Author Topic: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill  (Read 11788 times)

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Offline mino

  • Posts: 222
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #90 on: February 18, 2021, 06:32 PM »
From the manual:
Quote
8.6 Working without the kickback stopfunction
WARNING
Risk of injury
If the kickback stop function is deactivated, the saw blade is not stopped when it unin­tentionally lifts.
► Only deactivate the kickback stop function if you are working without a rail and your workpiece is so uneven that the kickback stop function would unintentionally be trig­gered several times.
Deactivate the kickback stop function
► Press the kickback stop function OFF but­ton.
► Press and hold the on/off switch within ten seconds.
The kickback stop function remains deactivated until the on/off switch is next released.
The kickback stop function can only be de­activated before the saw is switched on.

Personally, do not like the trade-off and happy I got the pre-this version.

But we live in a Youtube world and with Maffel fanboys dissing Festool all over the place they simply hand to react. The same thing as with the thinner blades ref. deflection etc. etc.
AGC 18(@AGC 125 flange), BHC 18, C 12, CTM 36, DRC 18/4, PSC 420, RS 200, TSC 55
Narex: EDH 82, EFH 36(fixed@LR32), EVP 13 H-2CA
My Precious FS/2: 376, 376, 376 holy, 632, 1016 holy, 2520

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Svar

  • Posts: 2340
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #91 on: February 18, 2021, 06:47 PM »
Thanks, mino. Got it! Seems complicated.
Physical riving knife was a major consideration for me when choosing a track saw. Unfortunately Festool seems to be ditching it too.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2021, 06:58 PM by Svar »

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 1276
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #92 on: February 18, 2021, 06:47 PM »
Is their enough Mafell users for there to be a fanboy base?  [huh]

If that is the case, Mafell can return fire with thicker blades and dual riving knifes, plus lasers (always need lasers)  [big grin]

I think the question comes down to what is the goal.  Is it to make things safe when the bad thing has happened (stop the blade when the saw pops), is it to stop the bad thing from happening to start with (riving knife stopping binding).

In either case, the rules should define the goal, not the method.

My general concern is trying to work a problem using electronics/software verses a physical item.  Not to say that the electronics/software solution isn't a better way for some things.  Pretty sure they can't do a software update that will physically keep the saw cut from closing.

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 2340
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #93 on: February 18, 2021, 06:50 PM »
Ideally need both, electronic and physical riving knife, to cover all aspects of safe and burn/gouge free cutting.

Offline Coen

  • Posts: 799
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #94 on: February 18, 2021, 06:51 PM »
But we live in a Youtube world and with Maffel fanboys dissing Festool all over the place they simply hand to react. The same thing as with the thinner blades ref. deflection etc. etc.

Does Youtube censor Maffel-critics then? It's hard to tell.... lots of Stalinization going on at Youtube... stuff disappeared...

Offline mino

  • Posts: 222
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #95 on: February 18, 2021, 07:31 PM »
Does Youtube censor Maffel-critics then? It's hard to tell.... lots of Stalinization going on at Youtube... stuff disappeared...
Not yet. Will come.

But my point was that the way Youtube review concept works, it gives more voice to amateur and semi-amateur reviewers who go for the "bling" much more than professional magazines would go in past. This means the "general picure" a common customer - who may not have first-hand possibility to discuss with colleagues - gets is skewed more in the "raw performance" and "checkbox" type comparisons and less of the deep trade-offs polemic than in the past.

This affects less the professional market, naturally. But even there there are a LOT of potential customers in the contractor trade etc. which just go for "more power/more feature/more mana" stuff.

This forces the makers of even high end kit to mend its products more in that direction to stay relevant.

It is what it is.
Festool is actually extremely resistive to this, but they can stay only so much "different" before it starts affecting them in sales too much.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2021, 07:33 PM by mino »
AGC 18(@AGC 125 flange), BHC 18, C 12, CTM 36, DRC 18/4, PSC 420, RS 200, TSC 55
Narex: EDH 82, EFH 36(fixed@LR32), EVP 13 H-2CA
My Precious FS/2: 376, 376, 376 holy, 632, 1016 holy, 2520

Offline Coen

  • Posts: 799
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #96 on: February 18, 2021, 08:09 PM »
Festool could do with some more explanation of their own cool features. Eg show that the Systainer inlay has dedicated space for the accessories in the inlay. If you ever thought a Festool inlay was bad... my oh my, you haven't seen Bosch inlays.  :o

Offline ben_r_

  • Posts: 1329
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #97 on: February 18, 2021, 11:59 PM »
Nice! I love it when the new "upgrades" or features are nothing I care about! Means I dont have to give them any more money!
If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

Offline _Ben_

  • Posts: 21
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #98 on: February 19, 2021, 10:03 AM »
Regarding the TPC 18 drill, does anyone know whether the black housing surrounding the gearbox is plastic?

I've got access to all those standards and have had a quick look through. I was quite surprised to see that 62841-2-5-2014 "particular requirements for hand-held circular saws" doesn't actually mandate an anti-kickback device at all. The standard does go into some detail about the safe operation of such a saw which I recognise as the instructions that manufacturers include in their safety booklets.

Annex BB indicates that for saws without a riving knife, there are additional compliance check to ensure that the blade will retract or be fully guarded within 0.3s after the device has been dropped twice as follows:

a) oriented with the lower guard being at bottom, so that the saw will strike the concrete
floor with the base plate parallel to the floor;
b) oriented so that the saw will strike the concrete floor in a hand carrying position.

Noting that the version of the standard above indicates that this is carried out with a 2mm (!) thick steel disc fitted.

It's actually pretty precise on how the saw needs to be build if it doesn't have a riving knife. I was - by now - able to take a look at it - partly at least.

Main take away is, if no riving knife is present, saw needs to be designed in a way that if it jumps out of the cut either a pendulum cover swings over the blade rapidly, or in case of a plung saw, the action is smooth, fast and strong enough for the blade being retracted immediately. (Yeah, I know ...) And in this case, the German DIN got weakened through this harmonizing process.

CE is always a self-declaration of the manufacturer, that he has abided by all rules/standards applicable.

Kind regards,
Oliver

Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 1606
  • formerly @the_black_tie_diyer - 22/02/21 inactive.
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #99 on: February 19, 2021, 10:08 AM »
Do you by chance have access to outdated versions as well? Would be interesting to know what the original DIN said before it was harmonized and became an EN.

Kind regards,
Oliver
Kind regards,
Oliver

"... . Say yes to stuff, and it will take you interesting places." - Anne Richards, CEO Fidelity International

Offline _Ben_

  • Posts: 21
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #100 on: February 19, 2021, 02:35 PM »
Hmm, my subscription does have some limitations but the earliest related standard I can see is EN 50144-2-5 (1996) "Particular requirements for circular saws and circular knives". At face value, the 1996 document doesn't look that much different from the 2014 one.

EN 50144-2-5 (1996) seems to have superseded IID 400.2E S2:1988 which I guess must be in the era of the original DIN?! Probably have a few copies kicking around in the Wendlingen museum :).

Do you by chance have access to outdated versions as well? Would be interesting to know what the original DIN said before it was harmonized and became an EN.

Kind regards,
Oliver

Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 1606
  • formerly @the_black_tie_diyer - 22/02/21 inactive.
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #101 on: February 19, 2021, 02:39 PM »
Thanks for looking into it Ben!

Kind regards,
Oliver
Kind regards,
Oliver

"... . Say yes to stuff, and it will take you interesting places." - Anne Richards, CEO Fidelity International

Offline Otakar Svojše

  • Posts: 52
Re: New TSC 55 K saw and TPC 18 drill
« Reply #102 on: February 23, 2021, 12:49 PM »
TPC 18 - Angle attachment... ;-) 
« Last Edit: February 23, 2021, 02:12 PM by Otakar Svojše »