Author Topic: New Festool TKS-80 ?  (Read 3408 times)

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Offline Intex

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New Festool TKS-80 ?
« on: May 18, 2019, 01:33 PM »
I though that many more members look at this discussion, so I wanted to post again here, to see if any of our European/UK  members have any idea when the TKS-80 table saw with Sawstop technology may be available in EUROPE/UK (North America introduction seems to always be much later).
If they have been demoing the unit at various locations, I would assume that the introduction for sale would be immenent ?? The "prototype" I saw looked more like a production model???

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Online Gregor

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2019, 11:29 AM »
I have asked Festool headquarters the single question of 'when' a good while back, apart from the automated 'we got your question and will get back to you asap'... no answer yet.

Offline Intex

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2019, 03:35 PM »
Thank you Gregor.
I am not sure that Festool really is familiar with   marketing here in the U.S.  We have become a market of "we want it now" consumers. I have NO Problem with Apple's style of marketing, Keep it totally secret until you announce and simultaneously, ship the product - You build up a demand - then immediately satisfy it (or as soon as you can), but this constant showing of equipment, then dragging out the rollout for months or years, just drives customers to their competitors. I consider myself a very loyal brand customer, but I am not sure with their marketing.

Offline Intex

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2019, 04:34 PM »
It's been about 6 months now, has anyone heard about a release date for the TKS-80?

I hope that I am not sitting and waiting for a phantom product.

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2019, 05:42 PM »
It's been about 6 months now, has anyone heard about a release date for the TKS-80?

I hope that I am not sitting and waiting for a phantom product.

@Intex , if you are looking forward to the TKS-80 in North America, I would move on.  I do not believe that Festool plans to bring that saw to North America anytime in the near future if at all.  Reading stuff between the lines leaves me to believe that the parent company of Festool -TTS-does not want to cannabilize their investment in Sawstop (which they own) in the US.  I also suspect that it would be normal for situations like this to be handled by purchase agreements.

Peter

Offline Bob D.

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2019, 09:28 PM »
Found this interview with Steve Gass. It's a German site but Google Chrome translates it automagically.

https://www.festool.de/blog/inside/sawstop-interview
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It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?

Offline Alanbach

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2019, 10:15 PM »
@Peter Halle - If this saw was ever available in NA, given its price, form factor, size, portability, etc. wouldn’t it’s primary competition be Sawstop’s JSS? If so, why on earth would they ever do that?

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2019, 10:24 PM »
@Peter Halle - If this saw was ever available in NA, given its price, form factor, size, portability, etc. wouldn’t it’s primary competition be Sawstop’s JSS? If so, why on earth would they ever do that?

Exactly.  I don’t think that they will.

Peter

Offline Bob D.

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2019, 06:15 AM »
I would hazard a guess that Gass made an agreement when(if) he sold the company that they (Festool) will not market in NA and that he can continue to sell and support the SawStop line here in NA for x number of years.

Either that or Gass has not sold SawStop outright and has only licensed to Festool the right to develop and market products based on SawStop technology in all markets other than NA.
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It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?

Online Gregor

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2019, 10:33 AM »
I asked about introduction in Europe, last Roadshow the answer to that question was 'somewhen 2020'.

Regarding the US I don't expect TKS-80 to happen there, simply from being irrelevant by SawStop being available.

Offline jobsworth

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2019, 12:35 PM »
@Gregor
Tru and for the price of the TKS-80 here, We can the saw stop cabinent saw. We all know FT aient cheap

Offline Alex

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2019, 12:36 PM »
I think they will make a US model also. They know there is a market for it, no reason to leave it be.

I even expect Festool to get more known of it as a brand in the US, because Americans already know SawStop, and a brand with a competing product will be noticed.

But you'll have to wait untill they've made enough EU models. That's how they work.

Offline jarbroen

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2019, 01:54 PM »
I'd be happy with a SawStop(or Festool version) that matched the height of the MFT.
Instant infeed or outfeed tables.

The ability to fold up the saw and stow it away if needed would be awesome as well.

Those two features are the biggest ones that made me buy the CMS.  So easy to integrate and super easy to reconfigure/store when needed.

Offline ChuckM

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #13 on: October 31, 2019, 07:32 PM »
It doesn't make sense to create your own enemy, pitching a Festool saw against the SS Jobsite saw...BUT, what if SS decided to drop the jobsite segment and focus on the cabinet & contractor sectors?

There isn't enough market info. to tell how the new Festool saw will play out in this part of the world.

Offline DeformedTree

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #14 on: October 31, 2019, 08:05 PM »
How would the TKS-80 compete with existing saw stop products?   The basis that they are both table saws?

The TKS-80 is based on CS platform which is very different than anything sold here.  I don't see how anyone would be cross shopping the TKS-80 with current Saw Stop products.

No different than people wouldn't cross shop current CS saws and CMS with TS inserts with other table saws out there.

Offline Alanbach

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #15 on: October 31, 2019, 10:28 PM »
I just spoke with one of the Sawstop guys the other day. Although we did not talk about this specifically it was very clear that they are laser focused right now on helping their parent company develop new products to expand Table saw market share in the EU. Apparently they have doubled the size of their engineering staff and it is virtually all focused on products for Europe. I think that see huge potential in introducing a little American design into European table saw design (like the blade brake) but from my conversation I am pretty sure that they do not feel that is a two way street. Honestly, I don’t think that they see any potential in introducing European style saw influences into the American table saw market. The big chunk of potential in the US market is for less expensive table saws, not more expensive. It is one of the reasons that they are doing so well with the Jobsite saw here of late.

Offline DeformedTree

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #16 on: October 31, 2019, 11:26 PM »
Not bringing it to the US because they don't feel there is a market for that size/type saw would be the main reason not to bring it. Like said, in the US, people want stuff low price.

Of course if you don't bring it, you never know what the real interest is.

A Mafell Erika is very expensive, portable, though not that small.  They sell them, we just have no idea how many.

Offline Intex

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #17 on: November 03, 2019, 02:19 PM »
This isn’t the 1980’s, there isn’t a clearly defined American market vs European market. When people want something not available here they just import it. I have several tools here that were imported from UK and Germany, including Festool no big deal Fedex DHL and UPS have made it as easy as me ordering something from New York

I had the top of the line Sawstop saw the month it came out and loved it. Circumstances change and now the size of my garage shop is 1/4the size and I want something as safe but MUCH smaller and able to fold up like my MFT and Kapex

The sawstop contractor saw is nowhere the same quality or fit and finish of their larger ones. They had to cut too many corners to make it a mass market saw. I’m not interested in mass market nor is Festool. The first day trying asawstop contractor saw the whole fence assembly broke and even the dealer could not fix it. It’s NO WAY a precision piece like what I expect of Festool

The day it’s released in Europe is fine for me, I’ll have it the same week, without warranty
I’m just wondering if they will and when release it in Europe

Offline jobsworth

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #18 on: November 03, 2019, 05:06 PM »
Well if ya want a nice saw look at the Mafell Erica 85 that should do and its definiately a well built quality saw. Thats available right now.

https://www.timberwolftools.com/mafell-erika-85ec-pull-push-saw






Offline Intex

  • Posts: 111
Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #19 on: November 03, 2019, 06:35 PM »
Looked at it,it seems nice but prefer the sawstop technology. After you wood shop class teacher cut his fingers in class I am trying to get all the help I can

Offline jobsworth

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #20 on: November 03, 2019, 07:22 PM »
ive never hirt my self when I used the safety blade guard, and a push stick. I got hurt once but didnt use said safety items and I've been doing this for over 25 years

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 595
Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #21 on: November 03, 2019, 10:30 PM »
This isn’t the 1980’s, there isn’t a clearly defined American market vs European market. When people want something not available here they just import it. I have several tools here that were imported from UK and Germany, including Festool no big deal Fedex DHL and UPS have made it as easy as me ordering something from New York

I had the top of the line Sawstop saw the month it came out and loved it. Circumstances change and now the size of my garage shop is 1/4the size and I want something as safe but MUCH smaller and able to fold up like my MFT and Kapex

The sawstop contractor saw is nowhere the same quality or fit and finish of their larger ones. They had to cut too many corners to make it a mass market saw. I’m not interested in mass market nor is Festool. The first day trying asawstop contractor saw the whole fence assembly broke and even the dealer could not fix it. It’s NO WAY a precision piece like what I expect of Festool

The day it’s released in Europe is fine for me, I’ll have it the same week, without warranty
I’m just wondering if they will and when release it in Europe

Not sure when or how you did it, but my experience in getting a NAINA festool product took many tries over a few months to have success in getting one.  It would be fine if it was so easy, but companies like festool are very active in stopping people from getting stuff.  While sites like Amazon have improved things in recent times to allow folks to buy cross borders, you still are limited by the companies making or selling the products. 

Obviously if someone wanted, they could set up a business with a European contact that buys stuff there, ships, and then person resells it here like any regular private party sale. Assuming they pay all VAT/duties/Imports/taxes etc along the way companies like Festool wouldn't be able to do anything other than not support a warranty.  If a company doesn't want to sell something in various countries that is there business to do so.  Of course at someone point a large company steps in with the government and does something like Mercedes did and get a 25 year import ban on cars into the US. 

I would love to see more European companies see the US as just another place to sell stuff and allow people to buy their stuff right out of the EU, but for various reasons most want to alter products for the US or set up an operation here, which involves too much, so they just don't.  I give Mafell some credit here where they understand that you can sell products here as-is and not make them US special. Of course some products they do make US versions of too. Saws like the Erika 85 mentioned is just the German version, no changes.  Still many companies will always think they need to ameri-fy products.  Look at festool removing metric markings on the tools.

Of course you will always have interesting the US trying to stop things too, they don't want competition, people have more options to buy the things they want.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #22 on: November 04, 2019, 03:56 AM »
The TKS-80 will be available in the UK some time in 2020.
If I lived in the states, I wouldn’t be looking at a TKS-80, when I have the choice of all those lovely SawStop machines.

The TKS-80 is a nice saw but, no push pull facility, so I’m out.  [wink]

Offline Intex

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #23 on: November 04, 2019, 07:31 PM »
The problem is that 5hey are all much larger than theTKS80, and the smallest sawstop is Not that “lovely”

Offline DeformedTree

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Re: New Festool TKS-80 ?
« Reply #24 on: November 04, 2019, 10:13 PM »
The TKS-80 will be available in the UK some time in 2020.
If I lived in the states, I wouldn’t be looking at a TKS-80, when I have the choice of all those lovely SawStop machines.

The TKS-80 is a nice saw but, no push pull facility, so I’m out.  [wink]

Mount the TKS-80 on casters, now it's push pull.

Folks will always want what they can't have.  Folks in the US want stuff from Europe they can't have, and folks from Europe want stuff from the US they don't get...