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Author Topic: Problems with Kapex 120  (Read 2768 times)

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Offline billberner

  • Posts: 14
Problems with Kapex 120
« on: July 05, 2019, 07:55 AM »
I just bought a new Kapex 120 and honestly am pretty underwhelmed with it.  I am hoping there are a couple things forum members can help with:

1) the left laser is so dim you can barely see it.  In one areas, it's completely dark.  That makes the laser useless.  I think this may be related to the fact that when the saw came, the left laser was off by at least 1/8". I had to adjust it pretty much all the way to get it to line up to the cut, now it's dark

2) the right 'stop ruler' (the upper part of the right side of the fence is very wobbly, even when locked down.  I have not scoured the manual completely, but so far have not found a way to fix that although I intend to follow the instructions for removing and replacing it to see if that helps (I am away from the shop for the weekend)

Other things I don't particularly like:

- Dust collection is not great with a CT36 and the wider hose.  Certainly worse than I had with my old DeWalt that had a dust shroud attached to my Oneida. 

- With the MF mini table, there is not much room to reach under to loosen or tighten the extensions.  that is particularly a problem because the extensions are pretty wobbly to start with, so I try to keep them tight.

The entire setup was >$2500.  For that I figured I'd be blown away and that hasn't really happened at all.  I haven't changed a blade yet, I hope when I go to do that, it will be much simpler than for the DeWalt, which was kind of a joke.

Thanks in advance for any help or comments.

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Offline Birdhunter

  • Posts: 2724
  • Woodworker, Sportsman, Retired
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2019, 08:12 AM »
I’d try to go to a dealer along with your  to get help. If the unit is defective, it should be eligible for a swap
Birdhunter

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 6543
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #2 on: July 05, 2019, 10:10 AM »
I'd also definitely take it back to the dealer if it's new. The laser and stop ruler issues shouldn't be your problem.

The larger diameter hose is important but it also needs to be fairly short. Mine is around 6 foot long. Check to make sure the CT 36 is on max suction, you may have accidentally hit the control knob at some point.


Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 804
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #3 on: July 05, 2019, 10:41 AM »
I would also return the saw, although the things you mention should be an easy fix, not down to you though.
The lasers usually come spot on depending on how you like them set, mine were fine for what most users would expect but, I fine tuned to my taste.

I wasn’t over impressed with the dust collection at first, even with a 36mm hose, I read up on other users experiences, and changed my style when cutting, which made a noticeable difference. Then as Cheese mentioned, I made up a shorter hose, mine is 1500mm in length, and again a noticeable difference.

Definitely best to return it though.


Offline RKA

  • Posts: 1781
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #4 on: July 05, 2019, 11:37 AM »
Lasers - something is wrong.  I haven’t had to fool with mine, but maybe peek up there are see if something wasn’t installed right.  I know, it stinks to mess with a $1600 saw, but maybe a little sleuthing is easier than returning it?

Stop - I don’t quite follow what part you’re talking about.  If it’s the fence, you should be able to adjust the clamping mechanism to lock it more securely.

Dust collection - this may benefit from a shorter 36mm hose as others stated.  Sliding cuts tend to produce reasonable results if the boot isn’t folding back in the process of a cut.  It’s not perfect, but it’s the best I’ve seen from any miter saw out of the box, including my DW780.

The mini MFT is a questionable item in my view.  I just use a black and decker workmate with a top thick enough to bring the kapex table up to 900mm so I can use the wings or my MFT for extra support on long stock.  A 3/4” + 1/2” ply brings the top surface of the workmate to 790mm.  As long as you don’t oversize the table top, you’ll have room to cinch down the extension wings.  My only reservation about this set up is the workmate doesn’t flat pack as well as an MFT style table.  If it did, it would be easier to transport in my wagon.  Most are using a van or truck, so this isn’t a problem since the workmate can be strapped vertically against the walls or something. 

If you have the stomach for it, see if you can work with your dealer to sort out the little quirks as get it working optimally.  Then evaluate it and make a judgement.  If you just don’t want to mess with it given the price paid, return it within your 30 day window.  You don’t need to spend half as much to get a good saw, and I agree, quality control issues at this price point would leave a bitter taste in my mouth too!
-Raj

Offline Doug S

  • Posts: 445
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #5 on: July 05, 2019, 12:56 PM »
My lasers needed adjusting when I got my Kapex but personally I never use them. There is a lens/protector for the lasers which can get dirty and will obscure the lasers, it is easily removed for cleaning. I would have another fiddle with the lasers, they are a bit tricky to adjust correctly.

If you mean the upper fence extension part does not lock that is easily fixed by sliding fence out and giving the green locking handle a twist to tighten it down a bit.

The dust extraction depends a lot on technique, pull saw head towards you, plunge down, make cut pushing saw back through timber. This works well on square stock but once you are cutting miters or bevels the dust extraction does get a bit more random.

I have no experience of the mini MFT for the Kapex, I have the UG cart which is excellent. 

Offline ear3

  • Posts: 3886
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #6 on: July 05, 2019, 01:52 PM »
The previous poster has pointed to the correct fixes, though you are right that for the price, there should be minimal fixes out of the box other than aligning the laser and squaring the miter scale.  If you're still within the 30 day return window, there's no shame in swapping it out for another.

On the dust collection, I keep my Kapex hooked up to a 6.5HP Shop Vac and 1 7/8" hose, which I find works better than when it is hooked up to the CT.

Oh and if you do get a new one, dbl check that the manufacture date is 2017 or later... [tongue]

http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-announcements/message-from-festool-about-kapex-miter-saw/
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS-EC 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • RS 2 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/BT module • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 1293
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #7 on: July 05, 2019, 02:17 PM »
Festool should send someone to SawStop to understudy how their calibration and QC processes for the PCS and ICS work. If a new SawStop owner had to overcome calibration hurdles that we often hear about the DJ and Kapex, SawStop would never come close to the kind of success it has been enjoying.

I needed to do zero calibration or alignments for the trunnion or mitre slot when the saw arrived. Dead-on. The only calibration needed was to set up the fence. I know two other SawStop cabinet saw owners and, too, their new saws arrived with zero calibration issues.

Why does a new Kapex owner need to set do a 5-cuts test to set the saw to cut square when it is brand new? Why is the laser not dead-on when received? I don't buy the excuse that everything is great, but blame every problem on delivery. We are talking about a Rolls Royce class of mitre saw here. Shouldn't we expect a higher standard?
« Last Edit: July 21, 2019, 01:44 PM by ChuckM »

Offline Peter Halle

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 12064
  • Magnum - My new little boy
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #8 on: July 05, 2019, 07:40 PM »
I will echo some of the comments here.  If you are in the 30 day period, just take it back to the dealer and get a new one.  If you bought online, then sending it back might not be the best option whereas you may have to pay for return shipping.  If that was the case then I would initiate a service request with Festool and then it will be sent in and checked out / repaired / calibrated at no cost to you.  You'll be without your saw for about a week here in the US.

Peter

Offline rmhinden

  • Posts: 211
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #9 on: July 05, 2019, 09:25 PM »
Festool should send someone to SawStop to understudy how their calibration and QC processes for the PCS and ICS work. If a new SawStop owner has to overcome calibration hurdles that we often hear about the DJ and Kapex, SawStop would never come close to the kind of success it has been enjoying.

I needed to do zero calibration or alignments for the trunnion or mitre slot when the saw arrived. Dead-on. The only calibration needed was to set up the fence. I know two other SawStop cabinet saw owners and, too, their new saws arrived with zero calibration issues.

@ChuckM  That was my experience with Sawstop as well.   I checked everything out, but the only part that needed calibration was the fence.   

The other place where Festool can learn from Sawstop is the manuals.   They are better in all aspects, including format, pictures, assembly, calibration, usage, etc.  I realize that Festool isn't at the same price point as Sawstop, but they could do a lot better.

Bob

Offline Birdhunter

  • Posts: 2724
  • Woodworker, Sportsman, Retired
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #10 on: July 06, 2019, 06:12 AM »
I have the Industrial SawStop and agree with the spot-on no adjustment upon delivery. The manuals are amazing.

I’ve had very minimal adjustment issues with my Festool products, but the manuals are the pits. Most of what I have learned about my Festool products came from supplemental manuals or YouTube videos.
Birdhunter

Offline billberner

  • Posts: 14
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #11 on: July 06, 2019, 08:05 AM »
Thank you everyone for the suggestions.  I'll also call Festool Monday AM.

I believe I am just outside 30 days, but maybe Festool service will work if we can't resolve over the phone.

For the dust collection, I do have a longish piece of 36mm attached, I'll drop that to a very short piece with a 4" adaptor for the larger dust collector and see if that improves a lot. Or maybe I'll build a shroud of sorts under the MFT mini.

Also, I agree with all the comments about the Saw Stop.  The "out of box" experience was amazing.

Thanks again.

Offline Peter Durand

  • Posts: 198
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #12 on: July 06, 2019, 09:39 AM »
I have the Industrial SawStop and agree with the spot-on no adjustment upon delivery. The manuals are amazing.

I’ve had very minimal adjustment issues with my Festool products, but the manuals are the pits. Most of what I have learned about my Festool products came from supplemental manuals or YouTube videos.

Same here.

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5895
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #13 on: July 06, 2019, 11:27 AM »
You have a 3 year warranty.

Festool will help you get this sorted.

Plz let us know what they tell you and how they help you.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2019, 11:31 AM by jobsworth »

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 804
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #14 on: July 06, 2019, 05:41 PM »
I agree about the manuals, not great or detailed, and a lot of skipping backwards and forwards when negotiating the manuals.
I think this is a German thing though, years back, some Dutch friends told me that when Germans unbox a product, the instructions and manuals are only in German, not multi lingual like we are all used too.

The only time a German sees instructions in any other language bar German, isif the product is imported.
Been told this a few times, so if it still stands, it might explain the lacking in German manuals?  [big grin]

Offline Corey P.

  • Posts: 21
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #15 on: July 16, 2019, 06:12 PM »
I had to return and swap a new Kapex last year.  Table was too far out of flat.  Place I bought it let me pop open another on the spot and verify everything worked before I agreed to keep it.  If possible, I'd ask to check those things out.  Also, make sure you're getting the updated Kapex, if possible. 

As for the laser and the fence, my 2nd Kapex was dead on, no adjustments needed.  Also, I use the FastCap extensions on my Kapex.  They work great, and are quite a bit cheaper.

Offline Duster

  • Posts: 4
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2019, 10:17 AM »
I have also recently purchased the Kapex within the past 3 months.I also find the lasers dull and really dont use them for that reason.The saw seems accurate and cuts nice mitres.I use this unit professionly each day as Im a home builder.I also use the Dewalt 717 which I find is built really solid and just as accurate,just not as good on dust collection.

I see from my Festool dealer that a new Kapex is coming in October,which somewhat dissappoints me because I understand it will have a reworked motor to deal with all the smoking motors that have been reported.I feel Festool should have posted something about that.So,if my Kapex does blow up I really hope its within the first 3 years.

Offline Doug S

  • Posts: 445
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2019, 01:34 PM »

I see from my Festool dealer that a new Kapex is coming in October,which somewhat dissappoints me because I understand it will have a reworked motor to deal with all the smoking motors that have been reported.I feel Festool should have posted something about that.So,if my Kapex does blow up I really hope its within the first 3 years.

Festool updated the motor in the Kapex a couple of years ago so you should have nothing to worry about (fingers crossed).


Offline ear3

  • Posts: 3886
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2019, 01:52 PM »
@Duster FYI http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-announcements/message-from-festool-about-kapex-miter-saw/

I see from my Festool dealer that a new Kapex is coming in October,which somewhat dissappoints me because I understand it will have a reworked motor to deal with all the smoking motors that have been reported.I feel Festool should have posted something about that.So,if my Kapex does blow up I really hope its within the first 3 years.
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS-EC 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • RS 2 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/BT module • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Offline Duster

  • Posts: 4
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2019, 03:36 PM »
Thanks for sharing this information.I truly believe the Kapex is a great saw.

Offline harry_

  • Posts: 1300
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2019, 05:00 PM »
As far as the laser goes, check the protective lens. Might just be dirty.
Disclaimer: This post is for educational and entertainment purposes only. Any resemblance to real persons, living or dead is purely coincidental. Void where prohibited. Some assembly required. Batteries not included. Contents may settle during shipment. Use only as directed. No other warranty expressed or implied. This is not an offer to sell securities. May be too intense for some viewers. No user-serviceable parts inside. Subject to change without notice. One size fits all (very poorly).

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 804
Re: Problems with Kapex 120
« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2019, 06:08 PM »
The lasers can look blurry if not adjusted within range too.