Author Topic: STM 1800 Quality (Changed Subject to Shipping Damage Issues?)  (Read 12016 times)

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Offline Martin Johnson

  • Posts: 134
STM 1800 Quality (Changed Subject to Shipping Damage Issues?)
« on: September 19, 2020, 07:01 AM »
First, let me say that I think Festool makes some of the best tools in the world.  I have quite a few, and have rarely regretted spending the money to get quality.  Having said that, my STM 1800 just arrived from Beaver Tools yesterday.  I was very excited to set it up, but there were a number of disappointing quality control issues or shipping issues that have tempered my excitement:

- One of the Wheels was damaged
- Couldn't pull out one of the extension bars
- Pin was bent preventing the extension bar movement (camera flash makes it look like a light saber, but that is the pin, which should be straight in alignment with the rest of the part.)
- Nut missing from bar that holds the stop

I will send an email to Festool later this morning, as I am sure they will make it right, but thought I would share in case anyone else was experiencing issues.  I will post a follow-up once Festool responds.   


Festool Response Below (Excellent Customer Service As Expected)...

Per my experience and expectations, Festool had a 1st class response. 

Hello Martin,

 I apologized for the following parts showing up damaged.  The replacement parts have been sent out to you free of charge, , have a wonderful day!

Thank you,

Chris Stoller
« Last Edit: October 06, 2020, 12:11 PM by Martin Johnson »

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Offline ProCarpenterRVA

  • Posts: 140
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2020, 07:33 AM »
That's a shame that you had some shipping damage / qc problem.

I got mine together and it is completely perfect. Just based on the fact that the height is adjustable I'm going to buy another.

A quick tip, if you don't have a 10mm Allen wrench, a t50 automotive socket from Lowes is a good replacement for the small job at hand.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


Offline Martin Johnson

  • Posts: 134
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2020, 07:43 AM »
Thanks for the reply...Unfortunately, I have way too many tools according to my wife, and several 10mm [laughing]  I think it will be awesome once those parts are replaced...I tried to submit to service this morning online, but after filling out all of the information including the part #s, it would not let me hit the send button.  I left a voice message though, and will followup on Monday.  If you were wondering...these are the part #s:

New SMT 1800 arrived yesterday from Beaver Tools and has damaged and missing parts.  PN205641 Wheel tread damaged, PN10293269 extension pin assembly bent, and inoperable, PN228541 nut missing from one of the panel extension caps, which prevents it from staying on.  I have pictures if you need them. 

Offline jcrowe1950

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    • Woodcraft Chattanooga, TN
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2020, 08:17 AM »
First, let me say that I think Festool makes some of the best tools in the world.  I have quite a few, and have rarely regretted spending the money to get quality.  Having said that, my STM 1800 just arrived from Beaver Tools yesterday.  I was very excited to set it up, but there were a number of disappointing quality control issues or shipping issues that have tempered my excitement:

- One of the Wheels was damaged
- Couldn't pull out one of the extension bars
- Pin was bent preventing the extension bar movement (camera flash makes it look like a light saber, but that is the pin, which should be straight in alignment with the rest of the part.)
- Nut missing from bar that holds the stop

I will send an email to Festool later this morning, as I am sure they will make it right, but thought I would share in case anyone else was experiencing issues.  I will post a follow-up once Festool responds.

Martin,

    I am very sorry to hear this. We received our allotment of STM 1800s Thursday but I have not had a chance to look at them as they have not been officially received. You might also wish to contact the seller. I do have one question.....in any place on the device is there a listing for location of manufacture?
Festool Specialist at Woodcraft, Chattanooga, TN

Latest Festool purchase...TID18 T18 set....love them

Offline Martin Johnson

  • Posts: 134
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2020, 08:33 AM »
I'll check after coffee, and picking up some sheet goods at the depot this morning...I suspect the wheel and pin may have been damaged by the UPS truck (Unprofessional Parcel Service) [eek], but the missing nut is a headscratcher.  I know the Festool guys, and they will make it right...really good service and commitment to their products.  I know people sometimes complain about the cost, but at the end of the day...they stand behind their products...I've got a 10 year old T-15 drill, and still have not needed to replace the batteries...and I use it every week.

Offline Martin Johnson

  • Posts: 134
A couple of Updates Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2020, 09:27 AM »
Country of Origin - Looks like Germany

Mystery of the Nut Solved:  When removing the endcaps...you need to remove the 4 small pz screws on top and bottom...this holds the plastic piece in place...if you try to unscrew the end...the nut falls off behind the plastic, so it looks like it is missing.  I took out the plastic piece, reinserted the nut, and screwed the end cap back on...then slid it into the rail and tighten the plastic piece with the two screws top and bottom.

Added a better (non-light saber version of the bent pin)





Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 6610
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2020, 11:44 AM »
Neither me or my dealer really trust UPS and fortunately I have a very good relationship with them. So when my table comes in one of the guys that work there has a daughter who lives near me.
 So he will bring  it and my FT impact with him when it comes in.

Great customer service (thats how Tom Bellmare was.Some times I called Tom and he answered the phone told me he was making a 2 hour drive to make a delivery to a customer)

But its ashame you and the dealer pay a lot of money for something , and the shipper screws up royally and the dealer takes the heat for it.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 1276
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2020, 11:50 AM »
Mine showed up, looks to be in good shape.  UPS guy commented on the weight of it, he wasn't thrilled.

I was more curious on the serrated washers for the wheels, even the instructions don't make any mention of them.  I got those on, wheeled it around some, unfolded the base unit once, popped open very nicely (once I figured out how, will read the instructions...)


Offline JimH2

  • Posts: 1023
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2020, 12:03 PM »
I will send an email to Festool later this morning, as I am sure they will make it right, but thought I would share in case anyone else was experiencing issues.  I will post a follow-up once Festool responds.

There is no need to post something like this until you have spoken with Festool to see if they will resolve it to your liking. The idea of posting to see if others had issues is a cover to justify a tattletale post, which will be read as an issue by anyone glancing at the thread. I am guessing you do not own a business because if you did you would not want a customer to broadcast an issue before giving you a chance to make it right even if it is right and they have just changed their mind on what they wanted.

 I have no problem with someone doing that if I do not address the issue to their liking. I have never had anyone have issue with my or the work of any sub I use, but some of that is avoidance of certain types of people who can be read fairly quickly.

Offline Martin Johnson

  • Posts: 134
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2020, 12:54 PM »
I will send an email to Festool later this morning, as I am sure they will make it right, but thought I would share in case anyone else was experiencing issues.  I will post a follow-up once Festool responds.

There is no need to post something like this until you have spoken with Festool to see if they will resolve it to your liking. The idea of posting to see if others had issues is a cover to justify a tattletale post, which will be read as an issue by anyone glancing at the thread. I am guessing you do not own a business because if you did you would not want a customer to broadcast an issue before giving you a chance to make it right even if it is right and they have just changed their mind on what they wanted.

 I have no problem with someone doing that if I do not address the issue to their liking. I have never had anyone have issue with my or the work of any sub I use, but some of that is avoidance of certain types of people who can be read fairly quickly.

Really?  Please reread the entire chain.  I don't recall dissing on Festool, or Beaver...my suspicion is that it is UPS...I shared, as others might experience similar issues given the weight of the stm and how UPS handles packages.  Festool Service is the fastest way to get it resolved, as they would have the spare parts needed to fix it...doesn't make sense to send it back...I also know that they are very good, and always take care of any issues...just a shame that it has to wait until Monday.  To be honest, I don't see how your post adds any value to the conversation, other than hearing yourself type.

As a part owner in 8 companies, I understand quality issues arise, and think I made it clear that I do not blame Festool or Beaver.  Also, tried to share anything I discovered as I triaged the problem.  If others experience shipping issues as well, it means that packaging needs to be beefed up or maybe they should go to their local dealer and examine it before taking home.  Not sure how this is tattletale (think sharing potential issues is always better than burying them). 

For those who are considering one, I have had a chance to use it (except for the damaged bar), and I can say that it has already paid for itself in unloading sheet goods straight from my truck to be wheeled into the shop.  Saved a trip to the chiropractor.


Offline Peter Halle

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Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2020, 02:21 PM »
Good to see you posting @martincjohnson .

I had the pleasure of spending time with Martin when he was an executive at Festool USA.  Classy guy.

Peter

Offline Martin Johnson

  • Posts: 134
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2020, 05:01 PM »
Thanks Peter...I remember you as well.  Good times  back then with Sedge, Rick, Michael, Ben, and Shane...Too bad we had the housing crash...those were tough times for sure, but Festool survived, and I see Rick and Sedge are still there, Shane is close by at ToolNut, Michael has a leather company, and Ben is with a cabinet manufacturer...I moved on to technology companies, 3D printing, and robotics...throw in working with a few private rocket companies, and it has been a wild ride...I'm involved in some really cool technologies these days, but still pull out the old Festools for therapy.  Not getting any younger, so the STM 1800 came along at the right time for me.

Offline FestitaMakool

  • Posts: 845
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2020, 08:14 PM »
Received my STM 1800 Thursday with UPS, not the US UPS off course.
I was a bit ancient whether it was delivered in an undamaged manner or not. I remotely signed for the delivery so I wasn’t able to check the condition before I arrived home later in the afternoon.
The box that stood nicely put down on the grass was in great shape, not even the smallest dent was visible. I assembled it tonight and judging how I noticed mine was packed and reviewing your issues it could be that the end of the box have had quite an impact, seeing the bent locking pin. However the wheel seems to be having passed lesser quality control. The way the wheels were packed I cannot see that this was caused by transport.
“The Stig” Yes, it is true, at least some part of it..
“If you have an old Land Rover and a fit wife, you’re most likely always busy”

Offline Martin Johnson

  • Posts: 134
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2020, 11:36 AM »
Per my experience and expectations, Festool had a 1st class response. 

Hello Martin,

 

I apologized for the following parts showing up damaged.  The replacement parts have been sent out to you free of charge, , have a wonderful day!

Thank you,

Chris Stoller



First, let me say that I think Festool makes some of the best tools in the world.  I have quite a few, and have rarely regretted spending the money to get quality.  Having said that, my STM 1800 just arrived from Beaver Tools yesterday.  I was very excited to set it up, but there were a number of disappointing quality control issues or shipping issues that have tempered my excitement:

- One of the Wheels was damaged
- Couldn't pull out one of the extension bars
- Pin was bent preventing the extension bar movement (camera flash makes it look like a light saber, but that is the pin, which should be straight in alignment with the rest of the part.)
- Nut missing from bar that holds the stop

I will send an email to Festool later this morning, as I am sure they will make it right, but thought I would share in case anyone else was experiencing issues.  I will post a follow-up once Festool responds.

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 6610
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2020, 11:38 AM »
Talked to Don at Anderson yesterday my table came in. We started talking about the condiion of the tools when they get to the dealer. He showed me some photos of a shipment they recently got. Man those boxes were pretty beat up and so were some of the tools.

 The dealers have to go through the shipments and find the tools etc that look like they survived the shipping to them. He showed me some 3000 guide rails that looked like banana boats the packaging was pretty messed up.

Just saying it isnt always festool or the dealer who jacks the tools up however the dealer and festool do make it right when tools etc are jacked up.

I wish some dealers would post some pictures of some of their deliveries ya'll would be surprised at the condition these tools are recieved by the dealers

Offline David

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    • A few pieces that I’ve built
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2020, 01:32 PM »
I will send an email to Festool later this morning, as I am sure they will make it right, but thought I would share in case anyone else was experiencing issues.  I will post a follow-up once Festool responds.

There is no need to post something like this until you have spoken with Festool to see if they will resolve it to your liking. The idea of posting to see if others had issues is a cover to justify a tattletale post, which will be read as an issue by anyone glancing at the thread. I am guessing you do not own a business because if you did you would not want a customer to broadcast an issue before giving you a chance to make it right even if it is right and they have just changed their mind on what they wanted.

 I have no problem with someone doing that if I do not address the issue to their liking. I have never had anyone have issue with my or the work of any sub I use, but some of that is avoidance of certain types of people who can be read fairly quickly.

I think that's nonsense. By posting this, he's alerted me to check specific things when mine comes this week. Or at least save some time in figuring things out. I thought the OPs tone was marvelously generous and not at all a problem.
Fifth book (less interesting than woodworking) at http://www.expertise.is

Offline mcooley

  • Posts: 264
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #16 on: September 26, 2020, 11:04 AM »
I'll add that my STM 1800 came in good shape. However to my knowledge it was not delivered via UPS.

As for setup one thing to consider is the T10 screws for attaching the larger blocks which are not repeated for the already installed smaller blocks. Those are a #1 Phlilips. Which is very small and very easy to strip out. Not sure why they didn't just use more robust size heads and keep to one type. I also don't know why they didn't just use the plastic cradles for the larger blocks.

One addition that would have been great might have been an easier way to either remove the casters or simply release a foot that came down alongside them to get the table elevated enough to keep the wheels off the ground and make it fixed etc.

Anyhow, the table is robust and feels very sturdy and could be used as an assembly table for furniture making etc. It even lines up perfectly with my Minimax s45n bandsaw so an out feed table as well.


Offline Peter Halle

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Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #17 on: September 26, 2020, 11:32 AM »
Mine arrived in perfect condition via UPS freight.  Driver was pleasant as heck and a cold bottle of water created a smile.  At 6:30 pm he still had to drive back to the distribution center - 30 miles away - and pick up stuff for two more deliveries.  And those deliveries were 30 miles away from the distribution center.

A shout out to all the delivery people who treat customer service and satisfaction as part of their job and are working under product shipping demands so different from the past.

Peter

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 2415
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #18 on: September 26, 2020, 11:39 AM »
Snip.
a cold bottle of water created a smile.

Peter

From time to time, garbage truck drivers, courier truck drivers (who may not be delivering anything to me) and even the flyer lady have benefited from the stock of bottles of water kept in my shop...provided I'm working with the garage door open.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2020, 11:44 AM by ChuckM »

Offline FestitaMakool

  • Posts: 845
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #19 on: September 26, 2020, 06:11 PM »
Peter, that gesture is what makes a day or not.  [smile]
I wish more people where able to appreciate the work that goes into what many take for granted - Demanding might be the word..
“The Stig” Yes, it is true, at least some part of it..
“If you have an old Land Rover and a fit wife, you’re most likely always busy”

Offline Coen

  • Posts: 799
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #20 on: September 26, 2020, 08:28 PM »
Mine arrived in perfect condition via UPS freight.  Driver was pleasant as heck and a cold bottle of water created a smile.  At 6:30 pm he still had to drive back to the distribution center - 30 miles away - and pick up stuff for two more deliveries.  And those deliveries were 30 miles away from the distribution center.

A shout out to all the delivery people who treat customer service and satisfaction as part of their job and are working under product shipping demands so different from the past.

Peter

One of guys from the biggest post service here doesn't even try to deliver anything during normal working hours. Shipping status tends to say "expected delivery time; 13:00-16:00 or something like that and he will usually show up around 19:30 when people are actually home. I can't blame him; some of the guys get paid per package delivered and if nobody is home... nothing gets delivered.

I just wonder what his boss says about his way of work. His % delivered must be sky-high, but he always delivers hours past the given window. When a coworker has his route he gets the sour fruits of that though; because nobody stays home for a package "because he will deliver late when I'm home" so they get an even lower % delivered.

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 2415
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #21 on: September 26, 2020, 09:01 PM »
I can't blame him; some of the guys get paid per package delivered and if nobody is home... nothing gets delivered.


That's an inhumane system.

Here, parcels -- regardless of value or size or from which merchant -- are dropped off at the door whether or not anyone is home. Period. UPS, FedEx, DHL or Canada Post does the same. Some ring the bell after leaving the packet and then leave; others (in a rush?) just drop and go. We call them contactless deliveries (for the protection of both parties).

In this Covid-19 world, nothing needs to be signed here, including deliveries that say "Signature Required." The only exception as I far as I know is the passport (may be the driver's licence too) that needs to be picked up in person at the Post Office.

« Last Edit: September 26, 2020, 09:15 PM by ChuckM »

Offline Coen

  • Posts: 799
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #22 on: September 27, 2020, 10:02 AM »
I can't blame him; some of the guys get paid per package delivered and if nobody is home... nothing gets delivered.


That's an inhumane system.

Here, parcels -- regardless of value or size or from which merchant -- are dropped off at the door whether or not anyone is home. Period. UPS, FedEx, DHL or Canada Post does the same. Some ring the bell after leaving the packet and then leave; others (in a rush?) just drop and go. We call them contactless deliveries (for the protection of both parties).

In this Covid-19 world, nothing needs to be signed here, including deliveries that say "Signature Required." The only exception as I far as I know is the passport (may be the driver's licence too) that needs to be picked up in person at the Post Office.

Oh it definitely is (was?)

It mostly was/is an excess to the whole 'self-employed' nonsense up to blatant violation of the law where some big business skips all the rules and taxes by subcontracting out to "self employed" people. There was a system that they try to deliver at day 1; if not at home; they try again the next day. If still not home; package is dropped at post office for pickup by recipient but the driver would be paid (next to) nothing. Almost everything here is with signature (not with covid now). Dropped at the door is very rare here. Delivery at the neighbors is common though. Now with covid they ring the doorbell and if they see you they immediately run back to their van and drive away.

Legislature and courts have finally awaken though a few years ago.

Plain mail is now more and more delivered by people "with some distance to the labour market" here. Some walk with a dog, some walk stoned, some while smoking. Some mail is delivered right, some is delivered at the sidewalk and some is delivered on the other side of the street...

Offline papester

  • Posts: 15
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #23 on: September 29, 2020, 09:42 AM »
I had the same issue with my STM 1800, PN10293269 extension pin was broken on arrival. My vendor and Festool are taking care of it.

Does anyone else find it strange that an almost $1000 dollar piece of hardware does not have a serial number?

Offline etds4u

  • Posts: 10
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #24 on: September 29, 2020, 10:48 AM »
My STM 1800 arrived last week with some minor shipping damage. I just received replacement parts today directly from Festool thanks to great support to make it right from USTOOLANDFASTENER.com and Festool.

Offline jobsworth

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  • Festool Baby.....
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #25 on: September 29, 2020, 10:51 AM »
@papester

only has a S/N if its a tool. I axed FT during FT lives demo of this if its a tool or accessory, Its a accessory so no S/N

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 1276
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #26 on: September 29, 2020, 03:49 PM »
right, I don't see how it would be a "tool".  Within a few minutes of assembling it, I had random stuff piling up on it.  I don't stack stuff on top of my tools.

Glad the closest thing to "damage" was a few brushed plastic end caps, but really, that's hard to avoid and would happen in a few hours of usage anyway.

Put a fair amount weight on it, rolls real nice.

Waiting for the "how do I connect 2 STM1800's together" and "STM1800 too wobbly" "smoked my STM1800"  threads.   [wink]
« Last Edit: November 01, 2020, 01:31 AM by DeformedTree »

Offline batmanrobin

  • Posts: 115
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #27 on: October 01, 2020, 09:46 PM »
Received mine today and everything seems to be in good shape except one plastic plug was damaged. I just tapped it back in. 
 I agree on the tiny screws.
I’m going to set it up tomorrow and test it out.

Offline JD2720

  • Posts: 1187
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #28 on: October 02, 2020, 06:49 AM »
I received my yesterday. It arrived in perfect condition.
Setup was very easy. I was also surprised by the small screws for the wood blocks, until I thought about the possibilty of making a cut  with the blade a full depth. I saw this happen at Festool with a MFT. The small screws would do less damage to the blade.

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 6610
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: STM 1800 Quality Control Issue?
« Reply #29 on: October 02, 2020, 11:11 AM »
Getting mines tomorrow, along with the impact, Im getting excited about this feels like im going out on my first date 8)