Author Topic: UJK Parf Guide dog holes too tight  (Read 2116 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline TSO_Products

  • Retailer
  • *
  • Posts: 315
    • TSO Products LLC
Re: UJK Parf Guide dog holes too tight
« Reply #30 on: October 18, 2020, 07:42 AM »
A reamer like that should be added to the catalog of every dog manufacturer.

You're absolutely correct Michael...that item should be standard fare. I wonder if Hans has seen this item yet?

@Cheese - ever since we introduced our 18" inch Precision Triangles we have been faced with the varying accuracy of hole patterns and bore diameters.

This led us to introduce two styles of our Double Groove(TM) Dogs. For most operations involving Dogs in a 20mm benchtop hole pattern, an ultra-tight fit is not required and not even helpful - hence our standard Dog which does not need to "pushed" in, nor require extra effort to withdraw.

If the fit of our standard Dogs leaves an undesirable amount of  play, that can be substantially reduced or eliminated by using a TSO SpeedKnob from below to draw the Dog into a perfectly perpendicular realationship with the top.

TSO's CF-Dogs (Close Fitting) work well with precisely machined or Parf Guide System produced tops when using the appropriate material: quality, dense MDF, or in Europe, use Valchromat, a dense woodfiber material with similar characteristics.

Choose the right Dog fit for the top you have rather than trying to micro-machine the hole of a woodfiber material to tolerances not appropriate for the material - and get back to woodworking.

Read all about it:
https://tsoproducts.com/bench-dogs/

Hans






Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Bertotti

  • Posts: 12
Re: UJK Parf Guide dog holes too tight
« Reply #31 on: October 18, 2020, 10:24 AM »
Hi , new here but I just used the mk2 parf guide myself. 2x4 top, sorry not metric here yet, half standard half isometric. New bit and kit my holes were also very tight. I could put the dogs in but some I could not get out. I split a piece of wood with a hole in it and used it to grab them and turn them then pull them out. It seemed to compress the edges ever so slightly. They still fit tightly but I can pull them out by hand with a twist.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2020, 10:33 AM by Bertotti »
I want to populate SD with trees becasue I miss the forests of the river bottoms.

Offline Roachmill

  • Posts: 242
Re: UJK Parf Guide dog holes too tight
« Reply #32 on: October 18, 2020, 02:56 PM »
I'd be interested in seeing what the diameter of the reemer is instead of the length. IS it taking it to 20.10mm?
Good point! Keep in mind that NASA do not use my calipers so measurement to the nearest atom is not guaranteed. With that said, here we have what they say a 12mm Parf Pup and the reamer come out at:



I spent 10 minutes reaming out the holes on the top for my centipede (produced using a jig with Festool 20mm bit) which, up until now, were way too tight for Parf dogs. As a result I'll be passing on the myriad of old dogs from a multitude of manufacturers and ordering more Parf dogs. No more futzing around picking and choosing between dogs that are too tight or too loose.

As to just using Valcromat or HDF... for something I cut to bits and replace on a regular basis I'll stick to the cheaper MRMDF, PGS and 10 minutes reaming. I'm done with router jigs, worrying about router bit concentricity (I'm looking at you OF1400!) and will this dog fit snug or be loose. I believe I have, after several years, attained a MFT and dog zen state. Sad, I know!

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 7770
Re: UJK Parf Guide dog holes too tight
« Reply #33 on: October 18, 2020, 04:19 PM »
@Cheese - ever since we introduced our 18" inch Precision Triangles we have been faced with the varying accuracy of hole patterns and bore diameters.

This led us to introduce two styles of our Double Groove(TM) Dogs. For most operations involving Dogs in a 20mm benchtop hole pattern, an ultra-tight fit is not required and not even helpful - hence our standard Dog which does not need to "pushed" in, nor require extra effort to withdraw.

If the fit of our standard Dogs leaves an undesirable amount of  play, that can be substantially reduced or eliminated by using a TSO SpeedKnob from below to draw the Dog into a perfectly perpendicular relationship with the top.

Hans

Thanks for the Dog information Hans @TSO Products 

I never looked at or considered purchasing your dogs because I already have so many on-hand. Woodpeckers aluminum, Woodpeckers delrin, Qwas, Lee Valley yada yada. I even have several aluminum versions that I turned myself on the lathe. [eek]

So like Roachmill and probably many others on this forum I just keep a pile of them on the bench and then go through the drill "this one's too tight, this ones too loose".

Now that I know you provide Dogs in 2 different diameters, I'm going to take a different approach and purchase several of each and then make a decision as to which ones work best.

One of the table tops is 1 1/2" thick maple that I used a 20 mm Zobo bit on.

The other table top is 18 mm BB ply that I used the Festool 20 mm bit on.

We'll see what shakes out.  [smile]

Offline Claimdude

  • Posts: 417
Re: UJK Parf Guide dog holes too tight
« Reply #34 on: October 18, 2020, 07:55 PM »
Cheese,

I have the tight fit TSO dogs and have been very happy with them! My top is a CNC'd top based on the Drawing that Hans provides. I used plane old MDF and have no problems with changes in dimensions. My shop is climate controlled with humidity typically around 45%. You won't regret getting the TSO dogs.

Jack

@Cheese - ever since we introduced our 18" inch Precision Triangles we have been faced with the varying accuracy of hole patterns and bore diameters.

This led us to introduce two styles of our Double Groove(TM) Dogs. For most operations involving Dogs in a 20mm benchtop hole pattern, an ultra-tight fit is not required and not even helpful - hence our standard Dog which does not need to "pushed" in, nor require extra effort to withdraw.

If the fit of our standard Dogs leaves an undesirable amount of  play, that can be substantially reduced or eliminated by using a TSO SpeedKnob from below to draw the Dog into a perfectly perpendicular relationship with the top.

Hans

Thanks for the Dog information Hans @TSO Products 

I never looked at or considered purchasing your dogs because I already have so many on-hand. Woodpeckers aluminum, Woodpeckers delrin, Qwas, Lee Valley yada yada. I even have several aluminum versions that I turned myself on the lathe. [eek]

So like Roachmill and probably many others on this forum I just keep a pile of them on the bench and then go through the drill "this one's too tight, this ones too loose".

Now that I know you provide Dogs in 2 different diameters, I'm going to take a different approach and purchase several of each and then make a decision as to which ones work best.

One of the table tops is 1 1/2" thick maple that I used a 20 mm Zobo bit on.

The other table top is 18 mm BB ply that I used the Festool 20 mm bit on.

We'll see what shakes out.  [smile]

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 7770
Re: UJK Parf Guide dog holes too tight
« Reply #35 on: October 18, 2020, 08:52 PM »
Cheese,

I have the tight fit TSO dogs and have been very happy with them! My top is a CNC'd top based on the Drawing that Hans provides. I used plane old MDF and have no problems with changes in dimensions. My shop is climate controlled with humidity typically around 45%. You won't regret getting the TSO dogs.

Jack

Thanks Jack, I appreciate your feedback.  [smile]

Like you, the benches are in the basement where it’s 50-70 all year long with good humidity control.
I’m going to purchase the tight Dogs and go from there. If they’re too tight I’ll modify them on the lathe and that will quickly point me in the direction I need to go to fine tune this situation.