Author Topic: CMS with OF2200 How to?  (Read 8580 times)

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Offline vkumar

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CMS with OF2200 How to?
« on: May 19, 2014, 12:22 PM »
With all the posts form Sitting Elf about purchases in Germany I though t I would ask this question of him or anyone else that knows.

I know that the CMS is not available for the 2200 in the US but available in Europe and elsewhere.

If someone knows how to update  CMS router set available in the US to the OF 2200  I would appreciate it. I have a brother in Scotland that can buy this for me.  The idea would be to bring over the least amount of bulk/weight.

Example would be buy the CMS GE router table here and then add components to upgrade to the OF2200.  Appreciate specific part number sand dealers to buy from.

TIA
Vijay
Vijay Kumar

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Offline RL

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2014, 01:01 PM »
You just need the 2 (I think) insert rings. Nothing else.

Offline copcarcollector

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2014, 01:30 PM »
I purchased my CMS GE here in the USA about 6 months ago. It included the 2 rings needed to mount the 2200 router, though Festool USA says doing so will void your warranty (FYI!)

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2014, 01:44 PM »
I did a video, in two parts, about setting up the CMS-OF with the OF2200. I seem to remember that I point out, clearly I hope, the very small difference in setup between the three Festool routers.

This may help you.

Part 1:



Part 2:



In the US you will be on your own if you injure yourself or anyone near you but over here, in Europe, we are perfectly safe.

The OF2200 is a beautiful router and lovely to use hand-held but, to my mind, it is the perfect machine to fit in the CMS. I will be featuring it more and more in future videos.

Peter


Offline NYC Tiny Shop

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2014, 02:26 PM »
Peter,
 That's a wonderfully done demonstration with a patient attention to detail.  It also makes me wish that Festool could give the okay to use the OF2200 in the CMS.

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2014, 02:50 PM »
Peter,
 That's a wonderfully done demonstration with a patient attention to detail.  It also makes me wish that Festool could give the okay to use the OF2200 in the CMS.

Many thanks.

I have not followed the problems for this in the US but my understanding is that Festool would love everyone to be using the OF2200 in the CMS. I assume that someone has to give some sort of approval.

There is a certain irony to all of this - there are a lot of common practices (particularly with table saws) that would never be allowed in Europe yet we can use the CMS-OF with the 2200 with ticks in all of the boxes from the Health and Safety people.

At least people can make their own choice if the various bits of kit are included with the CMS-OF (or easy to get hold of).

Peter

Offline vkumar

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2014, 03:17 PM »
Thank you Peter.  For some reason (probably work computer related) I cannot see the video.  Ill have to try it from my personal computer.

Well now I got to see the videos.  Simply brilliant Peter, and makes the process quite clear.

 Vijay
« Last Edit: May 19, 2014, 11:47 PM by vkumar »
Vijay Kumar

Offline Sparktrician

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2014, 04:10 PM »
Here's a link to the how-to regarding the setup of the CMS and the OF 2200.  As others have mentioned, the CMS comes with everything needed to mount the OF 2200, but as has also been mentioned, use of the OF 2200 in the CMS in North America can void your warranty.  The problem is the lack of UL approval due to the CMS' switch.  It is rated to only 13.5 amps, and the OF 2200 can draw up to 20 amps, hence a potential fire hazard.  It would not surprise me if Festool engineers were working on a UL-approvable switch, but it's fiction until it hits the NA market. 

- Willy -

 "Remember, a chip on the shoulder is a sure sign of wood higher up." - Brigham Young

Offline NYC Tiny Shop

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2014, 04:24 PM »
Here's a link to the how-to regarding the setup of the CMS and the OF 2200.  As others have mentioned, the CMS comes with everything needed to mount the OF 2200, but as has also been mentioned, use of the OF 2200 in the CMS in North America can void your warranty.  The problem is the lack of UL approval due to the CMS' switch.  It is rated to only 13.5 amps, and the OF 2200 can draw up to 20 amps, hence a potential fire hazard.  It would not surprise me if Festool engineers were working on a UL-approvable switch, but it's fiction until it hits the NA market. 



As soon as they do the OF1400 is coming out and the OF2200 is going in!

Offline vkumar

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #9 on: May 19, 2014, 05:54 PM »
Here's a link to the how-to regarding the setup of the CMS and the OF 2200.  As others have mentioned, the CMS comes with everything needed to mount the OF 2200, but as has also been mentioned, use of the OF 2200 in the CMS in North America can void your warranty.  The problem is the lack of UL approval due to the CMS' switch.  It is rated to only 13.5 amps, and the OF 2200 can draw up to 20 amps, hence a potential fire hazard.  It would not surprise me if Festool engineers were working on a UL-approvable switch, but it's fiction until it hits the NA market. 


Thank you for that link Sparktrician

Vijay
Vijay Kumar

Offline vkumar

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2014, 05:56 PM »
Also does the 110 volt switch used in the UK version rated at 20 amps?
Vijay Kumar

Offline Sparktrician

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #11 on: May 19, 2014, 08:22 PM »
Also does the 110 volt switch used in the UK version rated at 20 amps?

I can't answer that, but maybe some of the UK members might have some insight. 

- Willy -

 "Remember, a chip on the shoulder is a sure sign of wood higher up." - Brigham Young

Offline Samo

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It's The FOG!  Just rotate the screen.

Offline vkumar

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #13 on: May 20, 2014, 12:24 AM »
Thanks for that link Sam

Vijay
Vijay Kumar

Offline Sparktrician

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2014, 07:37 AM »
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002C4L3PS/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pd_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=1W7R8D4KHHAFN&coliid=IHIOZABB1MQ9E


Recommend that you contact the manufacturer to be absolutely certain that the attached cables are 12 gauge or larger.  The switch may be rated to 20 amps, but unless the cabling is 12 gauge or larger, the assembly should not be used in a 20-amp demand situation. 

- Willy -

 "Remember, a chip on the shoulder is a sure sign of wood higher up." - Brigham Young

Offline RKA

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #15 on: May 20, 2014, 10:11 AM »
Cables attached to the switch are 14 ga.
-Raj

Offline woodie

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #16 on: May 20, 2014, 10:49 AM »
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002C4L3PS/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pd_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=1W7R8D4KHHAFN&coliid=IHIOZABB1MQ9E


Recommend that you contact the manufacturer to be absolutely certain that the attached cables are 12 gauge or larger.  The switch may be rated to 20 amps, but unless the cabling is 12 gauge or larger, the assembly should not be used in a 20-amp demand situation. 



I don't think a short run of 14 gauge off a 20 Amp stop switch is an issue.  Isn't the attached cable on the OF2200 14 gauge? 
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Offline jimbo51

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #17 on: May 20, 2014, 02:16 PM »
I doubt that the lower amperage switch is the primary reason the OF2200 does not have UL listing for use in the CMS. I would bet that Festool put that switch in on purpose to show good faith to UL that they were not going to let people use the OF2200 in the CMS too easily. Someone previously mentioned that the issue may be more related to UL reluctance to have such a powerful machine in a dismountable format. 

Offline iamnothim

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #18 on: May 20, 2014, 04:25 PM »
You could fabricate your own 20A rated switch using this  Schurter 20A Power Entry Module from Mouser

This one has a circuit breaker.  Mouser has less expensive units. 
You will need an enclosure and an A/C pigtail.
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Offline Papajoe

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #19 on: December 07, 2019, 07:20 PM »
I have been using the of2200 on vms table. Hogging barn timbers, big dados 2.5” deep, never a problem. Attached a ct48 also?

Offline harry_

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #20 on: December 08, 2019, 05:00 PM »
Someone previously mentioned that the issue may be more related to UL reluctance to have such a powerful machine in a dismountable format.

That simply can't be it as the OF2200 router is UL listed as a stand-alone unit.
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Offline Sparktrician

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2019, 05:58 PM »
I doubt that the lower amperage switch is the primary reason the OF2200 does not have UL listing for use in the CMS. I would bet that Festool put that switch in on purpose to show good faith to UL that they were not going to let people use the OF2200 in the CMS too easily. Someone previously mentioned that the issue may be more related to UL reluctance to have such a powerful machine in a dismountable format.

It all comes down to the rating of the switch (13.6 amps) and the Power Law P=EI where P represents power in watts, I represents current in amps, and E represents intensity in volts (expressed differently, I=P/E).  In most of Europe, the available power is 220 vac.  The OF 2200 is rated at 2200 watts.  Plug this into the formula - I=2200/220 and you get 10.0 amps, well within the limitations of the switch.  Move west to NA and re-run the numbers.  I=P/E, or I=2200/110 and you get 20 amps, well above the limitation of the switch.  That switch (which really is a contactor) is fine in Europe, but not in NA.  The issue does relate to UL not approving the use of this power-hungry a router on a switch that can't handle the power draw.  The router is just fine on a normal 20 amp circuit on 12 gauge copper wiring.
- Willy -

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Offline Bohdan

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2019, 06:25 PM »
And that switch is the reason that the CMS is now discontinued.

It is too easy to bypass the switch and plug the router into somewhere else

This then breaches the new EU rules and so Festool can no longer offer the CMS.

Online Cheese

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #23 on: December 09, 2019, 10:17 AM »
My question is what is done differently in UK when they pair a 110V OF 2200 router with a CMS?

The P=EI formula is still in effect.

https://www.festool.co.uk/products/routing/routers/574353---of-2200-eb-plus-gb-110v#Overview
« Last Edit: December 09, 2019, 10:54 AM by Cheese »

Offline jobsworth

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #24 on: December 09, 2019, 11:21 AM »
@Cheese

Nothing really, they have 110v tools there so they would have a CMS set up for 110V which if memory serves me right only the switch on the CMS would be different.

I bought a second CMS while in the UK just for my 2200 that I bought in the US.

nothing was needed just plug an play other then changing the plugs from UK to US. I guess I could of just got a adapter or bought a US plug cut the cable and put the US one on,  but I decided to change out the switch

Online Cheese

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #25 on: December 10, 2019, 09:13 PM »
I was thinking about the @Sparktrician and @jobsworth responses on this thread and decided to do a little investigation.

The crux of the issue has always been the OF 2200 amperage draw on 110/120 volts versus 230/240 volts.

My thought was if you purchase a 110 volt OF 2200 in the UK and install it in a MFS, why does that work in the UK but not work in the US? Obvious answer...Festool must offer a different magnetic contactor for the UK 110 volt version of the MFS.

Well that seems logical. So if you visit EKAT item #13 it is called a Switch Element Assembly and it's comprised of 6 basic items. A cord with a female connection, a cord with a male connection and 4 other pieces.

The 4 other pieces are:
Item 29...Pusher...496878
Item 30...Switching Housing...447703
Item 32...Contactor...455695
Item 37...Switch Cover...447704

Well, pulling up the EKAT parts lists for US 110 volt, GB 110 volt, EU 230 volt and GB 240 volt machines...all 4 of those parts are the same part number.

So, if there are no differences other than the cord ends...so much for the NAINA of the OF 2200 in a MFS experience being "over the top."

As Sparky notes, the P=EI formula still remains a given because it's like gravity...it's not going away anytime soon.




Offline jobsworth

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #26 on: December 10, 2019, 11:01 PM »
I can tell you Ive never had a problem with mine in the UK I useds a 110v tranny here in the states were 110v no problems

Offline Rick Christopherson

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2019, 07:08 AM »
This has already been covered years ago, and the people misleading you in this thread already know that.  [sad] The problem is nothing more than the sticker on the inside of the switch. It's a 4-pole switch that is rated at 13 amps per pole, but the way it is configured in the table with all 4 poles in parallel, it will handle far more amperage.

The switch is one of the best I've encountered. It is a magnetic-connect with a mechanical-break. And because of that, you cannot fuse the contacts. The participants in this thread have been explicitly told this in the past, but do not want to listen. c'est la vie

Online Cheese

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2019, 09:52 AM »
The problem is nothing more than the sticker on the inside of the switch. It's a 4-pole switch that is rated at 13 amps per pole, but the way it is configured in the table with all 4 poles in parallel, it will handle far more amperage.

The switch is one of the best I've encountered. It is a magnetic-connect with a mechanical-break. And because of that, you cannot fuse the contacts.
c'est la vie

@Rick Christopherson

Thanks for that Rick.   [not worthy]    That makes even more sense once you explain that the poles are configured in parallel. That was the missing element that I couldn't figure out. It just didn't make sense that Festool would just go ahead and use an under rated product on the CMS in the UK and just say "good enough".

Looks like I need to start looking for an OF 2200 on the Festool recon site.  [big grin]

Offline jobsworth

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Re: CMS with OF2200 How to?
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2019, 10:40 AM »
@Rick Christopherson

Rick its a old thread that goes back to 2014