Author Topic: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL  (Read 13444 times)

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Offline KennyB

  • Posts: 4
MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« on: June 20, 2016, 02:07 PM »
Ok, here's the deal, this a great table but due to neck problems it's too short for me. Here is my conversation with Festool USA, and my issue with them is perhaps they think too much of their products and have lost concern for the average customer.

My letter to them:
Good day,

I just purchased both the MTF/3 and the attached CMS Router Table. I am also a US Navy disabled Vet, I have neck an back problems and my neck limits my ability to look down an work on tasks. I have found that by having a raised table the pain is not as bad. Unfortunately, your tables are too low and they cause me a great deal of pain and vertigo due to damage done to my neck from years of military service. Do you offer any kind of leg extensions for the router and MTF tables? If I could safely make the table tops a few inches higher I think that would solve my problem.

Festool's response and you judge for yourself - for me I'm not happy that this company won't ever work with me, instead they just dismiss my concerns. So I may start looking for

Hello,

Thank you for contacting Festool. The MFT/3 table and the attached CMS do not have the ability to be changed in height at all. Festool does not recommend altering tools or accessories in any way as it may change the stability or safety of its products.
 Thank you for your inquiry.

Best Regards,
Festool USA
Tooltechnic Systems, LLC
400 N. Enterprise Blvd.
Lebanon, IN 46052
Title        Product and Applications Specialist Dept.   
Dept.      Service

My response back:

Really? That's all you can say? I'm a Festool fan and have spent thousands on your products and find your response frustrating and disappointing. So much for all the YouTube videos.
 [mad]

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline copcarcollector

  • Posts: 1457
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2016, 02:12 PM »
What exactly do you want them to say or offer you? There are no leg extensions. You are not the first to ask.

Check You Tube or the FOG for many, many options to alter the MFT height, including making your own rolling tables at any height to hold them at a height  where they will serve you better.

In any case,  [welcome] to the FOG...

Offline GarryMartin

  • Posts: 1923
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2016, 02:18 PM »
Hi @KennyB and welcome to the FOG! Let's see if we can't help you out here.

There have been a number of threads over the years relating to increasing (or decreasing) the height of the MFT/3 either permanently or temporarily.

You could try some slightly larger diameter tubing that the legs can slip into, with a solid dowel at the bottom at the height you want to increase the table to. Or you could use some angle iron on each leg (see photo) or simply drop the legs on to "blocks" that increase the height (again, see photo).

Or of course if you want to go a little more extravagant, you could put both tables on a rolling frame of some sort (more photos!)

Hope this gets you thinking about what might be most appropriate for your circumstances.

Offline Woodwork Wizard

  • Posts: 431
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2016, 03:30 PM »
Build your own base/cart to your desired height and remove the legs from the MFT. Makes the MFT and the CMS really stable. Unless portability is an issue I think doing this is a really big improvement.

Offline KennyB

  • Posts: 4
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2016, 03:44 PM »
Funny,

I knew upon posting this, someone ask this question. Frankly, I didn't expect them to say much at all, I just expected
some kind of conversation as you can see I didn't make any demands. I'm simply looking for answers and reasons not to
return their products; in other words save everybody money.     

What exactly do you want them to say or offer you? There are no leg extensions. You are not the first to ask.

Check You Tube or the FOG for many, many options to alter the MFT height, including making your own rolling tables at any height to hold them at a height  where they will serve you better.

In any case,  [welcome] to the FOG...

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 6879
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2016, 04:07 AM »
Rereading your post maybe you asked them the wrong question. If you would explain your situation with them or maybe your dealer (if you bought from one and not online) they might be able to work with you to get the GE unit. Which is what you need.

 I have the opposite issue, Im short so the MFT is a little high for me. Once I return to the states Im making a stand for mine.

 Placing the MFT, CMS is designed to be placed on carts because if you look they have pads for it to set on when the legs are folded. The VL unit may not be the right tool for you as it attaches to the MFT. Maybe the GE unit would be better.

Festool hold a high resale value, if your 30 day warranty has run out, you can sell it for close to full value and get the GE. They have a classified section here that tools move pretty fast what a add is placed there.

 Then build a stand to a height you are more comfortable working at
« Last Edit: June 21, 2016, 04:11 AM by jobsworth »

Offline Lbob131

  • Posts: 568
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2016, 06:50 AM »
The blocks under the legs is a good idea. And you can  saw  them to your own personal  preferred height.

Offline RNEMTP

  • Posts: 64
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2019, 11:20 PM »
How is the fact that you’re a veteran relevant to the conversation? They told you they don’t have extensions and warned you of making modifications for safety reasons. Did you think they were going to fall all over themselves an get the engineering team to make something special for you because you’re a veteran?

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1760
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2019, 12:23 PM »
... and warned you of making modifications for safety reasons ...
That's just legal CYA that's needed (especially in the US), in case a comany wants to still exist next year.
Quote
Did you think they were going to fall all over themselves an get the engineering team to make something special for you because you’re a veteran?
I read that as a honest "here's my problem, not stemming from your product in general but from by body being out of the norm". While the part about about the 'from' might be redundant I don't see it as bad, worst case would be it being used to point out that the issue isn't a brainfart (as it might be seen when looking at 'causing vertigo', which is uncommon).

Offline PeterJJames13

  • Posts: 253
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2019, 01:00 PM »
OP has two posts on the FOG and both are from this thread. Not to mention, the date was over 3 years ago. Seems like a "hit and run". While I understand many people read and lurk, I don't see the value here in popping in, saying something, and leaving.

Offline Rob Z

  • Posts: 1077
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2019, 01:29 PM »
It's easy enough to raise the working height of an MFT.  Cut pieces of PVC to sleeve over the MFT legs.  Put a ~ 1/2"  bolt through the PVC as a support for the bottom of the MFT leg.  Cut the pipe at the appropriate angle so the PVC sits flat on the floor.


Offline vkumar

  • Posts: 552
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2019, 02:18 PM »
@RobZ  PVC tube? How do you put  a bolt thru a tube?  I must have this wrong. Some pictures or sketches please.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2019, 02:24 PM by vkumar »
Vijay Kumar

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 5455
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2019, 02:50 PM »
@RobZ  PVC tube? How do you put  a bolt thru a tube?  I must have this wrong. Some pictures or sketches please.

Drill a hole through one side of the plastic tube and out the other. Put a bolt through the hole.

Offline vkumar

  • Posts: 552
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2019, 02:56 PM »
Ahh Ok. That make sense. Sometimes the mind is stuck!!!! Thank you Michael.
Vijay Kumar

Offline Peter Parfitt

  • Magazine/Blog Author
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  • Posts: 4509
    • New Brit Workshop on YouTube
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2019, 03:40 PM »
Ok, here's the deal, this a great table but due to neck problems it's too short for me. Here is my conversation with Festool USA, and my issue with them is perhaps they think too much of their products and have lost concern for the average customer.

My letter to them:
Good day,

I just purchased both the MTF/3 and the attached CMS Router Table. I am also a US Navy disabled Vet, I have neck an back problems and my neck limits my ability to look down an work on tasks. I have found that by having a raised table the pain is not as bad. Unfortunately, your tables are too low and they cause me a great deal of pain and vertigo due to damage done to my neck from years of military service. Do you offer any kind of leg extensions for the router and MTF tables? If I could safely make the table tops a few inches higher I think that would solve my problem.

Festool's response and you judge for yourself - for me I'm not happy that this company won't ever work with me, instead they just dismiss my concerns. So I may start looking for

Hello,

Thank you for contacting Festool. The MFT/3 table and the attached CMS do not have the ability to be changed in height at all. Festool does not recommend altering tools or accessories in any way as it may change the stability or safety of its products.
 Thank you for your inquiry.

Best Regards,
Festool USA
Tooltechnic Systems, LLC
400 N. Enterprise Blvd.
Lebanon, IN 46052
Title        Product and Applications Specialist Dept.   
Dept.      Service

My response back:

Really? That's all you can say? I'm a Festool fan and have spent thousands on your products and find your response frustrating and disappointing. So much for all the YouTube videos.
 [mad]

Hi Kenny

I really think that you have approached this in the wrong way...

You are the best person in the world to understand your own capabilities and limitations. Despite that, you went ahead and purchased a product which was clearly described and easy to take a peek at before buying. To then turn around and expect Festool to come to your aid is just not fair.

I am an Army veteran with several injuries sustained during service and I have problems with all sorts of kit but that is not the fault of the manufacturer.

Peter


Offline SRSemenza

  • Global Moderator
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  • Posts: 9941
  • Finger Lakes Region, NY State , USA
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2019, 04:04 PM »
No problem with reviving an old topic. Info can still be relevant. But OP has not been on in over three years. I expect he has it sorted one way or the other by now.

 No need to cast aspersion either.


Seth

Offline Rob Z

  • Posts: 1077
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2019, 06:28 PM »
Hello Vijay,

Michael got it explained well enough. I said to use something like a 1/2" bolt because it gives more surface area to support the foot of the MFT leg, versus something like a 1/4" bolt.   I also would say this is useful to add maybe as much as 6" of height, but I don't know about more than that.  I don't recall what I used in past, 1.5" or 2" PVC. 

Offline Coen

  • Posts: 1565
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #17 on: November 16, 2019, 10:33 AM »
Pretty mch every European male had this with the BASIS Plus system (pre CMS) and my brother put his on a selfbuild Rolly that enabled moving it together with the vacuum underneath. My dad did the same with his CS50 later but without raising the height.

The GE has the same height as the MFT VL, so that solves nothing.

Offline KennyB

  • Posts: 4
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #18 on: October 07, 2021, 09:46 PM »
So I just read this post again and found some the interesting. I was able to add wheels to my setup and have
used it safely for years. it's been awesome actually and when I was in my small garage workshop it allowed me to move
the complete setup as a unit. So it can be done safely. 

Offline squall_line

  • Posts: 1385
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2021, 11:38 AM »
So I just read this post again and found some the interesting. I was able to add wheels to my setup and have
used it safely for years. it's been awesome actually and when I was in my small garage workshop it allowed me to move
the complete setup as a unit. So it can be done safely.

That's great to hear!  Obviously for legal reasons Festool can't recommend that themselves, although with enough in-house testing I'm sure they'd love to offer a conversion kit of some sort.  Surely it would come in less expensive than the wheel kit for the Mac Pro computer? ($700 for a set of 4 wheels!)

Any further details on what wheels you used or how you attached them?  Were they any locking mechanisms involved to keep it stable?

Offline KennyB

  • Posts: 4
Re: MTF/3 and MFT/3 Router Table Set, CMS-VL
« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2021, 03:22 AM »
Yes, they do lock and I was using it tonight - funny, I had a board in my hands and I tried to move it without unlocking the wheels and it wouldn't budge. The one missing piece though, is it no longer has the convenient hight adjustment but for me it's perfect because it's a little taller than the original setup and it helps my neck. Basically I did what I set out to do and I'm happy I did. I understand Festool's position but there are better ways to handle good customers and I would have been happy to discuss this offline with them.
Shoot, one of my friends just went out and bought a CT15 yesterday because of me, if that's not brand loyalty I don't know what is.