Festool Owners Group

FESTOOL DISCUSSIONS => Festool Tool Reviews => Topic started by: Longfello on May 16, 2022, 12:15 AM

Title: Router Selection
Post by: Longfello on May 16, 2022, 12:15 AM
Hey there FOG Gang,


New to the group but have been referencing your input, experience and advice for the past few years, which has always seemed to steer me in the right direction. I am in the market for a plunge router and I am torn between the 1010 and 1400. I tend to favor the 1010 because of its light weight, versatility and price savings but I am afraid it may leave me wanting more as far as power. I currently have a triton dedicated to a table  and a dw619 cordless trim router for light work. am not sure which festool would fit in better with this quiver. I was told the 1400 is surprisingly equivalent to the dw621 2hp router at half the price with  comparable dust collection (find it hard to believe but found it on multiple threads within this network) So if that is the case I guess the 1010 would make the most sense, but will I face tasks where it is underpowered ? Do you feel the collect size is a deal breaker ?

Most of my work is tailored to small built ins,
Cabinetry, console tables  and accent furniture. So I am looking for the most logical router to handle coves, dados. rabits etc

Any and al of your input is always valued.

Thank you in advance.

Stay busy friends.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Peter_C on May 16, 2022, 02:29 AM
So I am looking for the most logical router to handle coves, dados. rabits etc
OF1400 or the OF2200, but for most wood the OF1400 will get it done. Lock miters are best left for the OF2200, but I am sure someone has used the OF1400 with success.

The OF1010 is a great router too, but not designed to swing a bigger 1/2" shank bit on a deep dado cut. Both the MFK700 with the 0* plate, and the OF1010 with the side plate work awesome for edging plywood. The MFK700 having available a preset tilt base for laminate makes it special. The MFK is the quick zippy router for edging (Not that it won't cut a smaller dado). The OF1010 is extremely versatile and my most used router.

Although on paper routers may have similar specs they are not the same in use. Smoother running means smoother cuts. Easier fine adjustments can lead to more accuracy. Being part of a system carries value.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: waho6o9 on May 16, 2022, 08:07 AM
The OF1400 would be an excellent compliment to your router collection. 

Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Cheese on May 16, 2022, 08:36 AM
Here's a previous 1010 vs 1400 discussion. If you're worried about the power of the 1010, see reply #36 where I mention using a 50 mm diameter rebate head on the 1010.

https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tool-reviews/1010-vs-1400/30/reply


Here's another post where I'm slotting 3/16" aluminum with the 1010.

https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/routingmilling-aluminum-angle-for-the-mfs-using-an-mfs-a-1010/msg575536/#msg575536
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: afish on May 16, 2022, 08:42 AM
DW621 most under rated router made.  Affordable too. 
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: rvieceli on May 16, 2022, 09:32 AM
DW621 most under rated router made.  Affordable too.

That is a great router. It was one of the late Pat Warner’s favorite routers. It is a tried and true ELU design.

https://www.acmetools.com/2-hp-plunge-router-dw621/028875006217.html?feeds=shopping&gclid=CjwKCAjw7IeUBhBbEiwADhiEMXZiKHo2AU3SeONcsZDkYJT9PsZ7Gix5XRHyD7KRP_Z_diTDeGxxrxoCUosQAvD_BwE

Ron
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: afish on May 16, 2022, 05:03 PM
yep and if you watch you can usually pick them up for 100-125 on the used market.  I bought one when they first came out guessing it was around 20 or so years ago and had several over the years and never had any issues out of any of them.  The only thing that is odd is the on/off trigger which takes some getting used too and isnt the best designed if working in goofy position.  They also make an edge guide with built in DC. 
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Richard/RMW on May 16, 2022, 05:19 PM
Just my dos pesos but I'd vote for the 1400 to fill the gap between a palm router and 2200. It's hands down one of my favorite shop tools, enjoyable to use, powerful and yet light. Tipping point may be how heavily you are invested in the Festool system, plug-it/systainer.

My only gripe with it is the dust attachment, it's OK but I'm surprised it's lasted as long as it has.

RMW

Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: SoonerFan on May 16, 2022, 06:32 PM
I would go with the 1400.  Like you I have a dedicated table router and the trim router.  My 1400 handles everything in between. 
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Crazyraceguy on May 16, 2022, 07:53 PM
I have (and frequently use) both, going as far as having 2 OF1010, so my main consideration would be in how you are going to use it. First off, the 8mm shanks are not a deal-breaker. They are out there, just not "on the shelf" at your local home center.
You mention coves and rabbets, which are edge profiles. The chip collection capability of Festool routers shines here. The real question is "how often are you going to swap attachments?" The beauty of the OF1400 is the snap-in style mechanism of the base plate. The chip deflector, opening reducer, table-widener, and copy-rings (bushings) all snap in and out instantly and toolless. It is a bigger/heavier machine though, so if you don't need the greater power on these simple edge cuts, you don't need to deal with the weight either.
This is where the OF1010 comes in. It can do your edge/profile cuts easily too, in a much lighter more compact unit. The down-side of it is those same base-plate attachments. They exist, essentially the same, but they are more "fiddley". They are held on by 2 screws, which takes more time/effort...and a tool (2 actually) The copy-rings (bushings) are arguably better, because the are "center-able". (Which is a complete topic itself) But, they take different screws than the other parts which fit into the base, chip deflector, etc.
I have never experienced a lack of power with the OF1010, but I don't use it for everything.
If you "need" a plunge router specifically, the OF1010 is probably the best choice. Plunging cuts are generally, smaller bits in the first place. You don't "need" a plunge router for big things like panel raising. That would be better done on your router table anyway. The only reason I can see to pick the OF1400, in this specific case, is if the instant snap-in base pieces appeal to you.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: jeffinsgf on May 17, 2022, 06:52 AM
I'm going to chime in here with my 2 cents. I find the 1400 to be a great hand-held router for everything EXCEPT template guide work. The tool-less, snap-in bushing holder is neither centered nor secure. It moves laterally a significant amount and you still can't get it centered.

The OF-1010 (or OF-1000 which is what I have) has a guide bushing holder that you can center.

I have them both and use them both, but if I could only have one, there would be no question. For me, it's the little guy. Most used hand-held router in my shop, out of a total of 5. I could get by with just a router table with a big router and a OF-10x0 for hand-held.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Cheese on May 17, 2022, 12:39 PM
I'm also a big fan of the 1010, it's just such a pleasure to use and being able to center the guide bushing is a big plus for certain operations. With the 1400 if the guide bushing isn't centered...well that's what you have to live with and work around. And as Jeff noted, under heavy lateral pressure, the guide bushing in the 1400 will move up to .008" in the 1400 I own.

In my case the 2200 lives in a CMS router table, the 700 is used for trimming, the 1010 is used for 70% of the routing tasks and the 1400 sits in its Systainer  [sad].
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: 4nthony on May 18, 2022, 01:24 PM
With the 1400 if the guide bushing isn't centered...well that's what you have to live with and work around. And as Jeff noted, under heavy lateral pressure, the guide bushing in the 1400 will move up to .008" in the 1400 I own.

The 1400s dirty little secret.

It becomes very apparent when using a tight radius template (I've got a bench full of irregular dog holes). Less so when gingerly following a larger or straight template. @Cheese has some great posts with pictures documenting the issue.

Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: DynaGlide on May 18, 2022, 02:35 PM
I prefer the 1400. I know people rave over the 1010. The 1010 is great when you have a bit that fits it. But when your bit is 1/2" it's pretty useless.

So, if you have a bunch of 8mm" or 1/4" collet size bits the 1010 is a great choice. I use mine more often than I thought I would. But if I could only have one it would be the 1400.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: guybo on May 18, 2022, 02:53 PM
So I am looking for the most logical router to handle coves, dados. rabits etc
OF1400 or the OF2200, but for most wood the OF1400 will get it done. Lock miters are best left for the OF2200, but I am sure someone has used the OF1400 with success.


I have no template woe w/ mine, however since no more router table,this is very impressive for the 1400,now I need a 12mm collethttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Nwo0qHravA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Nwo0qHravA)
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: jeffinsgf on May 18, 2022, 04:18 PM
It's the German Sedge!

Not sure why you need a 12mm collet. There are a lot of options for lock miter cutters with 1/2" shank. His technique is interesting, but losing a couple inches at each end is less than desirable and pushing my router bit toward a screw makes me queasy.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: guybo on May 18, 2022, 04:30 PM
Hi, they have a few very interesting cutters in the 12mm shank.and that works in the field the waste that is also we have jointed board in the field also with a screw as the holder using the ts.Lots of ways to get it done and paid [big grin] P.S been buying the ent bits in 8mm they are nice thanks @woodbutcherbower
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Longfello on May 26, 2022, 10:59 AM
Thank you all for your time and knowledge on the subject. My biggest concern was needing more power if I went with the 1010. It sounds like for most situations the power is sufficient enough to handle most plunging tasks. If that is the case, the weight differential and price between the 1400 and 1010 may tilt me towards purchasing the 1010.    Considering I have a Triton as my table router the 1010 should be able to handle anything else. If any jobs come along were I need more power I could always grab the DW 621. I appreciate the support.....

Now on to dust extractors.....
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Steve1 on May 27, 2022, 08:06 AM
I just bought one of the new 1010's.  (By the way, you might have difficulty finding a dealer with inventory)
Like you, I have a bigger router in my table, which will now be dedicated to the router table.
Like you, I wanted something lighter and more maneuverable.
Yes, I wish it had a 1/2" collet, but that's not the end of the world.  I seriously doubt "power" will be an issue.
Its a pretty nice router actually, but I have not had much opportunity to use it yet.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: woodbutcherbower on May 27, 2022, 11:03 AM

Now on to dust extractors.....

CT26 and a CT-VA-20 cyclone !!!  [big grin]
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: DynaGlide on May 27, 2022, 11:08 AM
A 1010 with a 1/2" collet would be the best of all for me. I wouldn't run it past its limits I'd just like the option.

FWIW Festool sells their 20mm boring bit in a 8mm shank. Also their 35mm cup hinge bit. If the 1010 can handle those I'm pretty sure it could handle most 1/2" bits with light passes.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Cheese on May 27, 2022, 11:31 AM
A 1010 with a 1/2" collet would be the best of all for me. I wouldn't run it past its limits I'd just like the option.

FWIW Festool sells their 20mm boring bit in a 8mm shank. Also their 35mm cup hinge bit. If the 1010 can handle those I'm pretty sure it could handle most 1/2" bits with light passes.

You're spot on Matt...here's a Festool 50 mm x 30 mm rebating cutter that's made specifically to use in the 1010. That's a 1/2" diameter Bosch bit for comparison.

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: ear3 on May 27, 2022, 04:06 PM
Is there no bearing on that thing?


A 1010 with a 1/2" collet would be the best of all for me. I wouldn't run it past its limits I'd just like the option.

FWIW Festool sells their 20mm boring bit in a 8mm shank. Also their 35mm cup hinge bit. If the 1010 can handle those I'm pretty sure it could handle most 1/2" bits with light passes.

You're spot on Matt...here's a Festool 50 mm x 30 mm rebating cutter that's made specifically to use in the 1010. That's a 1/2" diameter Bosch bit for comparison.

(Attachment Link)

(Attachment Link)
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Crazyraceguy on May 27, 2022, 05:15 PM
Is there no bearing on that thing?


A 1010 with a 1/2" collet would be the best of all for me. I wouldn't run it past its limits I'd just like the option.

FWIW Festool sells their 20mm boring bit in a 8mm shank. Also their 35mm cup hinge bit. If the 1010 can handle those I'm pretty sure it could handle most 1/2" bits with light passes.

You're spot on Matt...here's a Festool 50 mm x 30 mm rebating cutter that's made specifically to use in the 1010. That's a 1/2" diameter Bosch bit for comparison.

(Attachment Link)

(Attachment Link)

I would imagine they expect you to use the edge guide with it.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Cheese on May 27, 2022, 05:40 PM
Is there no bearing on that thing?

No bearing Edward...it was meant to be used in the CMS router table with a 1010 driving it.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: woodbutcherbower on May 27, 2022, 07:01 PM
Is there no bearing on that thing?

No bearing Edward...it was meant to be used in the CMS router table with a 1010 driving it.

A 1010 with a 1/2" collet would be the best of all for me. I wouldn't run it past its limits I'd just like the option.

Putting large rebate cutters on the end of a quarter-inch machine is absolute insanity IMHO - based on 35 years on the tools as a pro. All of the 25-30 large exterior doors I build annually, for example, initially get dry-assembled and clamped up - the panel grooves are then all done in one hit with a suitable half-inch rebate cutter on the end of a hugely powerful OF2200. Even this machine complains unless the cutter is brand-new, especially on oak and other hardwoods. Think of it like this - putting massive tyres on your Toyota Corolla doesn’t suddenly give it the same abilities as a John Deere tractor. Please guys - think carefully about the danger you’re potentially putting yourself in by using the wrong equipment for a task it was never designed to fulfil. Festool make four different-sized routers for a reason, and the 1010 doesn't come with a half-inch collet as part of that reason.

3/4 million woodworking injuries per year. And that’s just those which are serious enough to get reported. Do it safely or don’t do it at all.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/3498745/

https://www.routerforums.com/threads/router-accident-trying-to-understand-what-happened.11257/ (warning - graphic images)
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Spandex on May 29, 2022, 05:12 PM
think carefully about the danger you’re potentially putting yourself in by using the wrong equipment for a task it was never designed to fulfil.
To be fair, that cutter was designed for the of1010. If you believe that’s not a safe combo you should be telling Festool, as it’s currently listed on their site as compatible with all three of their routers:

https://www.festool.co.uk/accessory/489284---fk-d-50x30#Overview
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: woodbutcherbower on May 31, 2022, 12:15 PM
Fair point @Spandex - but that specific cutter was designed to be used on a stationary router table (CMS) being driven by any of Festool's three routers. It works more like a typical cutter which would be mounted on the shaft of a spindle moulder. My points about safety concerns were aimed more at large conventional all-in-one rabbeting bits with quarter-inch shanks. Communication breakdown, I think.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Peter Parfitt on May 31, 2022, 12:32 PM
Hey there FOG Gang,


New to the group but have been referencing your input, experience and advice for the past few years, which has always seemed to steer me in the right direction. I am in the market for a plunge router and I am torn between the 1010 and 1400. I tend to favor the 1010 because of its light weight, versatility and price savings but I am afraid it may leave me wanting more as far as power. I currently have a triton dedicated to a table  and a dw619 cordless trim router for light work. am not sure which festool would fit in better with this quiver. I was told the 1400 is surprisingly equivalent to the dw621 2hp router at half the price with  comparable dust collection (find it hard to believe but found it on multiple threads within this network) So if that is the case I guess the 1010 would make the most sense, but will I face tasks where it is underpowered ? Do you feel the collect size is a deal breaker ?

Most of my work is tailored to small built ins,
Cabinetry, console tables  and accent furniture. So I am looking for the most logical router to handle coves, dados. rabits etc

Any and al of your input is always valued.

Thank you in advance.

Stay busy friends.

This may help:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHJktChv4Ck

Peter
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Cheese on May 31, 2022, 03:57 PM
My point in picking out that particular rebate cutter was in reference to Reply 21 where DynaGlide mentions the capabilities of the 1010 and wonders aloud, quote "If the 1010 can handle those I'm pretty sure it could handle most 1/2" bits with light passes."

My point was if the 1010 can spin that 50 mm rebate cutter, it can certainly spin a 12 mm (1/2") router bit. The discussion was all about the large tool capabilities of the 1010 router.
Title: Re: Router Selection
Post by: Ebuwan on June 09, 2022, 03:45 PM
If only one, get the 1400.

I have the 1400 and the 1010 (not the newest one, the laste generation), and I always us the 1010 for the LR-32 system.1400 works fine with the LR32 system as well, but 1010 is lighter, and when doing LOTS of cabinet sides it makes a difference.



The dust collection on the 1400 is just stupid awesome.