiny orbit sander was faster that the random orbit sander?

@Cheese   back to the random orbit sander being slower than the orbital...

I’ve noticed when using my Festool random orbit sanders that when I lift the sander off the work the pad stops rotating, or only spins weakly. The pad on my Bosch r.o. sander continues to spin when lifted from the work. If the pad isn’t spinning when using the Positioning Aid it won’t do as much work. Do you recall if it was? If not maybe it needs more lateral pressure than the orbital sanders.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 9117
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #49 on: December 10, 2020, 09:39 PM »
Looks like a small amount of trimming will be required to fit the RTS 400 REQ.

Are you going to be trimming it? If so I’d be interested in the results.  [smile]

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 9117
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #50 on: December 10, 2020, 09:46 PM »

@Cheese   back to the random orbit sander being slower than the orbital...

I’ve noticed when using my Festool random orbit sanders that when I lift the sander off the work the pad stops rotating, or only spins weakly. The pad on my Bosch r.o. sander continues to spin when lifted from the work. If the pad isn’t spinning when using the Positioning Aid it won’t do as much work. Do you recall if it was? If not maybe it needs more lateral pressure than the orbital sanders.

That’s good info Michael, I’ll install both the ETSC and the Pro 5 and report back tomorrow. I was being pretty carefull with the ETSC because the DTSC in comparison was really removing a lot of material.

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 2430
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #51 on: December 10, 2020, 10:43 PM »
Of topic, but I always maintained that most hand tools should have standard mounting points. None of this mismatch (not to mention ghastly bulky design) would be happening if there were a couple strategically placed threaded holes on the body (think of angle grinder, or most planers, Makita 9404, and yes, P1cc  [not worthy]).
When I buy tools mounting option (threaded holes, 43 mm collar, etc.) is always an important criteria. Because I know I'll end up attaching some kind of fence, guide, jig, extra grip, or mounting the tool in a stand.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2020, 11:06 PM by Svar »

Offline mkasdin

  • Posts: 475
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #52 on: December 11, 2020, 01:24 AM »
I will never forgive them for now making this one work or a version for the ETS EC 150.
the orbit on the ETS/Pro5 is 2.2mm. The ETs EC is 3.0mm this might have been part of FT decision. Easier to hold the sander to the project without chasing the sander?  The connection might have been easier. Since I got the ETS EC 125 I’ve had far less use for the Pro5. So I like the idea of repurposing the ETS as a dedicated sheet good edge sander!

Offline 08G8V8

  • Posts: 146
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #53 on: December 12, 2020, 12:21 PM »
Looks like a small amount of trimming will be required to fit the RTS 400 REQ.

Are you going to be trimming it? If so I’d be interested in the results.  [smile]









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Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 3033
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #54 on: December 12, 2020, 03:00 PM »
Installed my aid in one of the Pro5s and gave it a quick test run using the mesh abrasive (120x) at 60* (but without dust extraction). Observations:

1) The factory setting was dead-on. No need to adjust the angle scale.
2) The edge profile was uniform (for comparison, one edge was chamfered with a plane)
3) The mounted sander couldn't fit in the Pro5 Ltd systainer. The aid was disassembled so it could be stored with the sander
4) The user manual isn't really that good, and a couple of drawings are confusing. Festool has a lot to learn from Ikea in this respect.

« Last Edit: December 12, 2020, 03:15 PM by ChuckM »

Offline HarveyWildes

  • Posts: 979
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316 (Sanding Guide)
« Reply #55 on: January 06, 2021, 11:48 AM »
Mine is on the way.  My favorite sander is the ETS EC 150 EQ, but I have a couple of Pro 5's, and the plan was to use up of the 5" sandpaper supply and then sell them or give them to kids/grandkids.  Now I'll have to keep at least one, and start to replenish my supply of 5" paper.

For those of you that have one, what are some of the cool, maybe unexpected, things you've done with it?

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 9117
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #56 on: January 06, 2021, 12:33 PM »
I removed the Systainer insert from the Pro 5 and everything fits inside nicely, including some room for extra sandpaper and extra velour linings.




When the top is lowered there is just a 1 mm gap which completely closes with just a small extra amount of force.


Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 3033
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316 (Sanding Guide)
« Reply #57 on: January 09, 2021, 05:56 PM »
Snip.
For those of you that have one, what are some of the cool, maybe unexpected, things you've done with it?

Not sure if it's considered cool, but I used it today to chamfer ends (at 10*).
« Last Edit: January 09, 2021, 06:02 PM by ChuckM »

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 3033
Re: Teaser: Positioning Aid 205316
« Reply #58 on: January 09, 2021, 06:00 PM »
I removed the Systainer insert from the Pro 5 and everything fits inside nicely, including some room for extra sandpaper and extra velour linings.




When the top is lowered there is just a 1 mm gap which completely closes with just a small extra amount of force.


You're right, Cheese. After retrying a couple of times, I can now store the combo in the case in certain position.