Author Topic: BF/MFT Build  (Read 18002 times)

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Offline AtomicRyan

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BF/MFT Build
« on: October 13, 2019, 08:39 PM »
I’ve still gotta lot of work to do and plan to make a video of the build when I’m done, but figured you guys would get a kick out of this early look... essentially, it’s a 4x8 80/20 based MFT table with lots and lots of systainer ports.

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline punkmft

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2019, 09:14 PM »
Dope!

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Offline stickman

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2019, 09:51 PM »
I will be building something similar in the next few months. Really looking forward to your video/more info. Yours came out really well.
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Offline neilc

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #3 on: October 13, 2019, 11:12 PM »
Great job, Ryan!  You definitely have the bug!

Look forward to the video and hopefully more details on the bill of materials and potentially plans.

Already looking at the casters on it and wondering about them -

neil

Offline Svar

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #4 on: October 13, 2019, 11:18 PM »
Already looking at the casters on it and wondering about them -
neil
Footmaster, GD series.
http://www.footmaster.net/products/list.asp?bic_code=Leveling&small_code=GD
« Last Edit: October 13, 2019, 11:20 PM by Svar »

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2019, 05:34 PM »
Finished the large end cap drawers today...


Offline blaszcsj

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2019, 08:41 PM »
@AtomicRyan what are you using for the drawer fronts.
OF1010 EQ Router | MFT/3 | DF500Q | Mafell P1CC | ETS EC 150/3 | CT 36 Auto Clean | TSC55 | LR32 | OF1400 EQ Router | ZOBO Metric Set | CXS Li 2.6 - 90 Limited Edition | Universal Cleaning Set | HKC55 | Centrotec CE-SORT | RO150 FEQ | DTS 400 | RO90 DX | CTSYS | C18 Drill | SysLite KALII | Syslite STL 450 | RAS 115 E | OF2200 EB | OSC 18 Vectoro

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2019, 09:03 PM »
3/4” Baltic birch faced with arctic white laminate... I just used some extruded aluminum for drawer pulls.

They are close to 45” wide and all I had on hand was some 100-pound residential slides, but I put two slides on each side of the bottom drawers. They don’t rack at all, but time will tell if they hold up to the weight. I figure each drawer will weigh around 75 pounds once loaded.

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2019, 10:43 PM »
I decided to dedicate one side of the bench to sys 4s and above... As such, I had a little room for 4.5” drawers. This is gonna work out nicely I think.

Also, super tempted to do kaizen foam.


Online Dusty.Tools

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2019, 12:35 AM »
Oh snap :)

Did you use Orange Aluminum drawer pulls?




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Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2019, 01:11 AM »
Oh snap :)

Did you use Orange Aluminum drawer pulls?




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I did.... The extrusion I used wasn’t exactly what I was looking for, but they seem to be the only game in town with reasonable prices.

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2019, 01:13 AM »
And wow - that’s a great looking drawer system you built!

Online Dusty.Tools

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2019, 01:14 AM »
Oh snap :)

Did you use Orange Aluminum drawer pulls?




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I did.... The extrusion I used wasn’t exactly what I was looking for, but they seem to be the only game in town with reasonable prices.
Yeah their prices are hard to beat!


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Online Dusty.Tools

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2019, 12:07 PM »
And wow - that’s a great looking drawer system you built!
Thanks :)

I wrote up my build on ToolGuyd - https://toolguyd.com/building-tool-cabinet-drawers-journey-to-an-organized-workshop-part-4/


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Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2019, 10:13 AM »
This is silly, but... How about a vintage dog hole placed machine lamp? It’s actually pretty handy...


Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #15 on: October 24, 2019, 11:33 AM »
Oh... Also, you can see part 1 of this build here:

https://www.garagejournal.com/2019/10/the-bf-mft-workbench-build-part-1/

I'm hoping to have Part 2 out within a few weeks...

Online Dusty.Tools

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2019, 03:06 AM »
This is silly, but... How about a vintage dog hole placed machine lamp? It’s actually pretty handy...
Nice lamp! Did you buy it online?


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Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #17 on: October 28, 2019, 08:33 AM »
This is silly, but... How about a vintage dog hole placed machine lamp? It’s actually pretty handy...
Nice lamp! Did you buy it online?


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It’s a restored 1940s era Craftsman (I think?) machine lamp.

Offline DynaGlide

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2019, 08:44 AM »
Ryan,

It's cool to see what you've accomplished here. I can't imagine ever having the shop space for something like this but I enjoyed seeing the thought process behind all of the 8020 construction. Some day I'll build with aluminum profiles but I can't commit to them until I know I won't change my mind on what I want out of them.

You started in on the Festool path the same time as me and I really liked watching your first video you did at the time. It all seemed so complex at the time but looking back a few years after tackling my own projects it really is simple stuff once your wrap your head around all these german tools. Funny how that works.

I come from a mechanical background too, mostly motorcycle related, and am having fun with the woodworking journey. I'm just about finished with plantation shutters for the house and every step of the way has been something new and challenging that I haven't attempted before. Lots of head banging on the wall but it has been worth it.

I recall you stating this all was meant to ultimately be for kitchen cabinets for the house. Are you still pursuing that goal?
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Online Gregor

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2019, 04:22 PM »
Nice build. The only real issue I have with 80/20 (or similar compatible aluminium extrusions) is the price.

Should I upgrade my crude hacked together shop drawer thingies in the way the OP did I would use the Item Automatic Fasteners, these are not that much more expensive but don't require drilling the extrusions near the end - just screw it into the channel from the end, add the screw through the installed sleeve into the T-nut, slide that into the destination profile, tighten screw and be done with it. Also removeable/reuseable in case you want to restructure, then not having a hole drilled near the end can be a benefit (in case you need to shorten the piece only a little).
You might know these fasteners from your MFS, should you have one.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2019, 05:27 AM by Gregor »

Offline Richard/RMW

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2019, 05:07 PM »
Gregor - you might be surprised at the cost of the extrusions, I've found that it's the joint hardware that really adds up. Ryan used the same fastener I did on my version, hands down the cheapest option.

My, ahem, mere mortal scale version [big grin] has just over 30' of extrusion in it, buying in 8' sticks the cost for 1515 is around $5/LF. With joining hardware I'm probably in it around $250 + casters/plywood.

Matt - to your point on committing to a design, you cannot imagine how many times I've torn something apart and repurposed the extrusions...  [embarassed]

RMW
As of 10/17 I am out of the Dog business and pursuing other distractions. Thanks for a fun ride!

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #21 on: October 28, 2019, 05:23 PM »
Thanks fellas. I appreciate the feedback.

As for 80/20 and cost, it’s not cheap... but building something like this is far cheaper then buying an MFT table from Festool. In fact, I think I have less in this BF/MFT than I do my MFT and thus far, it’s proven to be far more flexible. It’s just not portable.

I’m really, really enjoying this thing... and one of the biggest assets is the 80/20 and being able to clamp and add fixtures all over the thing. It’s just really modular.

Offline Rob Z

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2019, 09:40 PM »
Hey Ryan

I like that workbench, and also would love to build one like that if only I had the room.  Nice job on your build.

I think I recognize your shop from watching recently your Unisaw video.  I just bought a '68 Unisaw and plan to refurbish it.

Offline 08G8V8

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #23 on: October 29, 2019, 01:55 PM »
Very nice work!  I've been wanting to build a MFT style bench and have been thinking of using 8020 material, but probably start out basic and upgrade features down the line.

I was going to ask how you did the details on the slots to allow for your clamps....then I saw your video describing it.  Lots of good info in your video...thanks!




Online Dusty.Tools

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #24 on: October 29, 2019, 06:05 PM »
This is silly, but... How about a vintage dog hole placed machine lamp? It’s actually pretty handy...
Nice lamp! Did you buy it online?


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It’s a restored 1940s era Craftsman (I think?) machine lamp.
Nice! I wondered why I couldn’t find it on Amazon :)


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Offline Bob D.

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #25 on: October 29, 2019, 08:31 PM »
"Nice! I wondered why I couldn’t find it on Amazon :)"

Yeah, Amazon doesn't have a time machine...that we know of. :-)
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Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #26 on: November 06, 2019, 04:10 PM »
And finally, part 2:



Turns out there's gonna be a part 3... and I think that one will be more interesting than these first two simply because it's about fences, guild rail pivots, met accessories, etc... That's my hope anyhow...

Offline neilc

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #27 on: November 06, 2019, 05:06 PM »
Excellent video, Ryan!

What did you determine was the reason for the CNC variability on the first top?

Glad you were able to resolve it with your supplier.

Thanks for sharing!  Really like the design and the large drawers / double Systainer approach,

neil

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #28 on: November 06, 2019, 05:14 PM »
Excellent video, Ryan!

What did you determine was the reason for the CNC variability on the first top?

Glad you were able to resolve it with your supplier.

Thanks for sharing!  Really like the design and the large drawers / double Systainer approach,

neil

Actually, it was my first TWO tops that were inaccurately cut. Both came off of different CNC machines and both were operated by different guys. It was weird and I still don't know what the issue was. The holes weren't consistent or accurate throughout the table top. Some were round at the top of the hole and got oblong towards the bottom and others were oblong all the way through.

Both of those tops were cut from Plum Creek MDF - a really, really high quality product. I thought maybe this material was the problem, but I did some test cuts using my little toy CNC and had no problems at all machining it.

My third top was cut at a lumber yard north of me called Fine Lumber and Plywood. They don't carry plum creek, but sold me a "double refined" sheet of MDF that seemed almost as nice. Their CNC guy really went the extra mile for me and got this thing nailed. The dog holes are consistent and as accurate as I can measure.

The bummer is, I have about $500 in this top now given the cost of all the scrap I created with the two bad tops and the CNC service fees. Live and learn I guess. But I'm happy now.

Offline neilc

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #29 on: November 06, 2019, 08:53 PM »
Very weird.  Normally MDF should be the easiest wood to cut - dull bit perhaps?  Climb cutting?  Did you use the same g-code file with the two earlier tops or was it starting fresh with a design and g-code file on each?


Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2019, 09:37 PM »
Very weird.  Normally MDF should be the easiest wood to cut - dull bit perhaps?  Climb cutting?  Did you use the same g-code file with the two earlier tops or was it starting fresh with a design and g-code file on each?

Yep. Same code...

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Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #31 on: November 08, 2019, 04:04 PM »
My daughter wanted to make something in the shop... So, we made a sysport charging station. It has systainer feet on it so that it just locks into the shelf like a systainer does.

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #32 on: November 12, 2019, 10:54 AM »
Sacrificial HDPE kerf line came together pretty well.


Offline 08G8V8

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #33 on: November 12, 2019, 11:27 AM »
Excellent idea. 

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #34 on: November 12, 2019, 12:22 PM »
Excellent idea.

This might sound a bit insane, but I'm actually thinking about back lighting it from underneath. The dado that holds the HDPE is centered over a row of dog holes, so i could mount an LED strip that shines through these unused holes. The idea being is that a backlit kerf line might be handy when lining up a cut?

I dunno... maybe.

Offline Svar

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #35 on: November 12, 2019, 01:07 PM »
This might sound a bit insane, ...
Yes, it does.  [big grin]
I have an MDF sacrificial strip like that on may table. I wanted to replace it with something non-slip to help hold small or thin pieces in place. Splinter guard on the rail is slippery and not helpful in this regard.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2019, 01:35 PM by Svar »

Offline Bob D.

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #36 on: November 12, 2019, 01:33 PM »
Ryan, I can't tell from the photo but did you dovetail that strip in the top or are the edges square cut?

The HDPE looks good and I guess some MDF would work too.
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Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #37 on: November 12, 2019, 02:16 PM »
Ryan, I can't tell from the photo but did you dovetail that strip in the top or are the edges square cut?

The HDPE looks good and I guess some MDF would work too.

Nope. My skills aren't to that level. :)

It's a straight dado... Right now, I just have the insert stuck in with a clearance/press-in fit... I think that will work.

Offline RightAngleDesign

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #38 on: November 12, 2019, 09:15 PM »
Backlighting would be FAR OUT!
Kapex, Domino, multiple sanders, 1400, LR32, TS55

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #39 on: November 13, 2019, 03:43 PM »
Got the guide rail by @RightAngleDesign installed and squared... This thing is made really well and handles the long guide rail without issue. I’ll cover it in detail on the next video.

Online Dusty.Tools

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #40 on: November 14, 2019, 12:54 AM »
Got the guide rail by @RightAngleDesign installed and squared... This thing is made really well and handles the long guide rail without issue. I’ll cover it in detail on the next video.

I like that sacrificial strip a lot! My MFT (yet to be finished) top is laminated with Formica Microdot, so I don't want to cut into it. Adding a string like this is a perfect addition!

I tried to look up details about the guide rail, can you share some more info, looks interesting.
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Offline 08G8V8

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #41 on: November 14, 2019, 11:53 AM »
Yes, more info on the guide rail mount. I did a search and didn’t find anything. I am designing my 8020 MFT bench, on a smaller scale, and am curious about this option. Thanks


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Online Gregor

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #42 on: November 14, 2019, 03:15 PM »
Yes, more info on the guide rail mount. I did a search and didn’t find anything.
https://www.etsy.com/shop/rightangledesign/

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #43 on: November 14, 2019, 04:37 PM »
Yes, more info on the guide rail mount. I did a search and didn’t find anything.
https://www.etsy.com/shop/rightangledesign/
Nice! I can see a purchase in my future!


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Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #44 on: November 14, 2019, 05:19 PM »
The guide rail pivot is amazing. I 100% endorse it.

Also... I usually make fun of people that use kaizen foam... Now, I can make fun of myself!


Offline gatescarpentry

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #45 on: November 14, 2019, 10:12 PM »
The guide rail pivot is amazing. I 100% endorse it.

Also... I usually make fun of people that use kaizen foam... Now, I can make fun of myself!
Fantastic!  I’m an early adopter of the Right Angle Design system. I use my tables everyday and have the best of both worlds with easy transport and set up combined with shop accuracy. Thanks for sharing your project


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Offline hdv

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #46 on: November 15, 2019, 05:56 AM »
Anyone know if this system works in combination with 8020 profiles? Or can it only be used with the MFT-rails?

Offline tdwilli1

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #47 on: November 15, 2019, 10:40 AM »
Yes, more info on the guide rail mount. I did a search and didn’t find anything.
https://www.etsy.com/shop/rightangledesign/

I didn't see anything but Ipad or phone stands. Is that what was used?

Offline kmickey

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #48 on: November 15, 2019, 11:21 AM »
Yes, more info on the guide rail mount. I did a search and didn’t find anything.
https://www.etsy.com/shop/rightangledesign/

I believe he’s talking about this. 

https://www.dashboardpws.com/gallery

Online Dusty.Tools

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #49 on: November 15, 2019, 11:27 AM »
Yes, more info on the guide rail mount. I did a search and didn’t find anything.
https://www.etsy.com/shop/rightangledesign/

I didn't see anything but Ipad or phone stands. Is that what was used?

https://etsy.me/2N3J9uJ


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Online Dusty.Tools

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #50 on: November 15, 2019, 11:28 AM »
Anyone know if this system works in combination with 8020 profiles? Or can it only be used with the MFT-rails?
It works with 80/20, I confirmed yesterday before placing an order.


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Offline hdv

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #51 on: November 15, 2019, 12:44 PM »
Sorry. I should have been clearer in my question. Indeed, I meant the jig by RightAngleDesign.

Thanks for confirming the compatibility @Dusty.Tools! I think I've found my Christmas present. [embarassed]

Offline jobsworth

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #52 on: November 16, 2019, 10:52 AM »
@AtomicRyan

Great Idea. I did something similar a while ago except ILO HDPE I used scrap hardwood.

What I didnt do but should of (lets call yer sacrificial strip a vertical Strip). I would of made on horizontal to. Very convienent for cutting length wise.

Offline tdwilli1

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #53 on: November 16, 2019, 10:58 AM »
Yes, more info on the guide rail mount. I did a search and didn’t find anything.
https://www.etsy.com/shop/rightangledesign/

I didn't see anything but Ipad or phone stands. Is that what was used?

https://etsy.me/2N3J9uJ


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Thanks, I was just glancing at that and I took it for a rail connector.

Offline 08G8V8

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #54 on: November 16, 2019, 05:19 PM »
AtomicRyan, in your video where you discuss coating your top with the 50/50 mixture of mineral spirits and wipe on poly, did you apply it to the bore of your holes?  And if so, did it purely soak it in or did it affect the ability to insert dogs?

I got my baby 33”x57” MDF top drilled up the other day using my Parf System, and just purchased the stuff to finish it today. Still need to sand it down before applying.

Thanks

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #55 on: November 16, 2019, 05:49 PM »
AtomicRyan, in your video where you discuss coating your top with the 50/50 mixture of mineral spirits and wipe on poly, did you apply it to the bore of your holes?  And if so, did it purely soak it in or did it affect the ability to insert dogs?

I got my baby 33”x57” MDF top drilled up the other day using my Parf System, and just purchased the stuff to finish it today. Still need to sand it down before applying.

Thanks

It’s so thin that the edge grain of the dog holes just soaks it up. I’ve done tons of coats and it hasn’t messed with dog fit at all.

@jobsworth Great idea.

Online Dusty.Tools

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #56 on: November 17, 2019, 03:19 PM »
As an aside - Does anyone know if the placement of the first row of holes is important?

A Festool MFT has them placed 70mm edge to center for the first row. Then all other rows are 96mm. With the last also being 70mm.

When designing a top, is it important to stick to the 70mm + (96mm x #rows\columns) + 70mm sizing?

The implication is a top needs to be based on the following dimensions:

428.0mm (4 holes)
524.0mm (5 holes)
620.0mm (etc.)
716.0mm
812.0mm
908.0mm
1,004.0mm
1,100.0mm
1,196.0mm
1,292.0mm
1,388.0mm
1,484.0mm
1,580.0mm
1,676.0mm

Cheers

Ben
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Offline 08G8V8

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #57 on: November 17, 2019, 03:27 PM »
I would think their placement is based on linking 2 MFT/3’s together and having the last row of one table and the first row of the second being at the same 96mm spacing.


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Online Gregor

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #58 on: November 17, 2019, 03:59 PM »
I would think their placement is based on linking 2 MFT/3’s together and having the last row of one table and the first row of the second being at the same 96mm spacing.
There'll be one virtual (=not existing) row of holes in the seam between the two tables.

Offline 08G8V8

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #59 on: November 17, 2019, 04:15 PM »
I guess I should have said to maintain the multiple of 96mm spacing, or 32mm.  I’m not positive this is true, but would assume it is.

I am making a MfT table from 8020 material, which I wanted to be 3’ x 5’.  I made my top this past week and went 8 rows wide x 15 rows lengthwise. I also wanted to have offset rows along the perimeter to add a fence and dogs to position the guide rails to allow wider cross cuts. I am thinking of adding a foldable wing on one side and will need to figure out how to maintain pattern spacing if I decide to add holes to the wing. The other end of the table will be a router table. I am running an offset row of holes directly down the center for the Incra LS Positioner which will use for the router table fence, and for use with the tracksaw.

But now I am looking at the RightAngleDesign guide rail attachment instead of the offset dogs for rail position.

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #60 on: November 17, 2019, 04:57 PM »
The logic makes sense, and reassures me that I can be more flexible in the size I go with!
@dusty.tools

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #61 on: November 19, 2019, 02:57 AM »
@AtomicRyan - what’s the clearance between your 1530 extrusion and the shelf? I’m guessing 3” to allow your arm to reach the underside of the top...

Ben


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Offline sandy

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #62 on: November 19, 2019, 11:17 AM »
@Dusty.Tools

Quote
As an aside - Does anyone know if the placement of the first row of holes is important?

A Festool MFT has them placed 70mm edge to center for the first row. Then all other rows are 96mm. With the last also being 70mm.

Your information is (slightly) incorrect, at least with respect to actual MFT/3 replacement tops.  Actually, the overall size of an MFT/3 top is 718mm x 1102mm.  There are 7 rows of holes, with 11 holes in each row.  While you are correct that the holes are each 20mm and that they are 96mm center-to-center, the corner holes are actually centered at 71mm from each edge.  The edges of the corner holes are then 61mm from each edge.  Doing the math you wind up with 122mm + 20mm + 6x96mm = 718mm by 122mm + 20mm + 10x96mm = 1102mm.

As far as whether these dimensions are "important", the question is whether you are building your own table or whether you are replacing the top on an existing MFT/3.  If the latter, then you might as well make the replacement top fit.

Sandy

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #63 on: November 19, 2019, 10:08 PM »
@Dusty.Tools

Quote
As an aside - Does anyone know if the placement of the first row of holes is important?

A Festool MFT has them placed 70mm edge to center for the first row. Then all other rows are 96mm. With the last also being 70mm.

Your information is (slightly) incorrect, at least with respect to actual MFT/3 replacement tops.  Actually, the overall size of an MFT/3 top is 718mm x 1102mm.  There are 7 rows of holes, with 11 holes in each row.  While you are correct that the holes are each 20mm and that they are 96mm center-to-center, the corner holes are actually centered at 71mm from each edge.  The edges of the corner holes are then 61mm from each edge.  Doing the math you wind up with 122mm + 20mm + 6x96mm = 718mm by 122mm + 20mm + 10x96mm = 1102mm.

As far as whether these dimensions are "important", the question is whether you are building your own table or whether you are replacing the top on an existing MFT/3.  If the latter, then you might as well make the replacement top fit.

Sandy

I stand correct :)

But I think I got my answer, I'm not replacing an MFT/3 top, I'm building my own table.
@dusty.tools

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #64 on: November 20, 2019, 09:51 AM »
@AtomicRyan - what’s the clearance between your 1530 extrusion and the shelf? I’m guessing 3” to allow your arm to reach the underside of the top...

Ben


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I struggled with this for a couple of reasons:

1. I needed my table to be a specific height given the leveling casters so it would work as an outfeed table for my table saw.

2. I needed enough room in my sysport columns to hold a sys1, sys2, and sys3. (That's how I like to stack my systainers)

3. Obviously, I needed access to the bottom of the top for fixturing and cleaning.

4. I knew I was going to use a guide rail pivot and needed enough height there so that the guide rail wouldn't interfere with my drawers when the pivot was up.

In the end, I compromised with 2.75" of clearance. It's not enough. I can't really reach the center of the shelf with my hand... But, I think I have enough access for it to be ok.

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #65 on: November 20, 2019, 02:26 PM »
@AtomicRyan - what’s the clearance between your 1530 extrusion and the shelf? I’m guessing 3” to allow your arm to reach the underside of the top...

Ben


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I struggled with this for a couple of reasons:

1. I needed my table to be a specific height given the leveling casters so it would work as an outfeed table for my table saw.

2. I needed enough room in my sysport columns to hold a sys1, sys2, and sys3. (That's how I like to stack my systainers)

3. Obviously, I needed access to the bottom of the top for fixturing and cleaning.

4. I knew I was going to use a guide rail pivot and needed enough height there so that the guide rail wouldn't interfere with my drawers when the pivot was up.

In the end, I compromised with 2.75" of clearance. It's not enough. I can't really reach the center of the shelf with my hand... But, I think I have enough access for it to be ok.
Thank you! I’ve basically got the same thoughts running through my head.

- I want the top to align with all my other benches (32.75”). 4” caster + 28” frame + 3/4” top.
- I want enough room for the track saw Systainer box. Three boxes for Domino. Maybe a column for router box.
- I brought the same guide rail, thanks for the recommendation!

I think anymore than 3” is a challenge to the storage capacity. I will adjust once I start assembling.

Thanks for the info.



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Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #66 on: November 20, 2019, 05:40 PM »
Fence is done... went pretty smoothly and the 90 is good.


Offline RightAngleDesign

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #67 on: November 20, 2019, 07:54 PM »
That's about as slick as it gets! Happy to play a small role in this project.
Kapex, Domino, multiple sanders, 1400, LR32, TS55

Offline 08G8V8

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #68 on: November 22, 2019, 02:25 PM »
Ryan, how easy are those casters to spin the height adjuster to lift the table to engage the caster?  I see they make a version with a pop-out ratcheting handle to adjust height, but of course are quite a bit more expensive. 

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #69 on: November 24, 2019, 09:56 AM »
Ryan, how easy are those casters to spin the height adjuster to lift the table to engage the caster?  I see they make a version with a pop-out ratcheting handle to adjust height, but of course are quite a bit more expensive.

By hand, not easy once they are weight loaded... But there's a 1/4" nut you can use a wrench on - that's what I do.

Offline Michael Kellough

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #70 on: November 24, 2019, 12:10 PM »
Naturally, when weighted the height adjustment screw becomes more difficult to turn.

Just use a lever and fulcrum to take a little weight off while you turn. I use a set under a 700# etching press. Using the lever it was a piece of cake to level.

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #71 on: December 06, 2019, 05:29 PM »
Ugh... Part 3 is finally done:



I think Part 4 (and last, promise!) will be more exciting... I'm integrating a bunch of stuff from TSO, some stuff I made, etc... As well as going over the pros and cons of a 4x8 MFT table.

Offline Peter Durand

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #72 on: December 07, 2019, 09:36 AM »
Oh man, that is well done. Thanks for posting..it gave me a few ideas to try.
Cheers,
Peter

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #73 on: December 07, 2019, 12:32 PM »
Very inspiring, thank you!


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Online Gregor

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #74 on: December 08, 2019, 12:38 PM »
@AtomicRyan very nice, please keep the videos coming.

Offline kpeluso

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #75 on: December 25, 2019, 06:00 PM »
This is great. Thanks for documenting this and sharing. Any plans of putting together rough plans/parts list? I’d be happy to pay for something like that.

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #76 on: December 27, 2019, 09:47 PM »
I will for sure... I've got one more video to finish after the holidays and then I'll clean up the plans, etc...

Thanks!

Offline nicholam77

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #77 on: January 09, 2020, 12:50 PM »
Hey AtomicRyan,

Your bench is turning out fantastic! Fellow Garage Journal-er here. Question for you on the RightAngleDesign guide rail pivot if you don't mind... how much of the tracksaw rail does the mount on the pivot side use up?  Or maybe a better way to ask, what's this dimension?


Offline RightAngleDesign

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #78 on: January 09, 2020, 10:09 PM »
Hey AtomicRyan,

Your bench is turning out fantastic! Fellow Garage Journal-er here. Question for you on the RightAngleDesign guide rail pivot if you don't mind... how much of the tracksaw rail does the mount on the pivot side use up?  Or maybe a better way to ask, what's this dimension?



Hello! Those are ~8 3/8" long (~213mm)

Cheers,
Rob
Right Angle Design
Kapex, Domino, multiple sanders, 1400, LR32, TS55

Offline nicholam77

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #79 on: January 13, 2020, 07:28 PM »

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #80 on: January 16, 2020, 05:24 PM »
Hey guys... Sorry I fell off the face of the planet. I had a computer crash over the holidays and I'm just not recovering from that.

BUT, I was able to edit part 4 of the video this week and it's now live. You can check it out here:



I am really happy with the bench. I've actually been using it for a month or so now and it just really suits my needs.


Offline nfk

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #81 on: January 16, 2020, 10:27 PM »
Bench and videos are both great.   Is the mdf staying flat?  No problem with sagging between the framework?

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Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #82 on: January 16, 2020, 10:46 PM »
It’s sealed pretty well... and with the bracing, there’s really no place for it to go. It’s as flat as I can measure anyway...

Offline punkmft

  • Posts: 6
Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #83 on: January 16, 2020, 11:39 PM »
I cannot wait to move into a house with a space large enough to hold something inspired by this build (a proper shop rather than space 'shared' with a car in the garage). Thanks for the amazing amount of detail across the 4 videos!

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Offline DynaGlide

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #84 on: January 17, 2020, 09:23 AM »
@AtomicRyan Great video series Ryan. You use a lot of the same tools and gadgets as me to get the most out of your MFT top. Especially liked the @TSO_Products plug since their products don't get enough accolades outside of this forum. I admit I haven't had a real need for the angle functionality of the MTR-18, but it's there if I do some day. As it is, it's my most expensive really nice square.

As a fellow mechanic first, woodworker second it's refreshing to see that you are headed down a similar thought process as it applies to the craft.
Instagram @matts.garage

Offline Shawnrader

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #85 on: January 17, 2020, 11:10 AM »
Awesome build, I've followed it all the way through.  Plan to copy it one day when I have a large enough space.

Offline Mike Goetzke

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #86 on: January 18, 2020, 01:09 PM »
@AtomicRyan

Enjoyed watching your progress. Very impressive to say the least. I'm in a garage/shop and it would be nice to have everything so close and handy as you have on this bench build.

In your last video you made some comments that echo some of my thoughts. When showing your stash of TSO tools you stated that if you knew how versatile/functional the square etc. were you wouldn't need the MFT fence, perfectly milled dog holes etc.

I have been a serious hobbyist and used Eurekazone track saw system for probably 20 years. Just about a year or so ago I decided to buy Makita cordless and a TS75. I had three slabs milled to my design that make a 4' x 8' sawing/clamping/assembly table that I can assemble and break down in less than 5 minutes.

I bought several dogs to try to work using the MFT dog holes as many do. Around the same time I also made my first TSO purchase a GRS 16 PE square. I tried working with the dogs but keep going back to TSO square and have added the TSO parallel guide system. Maybe because this is similar style working I did with the Eurekazone.

I don't think one way is better than the other (just the toys are a little different.) - just wondering have others had hard time transitioning to MFT-hole and bench dog process of woodworking?

Thanks
Mike


Offline Cut Once

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #87 on: February 08, 2020, 11:17 AM »
What brand drawer slides did you use for your build?

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #88 on: March 12, 2020, 12:09 PM »
What brand drawer slides did you use for your build?

Accuride soft close. I always take the mechanism out of one side to make the drawer easier to open.

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #89 on: March 12, 2020, 12:11 PM »
I recently got a chance to really use this bench in production. To put it shortly, it's amazing. I thought the overall size would have some real drawbacks, but to be honest - I didn't experience any. This thing makes cabinet building a real efficient process... This video only covers part 1, but I was able to build the whole thing in less than five days of part time work and that's crazy fast for me.


Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #90 on: March 18, 2020, 02:49 PM »
Part 2:



Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Mario Turcot

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #91 on: March 19, 2020, 06:31 AM »
You end up with a really nice studio, I like it  [thumbs up]

By the way is that a HermanMiller Aeron chair? I have the same  [big grin]
Mario

Offline neilc

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #92 on: March 19, 2020, 09:48 AM »
Nice work, Ryan! 

I guess your walls were parallel as you didn't show any scribing for the top installation!


Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #93 on: March 23, 2020, 04:52 PM »
You end up with a really nice studio, I like it  [thumbs up]

By the way is that a HermanMiller Aeron chair? I have the same  [big grin]

It is... Have had it for 15 years?

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #94 on: March 23, 2020, 04:53 PM »
Nice work, Ryan! 

I guess your walls were parallel as you didn't show any scribing for the top installation!

I had to redo much of that drywall... I made sure it was pretty damned straight as I sanded... :)

The largest gap I had after installing the top was maybe an 1/8th inch. I just used caulk.

Offline nicholam77

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #95 on: March 31, 2020, 03:46 PM »
Hey Ryan, I have really enjoyed following along with this build, but especially the YouTube videos on the BF/MFT and the desk. I'm a professional commercial editor (advertising) so I know how time consuming it is to create content. Just wanted to let you know I like your style and found them entertaining and informative. Cheers!


Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #96 on: April 10, 2020, 09:26 AM »
Hey Ryan, I have really enjoyed following along with this build, but especially the YouTube videos on the BF/MFT and the desk. I'm a professional commercial editor (advertising) so I know how time consuming it is to create content. Just wanted to let you know I like your style and found them entertaining and informative. Cheers!

Thanks man. I really appreciate that.

Offline sbiswas

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #97 on: April 20, 2020, 12:13 PM »
Hey Ryan,

I think I said this before to you on YouTube but I just wanted to say again how awesome your build is! I also love porsche's and woodworking so the channel is perfect for me.

I was wondering if you could help me out with 2 dimensions of your table.

Could you give me the height of the "pillar" extrusions on the outside of your table. Ascetically the height of your table looks great so I wanted to recreate the same thing.

And if you could, the height of the casters without the "plate" that you used?

Thank you SO much!

313294-0

Offline supimeister

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #98 on: April 30, 2020, 09:50 PM »
@AtomicRyan - any updates on offering plans?  Would love to support your efforts.

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #99 on: May 04, 2020, 04:39 PM »
Hey Ryan,

I think I said this before to you on YouTube but I just wanted to say again how awesome your build is! I also love porsche's and woodworking so the channel is perfect for me.

I was wondering if you could help me out with 2 dimensions of your table.

Could you give me the height of the "pillar" extrusions on the outside of your table. Ascetically the height of your table looks great so I wanted to recreate the same thing.

And if you could, the height of the casters without the "plate" that you used?

Thank you SO much!

(Attachment Link)

Those casters are 3 1/8" tall without the plate... The pillars, if I understand you right, are 25 3/4" tall...

As for plans, I've tried working with 80/20 to get some done with part numbers, etc... but they have ignored me. I'm going to approach a competitor and see if they would be interested in getting involved.

Offline skivan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #100 on: May 04, 2020, 05:30 PM »
As for plans, I've tried working with 80/20 to get some done with part numbers, etc... but they have ignored me. I'm going to approach a competitor and see if they would be interested in getting involved.

very much appreciated.

Offline sbiswas

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #101 on: May 07, 2020, 02:49 PM »
@AtomicRyan Thanks so much for the reply. I think I have this pretty much locked down on how to build it now.

If i'm correct, the total height would be 33.5" on yours then?

3/4" MDF - 3/4"
80mm Top Support - 3 1/8"
"Outside Pillars" - 25 3/4"
Plate - 3/4"
Castors - 3 1/8"

If anyone was interested I could write down the cuts needed for this build once Ryan replies with the height total. If in Canada (Toronto Area) I have also sourced a supplier for 80/20 new. The total for my 80/20 new is $939.26 CAD plus tax. This doesn't include any fasteners or the drill jig.

- Shomik

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #102 on: May 07, 2020, 02:54 PM »
@AtomicRyan Thanks so much for the reply. I think I have this pretty much locked down on how to build it now.

If i'm correct, the total height would be 33.5" on yours then?

3/4" MDF - 3/4"
80mm Top Support - 3 1/8"
"Outside Pillars" - 25 3/4"
Plate - 3/4"
Castors - 3 1/8"

If anyone was interested I could write down the cuts needed for this build once Ryan replies with the height total. If in Canada (Toronto Area) I have also sourced a supplier for 80/20 new. The total for my 80/20 new is $939.26 CAD plus tax. This doesn't include any fasteners or the drill jig.

- Shomik

I just measured mine... and it's up on the feet at 35 9/16" - same height as a stock MFT... There's some adjustability there obviously.

Offline sbiswas

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #103 on: May 07, 2020, 03:16 PM »
@AtomicRyan

Hmm. I wonder if the "outside pillar" dimension was actually the inside pillar (between the systainers which is 40mm less). The outside pillars aren't 27.25" high are they? I am not sure how I am almost 2" off.  [eek]

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #104 on: May 07, 2020, 03:25 PM »
@AtomicRyan

Hmm. I wonder if the "outside pillar" dimension was actually the inside pillar (between the systainers which is 40mm less). The outside pillars aren't 27.25" high are they? I am not sure how I am almost 2" off.  [eek]

I'll be out there tomorrow... I'll send pics.

Offline sbiswas

  • Posts: 4
Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #105 on: May 07, 2020, 03:28 PM »
Awesome thanks! I'll definitely be keeping this build for life. I'm sure we all appreciate the hard work that you did putting this together originally.  [big grin]

Offline AtomicRyan

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Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #106 on: May 08, 2020, 09:48 AM »
Awesome thanks! I'll definitely be keeping this build for life. I'm sure we all appreciate the hard work that you did putting this together originally.  [big grin]

I made a few changes to this before I built, but the basics are there and the measurements are right.


Offline odessaboots

  • Posts: 4
Re: BF/MFT Build
« Reply #107 on: Yesterday at 02:16 AM »
@AtomicRyan Amazing videos and editing, truly entertaining and your narrating voice is a weird kind of soothing.

I am working on a folding MFT build using similar extrusions to your BF/MFT, so your posts have been super helpful.

I just watched your video about the cabinet/desk build too, really fun to watch. I wanted to mention a couple of things that might be too late but might be helpful for a future build:

Baltic Birch can be ordered by your local plywood shop in sheets up to 10x5. It might be a special order, but my local shop stocks it. Worth checking out. But...

For something as large as your desk top that wants to be strong and flat forever, you might have looked into honeycomb aluminum, no? I'm an architect by trade, and for most of my projects, if anything is over 9' or so, it gets a honeycomb core. This especially applies to doors, but I have used it on desks as well. Your build is different because you wanted the ply edges exposed (a look I really like, because its honest to the plywood), but normally you use the honeycomb with solid wood rails, so it works out well. Its like a torsion box on steroids.

Lastly, check out Docking Drawers (www.dockingdrawer.com). They make some sweet power strips integrated into your drawers, with usb-a or usb-c charging. Its a cool setup for offices and shops.

Keep up the amazing work!


For power management,