Author Topic: Festool Surfix and Swiss Made CE Zobo drill bits discontinued. (Read 9085 times)

six-point socket II · « **on:** January 08, 2021, 04:38 AM »

Hi!

Just a heads up, title says it all.

Surfix didn't make the '21 catalog and is discontinued. Get what you need while you still can - especially the sponges, maybe a spare adaptor and/or some of the small containers or 5l containers. Comparable oils will be/ are available through Leinos - who produced the oils for Festool.

Forstner drill bits are no longer System Zobo drill bits/ Swiss made. Rumors are they are now produced in Austria. Tips are still exchangeable.

Kind regards,
Oliver

usernumber1 · « **Reply #1 on:** January 08, 2021, 07:20 AM »

i wonder if narex is going to make their forstner bits now that festool owns them

Birdhunter · « **Reply #2 on:** January 08, 2021, 07:28 AM »

Too bad, the Zobo bits are incredible.

Cheese · « **Reply #3 on:** January 08, 2021, 11:45 AM »

Quote from: Birdhunter on January 08, 2021, 07:28 AM

Too bad, the Zobo bits are incredible.

True...however they will still be available from Timber Tools.

https://www.timbertools.com/ZOBO-Central-Drilling-Systems/

I have a larger issue with discontinuing the Surfix product line. I use that stuff a lot.

serge0n · « **Reply #4 on:** January 08, 2021, 01:24 PM »

@six-point socket II thank you for posting this! Also big thanks for mentioning the oil producer - Leinos. Never heard of them, but will make a mental note of what to get once I run out of my Surfix oil.

I was on the fence about ordering a Festool Zobo set, but I placed an order right after reading this. It looks like Zobo is on par or better than the best forstner bits from Famag.

Surfix being phased out is really sad, this is my go-to wood finish. I got a 5 liter hard oil can a couple of years ago that still has 4 liters left, so I'm good there, but I really have to stock up on the pads as each pad is only good for 1 project.

mino · « **Reply #5 on:** January 08, 2021, 02:49 PM »

Quote from: usernumber1 on January 08, 2021, 07:20 AM

i wonder if narex is going to make their forstner bits now that festool owns them

The Narex (at Česká Lípa Town) that is part of TTS is a maker of power tools only plus some accessories for these (see narex.cz). It is not "the Narex" which make the other tools like Narex Bystřice (narextools.cz) or Narex Bučovice (Bučovice Tools, maker of industrial tools for CNCs etc. etc.), or I think about 5 other small companies.

The "Narex" Brand stands for "Nář(adí)Ex(port)" /aka "ToolsExport"/ and was initially a unifying brand for tools which were exported from Czechoslovakia during the Cold War period. Eventually the brand ended up being used universally. As such there are today many companies with rights to the "Narex" brand/name.

Basically, any factory which was making tools under this umbrella has today the rights to produce still under the name. Is kinda like a joint trademark ownership. All of these are professional/high end tool producers as the communists did not consider any tools except professional quality as worth producing ... but TTS owns only the power tools factory at Česká Lípa. Though they do subcontract things here and there from the other "Narex" enterprises.

usernumber1 · « **Reply #6 on:** January 08, 2021, 06:26 PM »

Quote from: mino on January 08, 2021, 02:49 PM

Quote from: usernumber1 on January 08, 2021, 07:20 AM
i wonder if narex is going to make their forstner bits now that festool owns them
The Narex (at Česká Lípa Town) that is part of TTS is a maker of power tools only plus some accessories for these (see narex.cz). It is not "the Narex" which make the other tools like Narex Bystřice (narextools.cz) or Narex Bučovice (Bučovice Tools, maker of industrial tools for CNCs etc. etc.)

The "Narex" Brand stands for "Nář(adí)Ex(port)" /aka "ToolsExport"/ and was initially a unifying brand for tools which were exported from Czechoslovakia during the Cold War period. Eventually the brand ended up being used universally. As such there are today many companies with rights to the "Narex" brand/name.

Basically, any factory which was making tools under this umbrella has today the rights to produce still under the name. Is kinda like a joint trademark ownership. All of these are professional/high end tool producers as the communists did not consider any tools except professional quality as worth producing ... but TTS owns only the power tools factory at Česká Lípa even though the subcontract things here and there from the other "Narex" enterprises.

fascinating, thanks for explaining this! i had issues understanding when i saw it at first

FestitaMakool · « **Reply #7 on:** January 08, 2021, 06:48 PM »

And here’s the the new forstner bit set in question.
I liked that it now is presented and delivered in a SYS mini.
The centering bit seems to be the same, there’s also a recovery hole.
Wonder if these will be of the same quality, knowing Festool, hopefully the same quality, or maybe better? Said to be in “ball bearing” steel, sharpen up to 5 times the advertisement says.
I’ve been on the fence on the Zobo set, as I have some decent forstner bit set from before.
Should I buy the new set, or the old?

Festool Surfix and Swiss Made CE Zobo drill bits discontinued.

serge0n · « **Reply #8 on:** January 08, 2021, 07:11 PM »

Quote from: FestitaMakool on January 08, 2021, 06:48 PM

Wonder if these will be of the same quality, knowing Festool, hopefully the same quality, or maybe better? Said to be in “ball bearing” steel, sharpen up to 5 times the advertisement says.

Zobo bits are made of some secret sauce alloy and are very light. The heat treatment process for Zobo is very involved, they hold them at a certain temperature for several hours and then let them cool along with the furnace. Then the machining, sharpening and finishing occurs. Along the way the bit are heat treated several more times. As a result each batch of bits takes a week to produce, that's why they are so expensive.
Zobo can be re-sharpened up to 30 times.

contendernut · « **Reply #9 on:** January 08, 2021, 07:42 PM »

Is the set that comes in the mini systainer being discontinued also, or only the older set in the flip top box?

six-point socket II · « **Reply #10 on:** January 08, 2021, 10:25 PM »

Quote from: serge0n on January 08, 2021, 01:24 PM

@six-point socket II thank you for posting this! Also big thanks for mentioning the oil producer - Leinos. Never heard of them, but will make a mental note of what to get once I run out of my Surfix oil.

I was on the fence about ordering a Festool Zobo set, but I placed an order right after reading this. It looks like Zobo is on par or better than the best forstner bits from Famag.

Surfix being phased out is really sad, this is my go-to wood finish. I got a 5 liter hard oil can a couple of years ago that still has 4 liters left, so I'm good there, but I really have to stock up on the pads as each pad is only good for 1 project.

Gladly done, no problem. I only learned about all of this a couple of days ago myself.

Quote from: mino on January 08, 2021, 02:49 PM

Quote from: usernumber1 on January 08, 2021, 07:20 AM
i wonder if narex is going to make their forstner bits now that festool owns them
The Narex (at Česká Lípa Town) that is part of TTS is a maker of power tools only plus some accessories for these (see narex.cz). It is not "the Narex" which make the other tools like Narex Bystřice (narextools.cz) or Narex Bučovice (Bučovice Tools, maker of industrial tools for CNCs etc. etc.)

The "Narex" Brand stands for "Nář(adí)Ex(port)" /aka "ToolsExport"/ and was initially a unifying brand for tools which were exported from Czechoslovakia during the Cold War period. Eventually the brand ended up being used universally. As such there are today many companies with rights to the "Narex" brand/name.

Basically, any factory which was making tools under this umbrella has today the rights to produce still under the name. Is kinda like a joint trademark ownership. All of these are professional/high end tool producers as the communists did not consider any tools except professional quality as worth producing ... but TTS owns only the power tools factory at Česká Lípa even though the subcontract things here and there from the other "Narex" enterprises.

Thanks for the in-depth explanation!

Quote from: serge0n on January 08, 2021, 01:24 PM

@six-point socket II thank you for posting this! Also big thanks for mentioning the oil producer - Leinos. Never heard of them, but will make a mental note of what to get once I run out of my Surfix oil.

I was on the fence about ordering a Festool Zobo set, but I placed an order right after reading this. It looks like Zobo is on par or better than the best forstner bits from Famag.

Surfix being phased out is really sad, this is my go-to wood finish. I got a 5 liter hard oil can a couple of years ago that still has 4 liters left, so I'm good there, but I really have to stock up on the pads as each pad is only good for 1 project.

Quote from: contendernut on January 08, 2021, 07:42 PM

Is the set that comes in the mini systainer being discontinued also, or only the older set in the flip top box?

The set that @FestitaMakool posted about is the new set and will remain available. The flip top box will be gone at some point.

Discontinued:

NEW:

Kind regards,
Oliver

Cheese · « **Reply #11 on:** January 09, 2021, 09:59 AM »

FWIW...the Zobo bits are available in chrome steel or carbide.

https://www.timbertools.com/System-3-Chromium-Drill-Bits/

https://www.timbertools.com/Zobo-S3-CARBIDE-Drill-Bits/

Like serge0n mentioned, the chrome steel Zobo bits can be resharpened up to 30 times, I'd expect it's the same case with the carbide Zobo bits.

Bob D. · « **Reply #12 on:** January 09, 2021, 05:38 PM »

Thanks Oliver, there goes my FT allowance for the month. Now I have to stock up on Surfix goodies before they disappear.

But seriously, thanks for the heads up.

Edit: 1-12-20
Well that didn't take long.

_Ben_ · « **Reply #13 on:** January 09, 2021, 07:26 PM »

darn that's a shame, especially those zobo bits. Absolute works of art. Cheers for early info.

I'm hoping that festool will be carrying spares for the surfix kit for a few years..

jronman · « **Reply #14 on:** January 10, 2021, 07:09 PM »

I was considering getting a polishing setup for my rotex 150to apply oil finishes. I should probably get the Suffix kit before it is gone.

Bertotti · « **Reply #15 on:** January 10, 2021, 10:27 PM »

I just bought the Surfix kit and some extra pads but with them being discontinued will this whole kit be unusable once supplies are gone? No more pad refills or the bit they mount on? Felling like I got the short end again.

six-point socket II · « **Reply #16 on:** January 11, 2021, 02:52 AM »

The sponges "OS-STF" will be gone as well as the adapter. The 0.3l containers w/ green nozzle, and also the 5l containers will be gone.

STF D125/150 green, STF D125/150 white, should remain available, obviously as well as the sandpaper.

So to further use the system you need to take very good care of the 0.3l containers and the green nozzles. Be careful: a friend of mine had the silicone inside the green nozzle dissolve when he re-filed with another oil ...

Personally, I'd say the 0.3l containers w/ green nozzle together with the OS-STF sponges are most important, since only these fit the adapter. Everything else can be substituted - or remains available.

Just ensure you don't have to switch oils within a single project.

Kind regards,
Oliver

Cypren · « **Reply #17 on:** January 11, 2021, 05:20 AM »

One thing worth mentioning for those in the US is that while you will still be able to buy the Zobo bits through Timber Tools, last I checked the Festool set was a massive discount compared to the matching TT bit prices: $190 for bits that would cost over $400 if bought individually. If you think you might want them, I’d suggest snapping up a set before they’re all gone.

Bob D. · « **Reply #18 on:** January 11, 2021, 05:27 AM »

$190 ??

I checked the TT site and the System 2 Starter Set is $290 this morning.

https://www.timbertools.com/Zobo-System-2-Starter-Box.html

Bert Vanderveen · « **Reply #19 on:** January 11, 2021, 10:51 AM »

Just ordered a Surfix Set and some consumables. Isn’t this Forum wonderful? — Nothing worse than ‘fishing behind the net’ (lit. translation of Dutch proverb).

BTW I own two sets of Zobo’s, so I am well covered there. Esp. since someone noted that they can be sharpened up to 15 times…

Bertotti · « **Reply #20 on:** January 12, 2021, 04:21 PM »

Well I have a tin of one step and a tin of outdoor coming along with 5l of the HD and two .3l HD refills so that leaves me with three bases and 7 of the little .3l bottles. 3hd 2od and 2 onestep. 15 foam pads. I hope someone picks up the way this system works because it is really handy although for anything other than flat you're back to cloths no biggie! As for the silicone tops I think I could fab up something to work. I actually think once these wear out I could fab up some hard wood bases and get some suitable bottles to use on top. Now that I have an idea of how it all works but it is very disappointing fo ratios to happen just after I bought the kit. I can honestly say I would not have bought the kit had I realized this would happen. Not a chance in heck.

Cheese · « **Reply #21 on:** January 12, 2021, 05:49 PM »

Well I looked at the 2021 Festool UK catalog yesterday and the Surfix is indeed gone but the Zobo bits are still listed.

All Surfix products are still listed on the Festool USA website. I believe the Festool oils have a shelf life of 5 years for the outdoor and one-step oils & 2 years for the heavy duty oil.

Coen · « **Reply #22 on:** January 12, 2021, 05:57 PM »

I think the Surfix system didn't sell that well either. My local dealer had a set for sale for quite a while.

Will the pads be available for 10 years, like machine parts? Or..? (Like I got my CMS-PS... all in parts

)

six-point socket II · « **Reply #23 on:** January 13, 2021, 06:11 AM »

@Cheese - I was a little nervous after reading your comment regarding the CE Zobot bits and checked the 21 UK catalog: It's the same new Centrotec Forstner bits that are being offered in Germany. No more Swiss Made Zobo.

Kind regards,
Oliver

Cheese · « **Reply #24 on:** January 13, 2021, 10:38 AM »

Quote from: six-point socket II on January 13, 2021, 06:11 AM

@Cheese - I was a little nervous after reading your comment regarding the CE Zobot bits and checked the 21 UK catalog: It's the same new Centrotec Forstner bits that are being offered in Germany. No more Swiss Made Zobo.

Kind regards,
Oliver

Ah...thanks for that Oliver. Good to know.

Bertotti · « **Reply #25 on:** January 13, 2021, 08:45 PM »

I emailed Festoolusa about the surfix product deletion. They replied and told me it was ok to share the reply here. Other than this there is no detailed information available yet about the other items like the foam pads or the vlies and such. Here's the reply.

"Hello,
Thank you for contacting Festool. It seems like the oil system will be discontinued in the near future due to low sales. At this time there is no official word as to when exactly the Surfix Oil will be discontinued in the North American Market. The Surfix Oil System is active at this time and components able to be purchased without problems. There is no exact date as to when that will change.

Best Regards,
_________________________
Festool USA LLC
400 N. Enterprise Blvd.
Lebanon, IN 46052".

Well that's it in a nut shell at the moment. I had two orders in with a company for oil and pads and refill and got a call today form them. I was thinking here it is the hammer is falling but it wasn't. I thought they were going to tell me it was unavailable but they said they are still able to order it with no word of it being unavailable! Good news in my little world.

Cheese · « **Reply #26 on:** January 18, 2021, 10:37 AM »

I just checked the UK and the German websites and all of Surfix products are still listed. I assume they'll remain listed until the inventory is gone. I'm going to purchase some back-up today from Woodcraft.

Bert Vanderveen · « **Reply #27 on:** January 19, 2021, 06:08 AM »

Quote from: Cheese on January 18, 2021, 10:37 AM

I just checked the UK and the German websites and all of Surfix products are still listed. I assume they'll remain listed until the inventory is gone. I'm going to purchase some back-up today from Woodcraft.

All Surfix products are MIA in the 2021 catalogue.

six-point socket II · « **Reply #28 on:** January 19, 2021, 06:35 AM »

Sadly the Surfix didn't "fly off the shelves" prior and it probably won't now, after it has been discontinued. <- This is 100%.

So, as long as local vendors, or in case of Festool USA, the US warehouse, still have stock, it will probably remain on the shelves for the time being.

Speaking for Germany, some online dealers have increased the prices of their remaining Surfix/accessories stock.

Kind regards,
Oliver

Coen · « **Reply #29 on:** January 19, 2021, 10:30 AM »

Well, people that invested into it will be annoyed when they can't get replacement pads...