Author Topic: Festool Bit Holder Reference Topic (Read 64301 times)

TinyShop · « **on:** July 01, 2019, 01:41 PM »

Moderator Note - Though this topic was started by TinyShop due to a problem with a Festool bit holder it has become a great source for info on what works with what, etc. Due a to a great contribution in testing and pictures from sixpointsocket. So it has been stickied and renamed.

If anyone has similar info to contribute and expand what is already posted on Festool bit holders, please add it to this topic.

Seth

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I purchased one of these locking bit holders with the understanding (from the available product literature and from reading elsewhere on the FOG) that it would lock any wire detent bit. Well, either mine is not functioning properly or maybe I need to use Festool-branded bits (?). But aren't all wire detent bits the same? Any user experiences out there that can shed some light on this issue of compatibility? I was really looking forward to being able to keep bits from sticking to the heads of certain fasteners (galvie roofing screws, for instance). What gives?

six-point socket II · « **Reply #1 on:** July 01, 2019, 01:52 PM »

Hi,

It doesn‘t engage properly on some bits, I have noticed that. Some of them are even Festool branded so spare yourself the $.

I have yet to find a pattern on those bits that aren‘t properly seated. It‘s maybe 5 or so, all different. And mostly another from the same batch works.

I planned to take it to the Roadshow this year.

Kind regards,
Oliver

TinyShop · « **Reply #2 on:** July 01, 2019, 03:42 PM »

@six-point socket II - thanks for the feedback. I'm particularly bummed that the:

SHOCKWAVE™ Insert Magnetic Nut Driver Set

...set that arrived in the mail won't lock into the bit holder. I followed the recommendation found elsewhere on this forum (that this paeticular make and model of nut driver would indeed lock into the holder) only to find that they in fact do not. All of my other nut drivers are ball detent and I got sick of them sticking to roofing screw heads. I'm no better off with the wire detent Mileaukee versions. For what it's worth, none of the wire detent driver bits that I've collected over the years are held fast by the Festool holder. Maybe someone from Festool can pipe in with some guidance?

six-point socket II · « **Reply #3 on:** July 01, 2019, 03:47 PM »

I have to tidy up a little in the basement first, but after that - I'll get my BHS 65 and some bits out and do some measuring. Maybe we can get to the bottom of this.

I'll take some pictures and make another post, later.

Kind regards,
Oliver

six-point socket II · « **Reply #4 on:** July 01, 2019, 07:25 PM »

Hi!

Ok, so I grabbed a bunch of different bits and the Festool BHS 65 CE. (I have more bits if necessary ...

)

Left to right:

DeWalt Extreme Impact Torsion (China); Festool (?); GRK fasteners brand (USA?); Athlet T-Star (Germany); Snap-On ACR, (USA); Snap-On (Czech) (prob. Wera); Wera Classic (Czech); PB Swiss (Switzerland); Festool (?); Spax T-Star (prob. Wera) (Czech), Athlet (Germany), Wiha Y-Bit (?), Würth AW (Germany?), PB Swiss (Switzerland).

DeWalt Extreme Impact Torsion (China) - Festool BHS 65 CE does not engage properly.

Festool (?) - Festool BHS 65 CE does not engage properly.

GRK fasteners brand (USA?) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Athlet T-Star (Germany) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Snap-On ACR, (USA) - Festool BHS 65 CE does not engage properly. (At all, doesn't even fit all the way down ...)

Snap-On (Czech) (prob. Wera) - Festool BHS 65 CE does not engage properly.

Wera Classic (Czech) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

PB Swiss C6 (Switzerland) - Festool BHS 65 CE does not engage properly, but well enough to hold bit.

Festool (?) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Spax T-Star (prob. Wera) (Czech) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Athlet (Germany) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Wiha Y-Bit (?) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Würth AW (Germany?) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly, but does not hold bit.

PB Swiss E6 (Switzerland) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Grouped.

So I took some measurements and my observation is that it's really all about the dents (position and deepness). In case of the Snap-On ACR bit, it's simply too thick, I will have to re-check with another one. That it will lock the PB Swiss E6 but not the Würth E6 is interesting, too.

That it locks the PB Swiss C6 but doesn't engage all the way, that baffles me the most. I will check with another one.

Using mostly T-Star, the BHS 65 CE doesn't give me any more trouble than other bit holders.

Anyway, I will take it - and some bits - to the next Roadshow event if I can attend and see what Festool's thoughts on this are.

Kind regards,
Oliver

Cheese · « **Reply #5 on:** July 02, 2019, 12:45 AM »

Kudos to you Oliver...you’ve taken on a particularly challenging information dump and tried to make sense of it.

The issue has always been the location of the wire detents and the dimensional sizing of the detents. Because this has never been an ANSI driven standard, it’s become a sort of “Wild West” situation. Where a particular manufacturer will come up with a solution for some of the detent variations but will fail to solve the rest of the variations as it’s darn near impossible to do because there is no universally accepted standard and they are all over the board.

Bob D. · « **Reply #6 on:** July 02, 2019, 05:06 AM »

Yes, thank you Oliver for taking the time to try all those combinations and document your findings.

Euclid · « **Reply #7 on:** July 02, 2019, 07:16 AM »

Interesting - I have Axminster's Centrotec-compatible equivalent of that bit-holder and a variety of bits (though not as many as Oliver). I'll take a look and see if they exhibit similar discrepancies.

pixelated · « **Reply #8 on:** July 02, 2019, 08:48 AM »

This isn't unique to Festool's holder. Every bit holder/bit combination I've ever used has some hit or miss combinations.

six-point socket II · « **Reply #9 on:** July 02, 2019, 09:23 AM »

Ok, let's continue with the "Game of bit holders" - "The song of match making"

My SO gave me serious eye rolls over this, she even got expressly close to me while talking to a friend on the phone to say: "Oh, Oliver, he's playing with his grown up tool "Legos" at the moment." Oh, the embarrassment ...

Seriously. I got a couple of more bits - and those from yesterday out. + various locking bit holders.

New bits second row, left to right: Snap-On ACR (USA), Wera Diamond (Czech), Bosch (prob. Wera Classic) (Czech), Facom (?), DeWalt.

Bit holder: Festool Centrotec handle, Wera BiTorsion 797/B, Wera 8784 B1, Wera (classic) Rapidaptor (not pictured).

All of these (todays) bit holders will lock ALL of the bits (including those from yesterday), except for that Snap-On ACR dud from yesterday.

Why? Because all of the above mentioned bit holders use a single point to lock the bit, whereas the Festool BHS 65 CE using a spring/wire tries to engage all of the dents.

Snap-On ACR (USA) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Wera Diamond (Czech) - Festool BHS 65 CE does not engage properly.

Bosch (prob. Wera Classic) (Czech) - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Facom (?) - Festool BHS 65 CE does not engage properly, but well enough to hold bit.

DeWalt - Festool BHS 65 CE engages properly.

Facom (?) and Wera Wera 8784 B1bit holder. Trouble engaging properly.

And with a little tug it's seated properly. (This works because of the one-point lock and a little wiggle room)

The Snap-On dud from yesterday.

And the other Snap-On ACR from today.

Classic Wera Rapidaptor with PB Swiss (Switzerland) C6 bit.

The "Legos" ...

Kind regards,
Oliver

TinyShop · « **Reply #10 on:** July 02, 2019, 11:04 AM »

Thanks @six-point socket II! Seems to me that given the locking mechanism utilized by the BHS 65 is so "unique", shall we say, that Festool must have had a series of makes and models of bits in mind when it designed it (or licensed it, or whatever). Therefore, it should be a simple matter for Festool to supply us with the list of compatible bits. I paid over US$20 for a bit holder (that doesn't do what it says it's supposed to do) and what I'm not willing to do is spend an unknown additional amount (time and money) shooting in the dark trying to determine which brand (and models and model-years therein) of bit inserts are compatible. I don't have the time or patience to fuss with the absurd position I have been put in. So, @Festool USA, what say you?

As an aside, at the bare minimum, descriptions the BHS 65 should include a warning/disclaimer about this compatability problem. Had I known in advance that I would encounter this issue I would have steered clear of this tool. I'll say it - I feel duped.

TinyShop · « **Reply #11 on:** July 05, 2019, 11:41 AM »

@Shane Holland - can you offer any guidance on this issue and/or can you look into it with Festool on my/our behalf? You folks sell this part so I'm guessing you would benefit even more so from an official list.

TinyShop · « **Reply #12 on:** July 16, 2019, 10:35 AM »

@Festool USA and @Shane Holland - are you going to leave me hanging?

Shane Holland · « **Reply #13 on:** July 16, 2019, 10:56 AM »

Quote from: TinyShop on July 16, 2019, 10:35 AM

@Festool USA and @Shane Holland - are you going to leave me hanging?

@TinyShop

Apologies, I was out of the office most of last week. I think the topic of compatibility is best for Festool USA to address. I have personally not had issues with any of the wire detent bits that I have used. But it looks like some good info has already been shared in the thread.

Did you purchase the bit holder and/or bits from us? If so, let's take this offline and send me your info. We definitely want to take care of our customers. We can determine if it's a flaw with your bit holder or a compatibility issue.

Shane
shane@toolnut.com

TinyShop · « **Reply #14 on:** July 16, 2019, 12:41 PM »

@Shane Holland - thanks for your reply. Sadly, no and no is the answer to your two questions. I'll have to wait for @Festool USA to respond. FWIW none of the wire detent bits I own (a random collection acquired over the years) are able to be locked by the bit holder. Bad luck on my part. That said, I really want to replace everything with BHS65-compatible bits so that I can benefit from why it was I purchased the bit holder in the first place - locking bits!

That said, if you can direct me to a make (and models) of bits that are compatible, I'm all ears.

neeleman · « **Reply #15 on:** July 16, 2019, 02:37 PM »

In Europe there's a new bitholder coming out 09/2019: BHS 60 CE (205097-€39).
Maybe that solves the problems with the BHS 65 CE?
And also some new 50 mm Centrotec bitsets (205087/205089-€46/96) from which the bits are also sold separately.
But every time I'm amazed by the prices FT asks for these relatively simple bits and bitholders.

six-point socket II · « **Reply #16 on:** July 16, 2019, 02:43 PM »

So the word is out now.

Yes, that will pretty much solve the issue overall, as it uses the afore mentioned one-point locking mechanism - as it's pretty much a Centrotec rapidaptor.

Seems Festool is leaning towards Wera for their Bits 'n stuff now.

Sadly that still doesn't immediately help anyone who's in the same boat as @TinyShop - but the BHS 60 CE will be absolutely worth getting!

Thanks for sharing @neeleman !

Kind regards,
Oliver

Dick Mahany · « **Reply #17 on:** July 16, 2019, 03:09 PM »

Quote from: neeleman on July 16, 2019, 02:37 PM

In Europe there's a new bitholder coming out 09/2019: BHS 60 CE (205097-€39).
Maybe that solves the problems with the BHS 65 CE?
And also some new 50 mm Centrotec bitsets (205087/205089-€46/96) from which the bits are also sold separately.
But every time I'm amazed by the prices FT asks for these relatively simple bits and bitholders.

I hope that is a Wera Rapidaptor in Festool centrotec clothing since rapidaptor has become my preferred bit holder. I've been debating whether to "centrotec" a 100mm rapidaptor shank in the meantime. I only hope it finds its way to the US.

Alex · « **Reply #18 on:** July 16, 2019, 03:15 PM »

Quote from: six-point socket II on July 16, 2019, 02:43 PM

Centrotec rapidaptor.

Now that's a cool fusion!

Shane Holland · « **Reply #19 on:** July 17, 2019, 11:49 AM »

@TinyShop,

That new Centrotec bit holder is now available for pre-order and will ship October 1st.

https://www.festoolproducts.com/festool-205097-centrotec-bit-holder-bhs-60mm.html

I specifically asked Festool about what has changed and they did not provide any information.

Shane

TinyShop · « **Reply #20 on:** July 17, 2019, 01:20 PM »

@Shane Holland - yeah, a little birdy told me about the forthcoming bit holder update before it was officially announced. Thanks for trying re: seeking clarification on what's different between the existing and soon-to-be holders. I'm still waiting for guidance on what bits are compatible with the existing holder so I'm not holding my breath.

FWIW I reached out via email to both Festool USA and Festool Germany and will report back with the results of that effort.

threesixright · « **Reply #21 on:** July 18, 2019, 03:05 AM »

Quote from: Shane Holland on July 17, 2019, 11:49 AM

@TinyShop,
https://www.festoolproducts.com/festool-205097-centrotec-bit-holder-bhs-60mm.html

That look suspiciously much after the WERA "8784 A1 Zyklop Adapter", just with a CE shank

? Rebatched?

Photo "8784 A1 Zyklop Adapter" with a centrotec ¼" CE shank.

six-point socket II · « **Reply #22 on:** July 18, 2019, 05:46 AM »

That's a neat idea for sure!

Kind regards,
Oliver

six-point socket II · « **Reply #23 on:** September 04, 2019, 07:41 AM »

The eagle has landed, I repeat, the eagle has landed.

Hi!

Thanks to Festool (Germany) for valuing and appreciating customer feedback from all fields of expertise! Thank you very much for the "care package"!

It's safe to say, the new Festool BHS 60 CE locking, quick-change bit-holder locks any and everything - and parts bit and magnet reliably, every time.

I'm going to call it lovingly, "Centrotec Rapidaptor" from here on now!

(Festool)

(Snap-On ACR)

(Facom)

(Wera Diamond)

(PB Swiss)

(Athlet)

(GRK)

(Spax (Wera))

(PB Swiss E6)

(Würth E6)

(PB Swiss E6)

(Wiha Y)

(DeWalt Extreme Impact Torsion)

(Wera Classic)

Kind regards,
Oliver

SRSemenza · « **Reply #24 on:** September 20, 2019, 01:06 AM »

Oliver,

Does the Centrotec Rapidapter stay in the unlocked / forward position? Or do you have to hold it forward to insert / remove bits?

Seth

Gregor · « **Reply #25 on:** September 20, 2019, 07:28 AM »

32€ (+ VAT) list price.

*cough*

Dick Mahany · « **Reply #26 on:** September 20, 2019, 08:43 AM »

The Wera Rapidaptor is my absolute favorite bit holder and I especially like how the chuck stays pulled forward until a new bit is inserted and the chuck snaps back to lock it. I'm hoping the new Centrotec version operates the same way.

SRSemenza · « **Reply #27 on:** September 20, 2019, 10:06 AM »

Quote from: Dick Mahany on September 20, 2019, 08:43 AM

The Wera Rapidaptor is my absolute favorite bit holder and I especially like how the chuck stays pulled forward until a new bit is inserted and the chuck snaps back to lock it. I'm hoping the new Centrotec version operates the same way.

I am asking about that feature because it does stay forward on the screwdriver handles and the drill adapters but I don't think that is true for the socket / ratchet adapters. So it could be either way.

Seth

Dick Mahany · « **Reply #28 on:** October 15, 2019, 05:39 PM »

I have noticed a subtle but definite operational difference between the Wera Rapidaptor and the new Festool BHS-60-CE.

When inserting a bit into the Wera Rapidaptor with the locking collar pulled forward, it takes a very small push of the bit to snap the lock collar back. On the Festool, when inserting the bit, the magnet pulls the bit back all the way without the push and the lock collar snaps into position. Also the force to open or close the lock collar is slightly higher on the Wera Rapidaptor than on the Festool. This is the case with three Rapidaptors in my collection. Otherwise they seem like the same animal with different shanks and finishes.

I'm sure the new Festool branded unit will be a much improved bit holder compared to previous Centrotec offerings.

With the locking collars pulled forward, there is also a difference between the Centrotec shank and the typical hex shank where the circlip is not needed on the Festool.

six-point socket II · « **Reply #29 on:** November 05, 2019, 03:30 AM »

Quote from: SRSemenza on September 20, 2019, 01:06 AM

Oliver,

Does the Centrotec Rapidapter stay in the unlocked / forward position? Or do you have to hold it forward to insert / remove bits?

Seth

Hi Seth,

I'm sorry, I have only seen your question now.

Pretty sure it does. I will check later and get back to you!

Kind regards,
Oliver

six-point socket II · « **Reply #30 on:** November 05, 2019, 06:25 AM »

Quote from: six-point socket II on November 05, 2019, 03:30 AM

Quote from: SRSemenza on September 20, 2019, 01:06 AM
Oliver,

Does the Centrotec Rapidapter stay in the unlocked / forward position? Or do you have to hold it forward to insert / remove bits?

Seth

Hi Seth,

I'm sorry, I have only seen your question now.

Pretty sure it does. I will check later and get back to you!

Kind regards,
Oliver

As expected, it does.

(Sorry, just noticed it was already clear with @Dick Mahany 's post , I'm a little sidelined right now.)

Kind regards,
Oliver

Oksana · « **Reply #31 on:** March 01, 2020, 06:00 PM »

Hello fellow tool lovers. This is my first post after purchasing Festool tools and joining FOG. I read through this thread before either of those events. I'm using the the TSX cordless drill and the BHS-60-CE. I was using a Milwaukee that requires two hands on the chuck to remove a bit. I don't have a third hand to hold the drill, so that was a bummer and not very ergonomic. I was wasting a lot of time and motion changing bits, which like most of you, I do frequently.

Has anyone noticed the 25mm bits will lock in the BHS adapter but the 50mm bits don't? The bottoms of both bits appear to be the same, so why won't the longer bit lock in? They both came in the Mini Centrotec kit. The 50mm is easier to handle, especially with gloves, so I prefer them, but they fall out easily.

As an aside, it's funny that spellcheck on this forum doesn't recognize "Festool"!

SRSemenza · « **Reply #32 on:** March 01, 2020, 10:36 PM »

Quote from: Oksana on March 01, 2020, 06:00 PM

Hello fellow tool lovers. This is my first post after purchasing Festool tools and joining FOG. I read through this thread before either of those events. I'm using the the TSX cordless drill and the BHS-60-CE. I was using a Milwaukee that requires two hands on the chuck to remove a bit. I don't have a third hand to hold the drill, so that was a bummer and not very ergonomic. I was wasting a lot of time and motion changing bits, which like most of you, I do frequently.

Has anyone noticed the 25mm bits will lock in the BHS adapter but the 50mm bits don't? The bottoms of both bits appear to be the same, so why won't the longer bit lock in? They both came in the Mini Centrotec kit. The 50mm is easier to handle, especially with gloves, so I prefer them, but they fall out easily.

As an aside, it's funny that spellcheck on this forum doesn't recognize "Festool"!

Hi,

Welcome to the forum!

I am guessing that the 50mm bits are the ones that are already Centrotec. They will go directly into the Centrotec chuck on the drill. The BHS 60 CE is essentially a quick change adapter to allow non-Centrotec bits of both wire and ball detent to be used. Cebtrotec bits will not lock into the adapter, just regular bits.

So try the 50mm directly in the Centrotec chuck. And use what ever 50mm ball detent bits that you like in the BHS 60 CE.

Seth

jarbroen · « **Reply #33 on:** March 17, 2020, 03:59 PM »

I finally bought myself one of the BHS-60 'green' bit holders. $30 well spent.
Literally my only complain with my Festool drills was the lack of good bit holders. Either ones without any retention or retention that requires 2 hands.
Now I have one hand each switch of bits just like my other WERA adapters.
Centrotec is neat if you have bigger/specific bits, but it's nice they are finally accommodating all the other bits we have laying around.
Plus, I like the bright green - especially on St Patrick's day!

jarbroen · « **Reply #34 on:** March 19, 2020, 02:18 PM »

I liked the new bit holder so much that I bought another one that was bundled with a bit set.
Even better, the bit set is one that fits in the attic tray on my T18 systainer.
Had to order from the UK - looks like 'NAINA' (as the kit).

It's the little things that are keeping me sane...

Codestar · « **Reply #35 on:** June 10, 2020, 11:08 AM »

Hi,

First post, just received the Festool Ratchet set and it had a new type handle with a fixed BHS-60 bit holder. Very nice in the hand!

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Attachment doesn't appear to be showing correctly. Sorry. If anyone can advise how to show correctly.

Cheers

Phil

koenbro · « **Reply #36 on:** June 15, 2020, 01:22 AM »

Looks like a Wera. I have several, both ratcheting and fixed — this handle style is my favorite.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

DzordanoBruno · « **Reply #37 on:** June 30, 2020, 08:45 AM »

Hello,
The new holder BHS 60 CE. Good for new TID or is better option out there? I have Wera Impaktor and its good, but i dont like magnet to hold bit. I need mechanical holding power.
Sorry for my english.
Take care. bye

EDIT: BH CE 60 is Centrotec - not for TID18. For TID 18 is BT-IMP SORT3

Markiee77 · « **Reply #38 on:** September 20, 2020, 05:18 PM »

Can anyone tell me the difference between the Centrotec bit holder BH60CE and BHS 60 CE?

Thanks in advance!

Mark

SRSemenza · « **Reply #39 on:** September 21, 2020, 12:00 AM »

Quote from: Markiee77 on September 20, 2020, 05:18 PM

Can anyone tell me the difference between the Centrotec bit holder BH60CE and BHS 60 CE?

Thanks in advance!

Mark

One is a Festool branded Wera Rapidapter that fits into a Centrotec chuck ...............

https://www.festoolusa.com/accessory/205097---bhs-60-ce

The other is a more standard impact bit holder that fits into a Centrotec chuck............

https://www.festoolusa.com/accessory/498974---bh-60-ce-imp#Overview

The most important take away though is that the 'S' model is a very nice quick change bit holder the other(s) are more standard style , but all fit into a Centrotec chuck.

Seth

shdesign3 · « **Reply #40 on:** September 22, 2020, 10:37 PM »

Is there a difference between these as for the magnets?

SRSemenza · « **Reply #41 on:** September 22, 2020, 11:31 PM »

Quote from: shdesign3 on September 22, 2020, 10:37 PM

Is there a difference between these as for the magnets?

Did you mean except for the magnets?

Yes, there is a difference. Take note of the shaft design.

The top one is Centrotec with the longer straight rear portion of the shaft.

The second one is a regular 1/4" hex bit holder. It will not fit into a Centrotec chuck.

I believe the bottom one is the impact version designed for impact drivers. It will not fit into a Centrotec chuck.

Seth

SRSemenza · « **Reply #42 on:** September 22, 2020, 11:42 PM »

@Markiee77 , @shdesign3

Maybe I or others can help a little more if we know what bit, driver, holder connections you want to make.

Seth

shdesign3 · « **Reply #43 on:** September 23, 2020, 01:37 AM »

Im using the bit holder that came with my CXS drill with festool pozidrive bit. The bit holder cant even hold the pozidrive bit. It is worse than my bosch bit holder magnet. I don't want to use Centrotec Quick Release

SRSemenza · « **Reply #44 on:** September 23, 2020, 09:48 AM »

Quote from: shdesign3 on September 23, 2020, 01:37 AM

Im using the bit holder that came with my CXS drill with festool pozidrive bit. The bit holder cant even hold the pozidrive bit. It is worse than my bosch bit holder magnet. I don't want to use Centrotec Quick Release

Currently it looks like it comes with a BH 60 CE.

Maybe it's just a bad magnet? Not sure.

I haven't had a problem with that type not holding bits. I have , like others , had the magnet come out of the holder. I just super glued it back in.

Seth

Sparktrician · « **Reply #45 on:** September 23, 2020, 10:33 AM »

The Festool magnetic bit holder from the CXS measures 9.58mm at the thickest point. The Festool magnetic bit holder from the Ti 15 measures 11.08mm at the thickest point. Both are Centrotec and can be inserted on either tool, but only the thicker one is impact-rated.

Cypren · « **Reply #46 on:** December 24, 2020, 04:37 AM »

Thought I would note for anyone who hasn't picked up a BHS 60 CE yet that Festool has a limited edition set out right now in an adorable Christmas ornament-sized blue systainer. I'm not sure when these became available or how widely distributed they are; my regular dealer had a few when I was in last week and asked if I wanted one because he knows how much of a collector fanboy I am.

The catalog number is 205487, but I don't see it listed on Festool's website anywhere.

six-point socket II · « **Reply #47 on:** January 08, 2021, 10:29 PM »

Albeit not in blue, but these are/ will be regular items. The last one is impact rated.

Kind regards,
Oliver