Author Topic: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?  (Read 2273 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255


Any suggested sources/links for the right trunking or U-channel?

I don't like the other methods found on YouTube such as stapling or vacuuming the content out. (I've used duct tape before, but want a tidier approach.)
« Last Edit: January 24, 2023, 11:54 AM by ChuckS »

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 1733
  • formerly @the_black_tie_diyer
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2023, 12:10 PM »
That looks like +- 15mm trunking, a very common and readily available size in my part of the world.

I've seen similar products at Lowe's, however if they have such a fairly small size, you would have to check.

Sadly I can't check HomeDepot from here, they block European traffic to their site since Europe went ahead with GDPR.

Kind regards,
Oliver

Kind regards,
Oliver

"... . Say yes to stuff, and it will take you interesting places." - Anne Richards, CEO Fidelity International

Online rvieceli

  • Posts: 1855
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2023, 12:29 PM »
@ChuckS Over here it seems to be called raceway Lowes carries a few choices.

https://www.lowes.com/search?searchTerm=raceway

If you can't find it at a big box store up there YOu might check at electrical suppliers or security system supply houses.

Ron

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2023, 01:06 PM »
Thanks both for the suggestions. Lowe's doesn't have the 15mm size (they sell something like that, but in a whole box only, not individually).

I found this at the HD site, and will go in to have a look:


« Last Edit: January 24, 2023, 01:09 PM by ChuckS »

Offline guybo

  • Posts: 486
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2023, 01:41 PM »
If all else fails one can make these work maybe?

Offline Alex

  • Posts: 7801
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2023, 02:46 PM »
I can't believe who much dirt people are willing to expose themselves too just to save a few bucks.

Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 1733
  • formerly @the_black_tie_diyer
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2023, 02:57 PM »
Especially since you buy the Festool stuff to minimize exposure to dust, and the bags are designed to minimize/prevent dust even when disposing off them.

The pores clog also, every time you re-use you loose a little more suction capabilities.

And speaking of the re-usable bags, originally they were meant for shavings/chippings and not so much for dust.

Personally I never re-use the regular filter bags. Not worth it.

Kind regards,
Oliver
Kind regards,
Oliver

"... . Say yes to stuff, and it will take you interesting places." - Anne Richards, CEO Fidelity International

Offline Chainring

  • Posts: 224
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2023, 03:04 PM »
Performance and price aside, how is this different from the long life bags? I'd still be wearing a dust mask and some goggles for either.

Offline luvmytoolz

  • Posts: 385
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2023, 03:14 PM »
I don't do this with my later CT's as I have a long life bag in my 36 and the smaller units the bags so small it's not worth it, but I've been doing it with my 38L SR5E for 40 years. Just two bits of wood clamped on the end, dump it every so often into a large bag, no dust mess. I'm only just on my 4th bag for it in 40 years now.

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2023, 03:17 PM »
The answer to the two gentlemen's question is simple:

1) I like to try things out, and finding out if the bag can be easily reused like those zipper bags sold on eBay satisfies my curiosity. Money is actually not an issue here as I just opened a new box of bags, and replaced the filled one. A box of bags (5) can last 7 to 10 years because the CT15 is mostly for the DF500 & Pro 5. Even though I've been doing tons of projects, it took me almost two years to fill up the first bag that came with the CT15.
2) Clearing the CT bag of dust won't be as yucky as it seems because I can do that just like how I clean out my d.c. canvas bag all the time -- I simply put the CT bag (cut out in the bottom) in a yard waste bag, roll and fold the top/bottom edges of both bags, and shake. Viola! No dust escapes into the atmosphere.

   
« Last Edit: January 24, 2023, 04:06 PM by ChuckS »

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2023, 03:20 PM »
Performance and price aside, how is this different from the long life bags? I'd still be wearing a dust mask and some goggles for either.

I could be wrong, but I don't think there's a long life bag for the CT15.

Offline jeffinsgf

  • Retailer
  • *
  • Posts: 546
  • Woodpeckers Marketing Department
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2023, 03:23 PM »
Think I'd go for a cyclone before I would bother with this...well...in fact, I did. Put a small Dust Deputy on the Altos vac that's shared between my miter saw and the guard of my SawStop. I bought a reusable bag for my CT-22 years ago. It's never been used. The thought of emptying it always leads me to ordering another batch of expensive disposables. As long as I use the CT-22 for track saw, Domino and sanding, I don't think I'll bother with a cyclone for it. I go through 1 or 2 bags a year.

Offline Chainring

  • Posts: 224
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2023, 03:27 PM »
I could be wrong, but I don't think there's a long life bag for the CT15.

There is one.

https://www.festoolusa.com/accessory/204309---ll-fis-ct-minimidi-2

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2023, 03:29 PM »
Think I'd go for a cyclone before I would bother with this...well...in fact, I did. Put a small Dust Deputy on the Altos vac that's shared between my miter saw and the guard of my SawStop. I bought a reusable bag for my CT-22 years ago. It's never been used. The thought of emptying it always leads me to ordering another batch of expensive disposables. As long as I use the CT-22 for track saw, Domino and sanding, I don't think I'll bother with a cyclone for it. I go through 1 or 2 bags a year.

I'm a big fan of the DDs and do have two Dust Deputy set-ups in use (the new DD 2.5 has just arrived, too), but the CT15 is placed next to the workbench with no clearance for a dust separator.

Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 1733
  • formerly @the_black_tie_diyer
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2023, 03:29 PM »
Performance and price aside, how is this different from the long life bags? I'd still be wearing a dust mask and some goggles for either.

For me, pretty simple:

Long life bag = wood shavings/chippings and a little wood dust. Dumping that is very different from actually dumping concrete/plaster/(...) dust.

Regular filter bag = (shavings/chippings and) dust from basically everything. I use my Festool extractors on all projects, not just wood working. When it's full, the lid gets closed and the bag tossed.

Kind regards,
Oliver
Kind regards,
Oliver

"... . Say yes to stuff, and it will take you interesting places." - Anne Richards, CEO Fidelity International


Offline jeffinsgf

  • Retailer
  • *
  • Posts: 546
  • Woodpeckers Marketing Department
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2023, 03:37 PM »

I'm a big fan of the DDs and do have two Dust Deputy set-ups in use (the new DD 2.5 has just arrived, too), but the CT15 is placed next to the workbench with no clearance for a dust separator.

That's my problem with my CT-22. I've got a cubby for it built into my main workbench with no room for a cyclone and I'm not willing to give up the convenience of it being up off the ground and tucked under the bench right where it's convenient for Domino and sanding work.

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2023, 03:41 PM »
Why is emptying a CT bag more difficult or nastier than emptying a bucket of dust from the DD or the D.C. canvas bag? It seems to be me they're the same.

Since I have a bag of dust from the CT15, a bucket (half full?) from the DD and a d.c. bag (half full?), I'll go ahead -- after next week -- and dump them into a yard waste bag, and share how it goes.

Online Packard

  • Posts: 1899
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2023, 03:44 PM »
I don’t have that vacuum system, but my approach would be different.

Slice off the seam.  Empty the bag.

Run a quick seam with two rows of stitches on your wife’s sewing machine. 

You should get 3 or more uses as the bag gets slightly smaller with each use.  You will lose about 1/2” each time. 

Sewing takes just seconds once the machine is out.  Of course you will have to clean your wife’s sewing machine afterwards…

I’ve done some light upholstery work, so I have an older machine that I could use. 

You can get a heavy duty Singer from Amazon.com for around $200.00.  No more difficult to use than a band saw (pretty much the same skill set).  The hardest part is learning how to load a bobbin with thread and thread the needle. 

A useful piece of equipment for furniture making.

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2023, 03:46 PM »

I'm a big fan of the DDs and do have two Dust Deputy set-ups in use (the new DD 2.5 has just arrived, too), but the CT15 is placed next to the workbench with no clearance for a dust separator.

That's my problem with my CT-22. I've got a cubby for it built into my main workbench with no room for a cyclone and I'm not willing to give up the convenience of it being up off the ground and tucked under the bench right where it's convenient for Domino and sanding work.
Hear you.

 

Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 1733
  • formerly @the_black_tie_diyer
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2023, 03:47 PM »
If it works for you Chuck, it works. That's why I helped to find the right part with my first post.

For me it doesn't. I can't dump the content of my filter bags with yard waste because it's not just wood dust/ shavings/chippings.


Kind regards,
Oliver
Kind regards,
Oliver

"... . Say yes to stuff, and it will take you interesting places." - Anne Richards, CEO Fidelity International

Offline jeffinsgf

  • Retailer
  • *
  • Posts: 546
  • Woodpeckers Marketing Department
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #21 on: January 24, 2023, 03:50 PM »
Why is emptying a CT bag more difficult or nastier than emptying a bucket of dust from the DD or the D.C. canvas bag? It seems to be me they're the same.

Since I have a bag of dust from the CT15, a bucket (half full?) from the DD and a d.c. bag (half full?), I'll go ahead -- after next week -- and dump them into a yard waste bag, and share how it goes.

I think it is the "baginess" that puts me off. I have a big cyclone that dumps into a 28 gallon trash can, two old Delta barrel type 2-stage collectors and the little Dust Deputy on a 5 gallon bucket. For rigid containers I drop a trash can liner over them, slowly tip them over, pull the bag all the way up, then slowly extract the can upside down. Usually get away with little to no dust cloud. I don't see any sort of bag to bag transfer going that smoothly.

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2023, 03:54 PM »
Snip. Just two bits of wood clamped on the end, dump it every so often into a large bag, no dust mess. I'm only just on my 4th bag for it in 40 years now.

 [thanks]]
Now, that's something I should try first instead of making a trip to the HD because I have binder clips and lots of scraps! I will report accordingly.

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #23 on: January 24, 2023, 04:03 PM »
Snip.
I think it is the "baginess" that puts me off. I have a big cyclone that dumps into a 28 gallon trash can, two old Delta barrel type 2-stage collectors and the little Dust Deputy on a 5 gallon bucket. For rigid containers I drop a trash can liner over them, slowly tip them over, pull the bag all the way up, then slowly extract the can upside down. Usually get away with little to no dust cloud. I don't see any sort of bag to bag transfer going that smoothly.

For the d.c. bag, I put the yard waste bag on its side on the ground, and then slide the canvas bag all the way in, before holding the top of the paper bag and bottom of the canvas bag together. I stand both up and shake.


Offline jeffinsgf

  • Retailer
  • *
  • Posts: 546
  • Woodpeckers Marketing Department
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #24 on: January 24, 2023, 04:06 PM »
I don’t have that vacuum system, but my approach would be different.

Slice off the seam.  Empty the bag.

Run a quick seam with two rows of stitches on your wife’s sewing machine. 

You should get 3 or more uses as the bag gets slightly smaller with each use.  You will lose about 1/2” each time. 

Sewing takes just seconds once the machine is out.  Of course you will have to clean your wife’s sewing machine afterwards…

I’ve done some light upholstery work, so I have an older machine that I could use. 

You can get a heavy duty Singer from Amazon.com for around $200.00.  No more difficult to use than a band saw (pretty much the same skill set).  The hardest part is learning how to load a bobbin with thread and thread the needle. 

A useful piece of equipment for furniture making.

Your wife is apparently much more forgiving than mine. If I even thought of running a dirty, dusty bag through my wife's machine I would get a look that would turn normal human beings to stone.

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #25 on: January 24, 2023, 04:10 PM »
Snip.
Your wife is apparently much more forgiving than mine. If I even thought of running a dirty, dusty bag through my wife's machine I would get a look that would turn normal human beings to stone.
My wife designates a wash cycle for all my shop-related clothes!

Happy wife, happy....

Offline squall_line

  • Posts: 1717
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #26 on: January 24, 2023, 04:12 PM »
I could be wrong, but I don't think there's a long life bag for the CT15.

There is one.

https://www.festoolusa.com/accessory/204309---ll-fis-ct-minimidi-2

I stand corrected.

I have a box of this: https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/workshop/dust-collection/parts-and-accessories/110576-selfclean-filter-bags-for-mini-midi-and-ct-15-dust-extractors?item=ZA204308

But the lifelong bag I looked at doesn't include CT15 in its description:

https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/workshop/dust-collection/parts-and-accessories/110577-long-life-filter-bag-for-festool-ct-mini-and-midi-dust-extractors?item=ZA204309

The CT15 is just the MINI-I / MIDI-I without the fancy electronics, so the MIDI-I/MINI-I bags should work just fine.

FUSA says so right on their website. 

https://www.festoolusa.com/accessory/204309---ll-fis-ct-minimidi-2

Not sure why Lee Valley doesn't acknowledge this.  Maybe they think CT-15 owners are only price shopping and wouldn't spring for the long life bag?  Around here, we know that's not actually the case.

Offline Chainring

  • Posts: 224
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #27 on: January 24, 2023, 04:24 PM »
Unavailable right now, but here's one I bought for my girlfriend's MIDI I. I got it on a lightning deal or some other sale for $35.50.

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B098RBRRPH/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?psc=1

Offline NiteWalkerGR

  • Posts: 150
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #28 on: January 24, 2023, 04:27 PM »
I can't believe who much dirt people are willing to expose themselves too just to save a few bucks.
Yeah pretty much where I'm at. My ct midi is my mobile vac, so it's got sawdust from cutting, sanding, routing, spackle dust, cobwebs, unidentifiable dirt and grim, mouse poop, dead insects, etc.  I want none of that back in the air.
If I was using up bags fast enough to the point of thinking about reusing them, I'd invest in a separator, as I did with my workshop vac.

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #29 on: January 24, 2023, 04:31 PM »
I can't believe who much dirt people are willing to expose themselves too just to save a few bucks.
Yeah pretty much where I'm at. My ct midi is my mobile vac, so it's got sawdust from cutting, sanding, routing, spackle dust, cobwebs, unidentifiable dirt and grim, mouse poop, dead insects, etc.  I want none of that back in the air.
If I was using up bags fast enough to the point of thinking about reusing them, I'd invest in a separator, as I did with my workshop vac.
Mouse poop! [scared]

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #30 on: January 24, 2023, 04:34 PM »
Snip.
FUSA says so right on their website. 

https://www.festoolusa.com/accessory/204309---ll-fis-ct-minimidi-2

Not sure why Lee Valley doesn't acknowledge this.  Maybe they think CT-15 owners are only price shopping and wouldn't spring for the long life bag?  Around here, we know that's not actually the case.

Just noted this from the product description on the LVT site: "Not recommended for fine dust"

I use the CT15 only for wood dust including sanding dust.

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline squall_line

  • Posts: 1717
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #31 on: January 24, 2023, 04:39 PM »
I'm not sure what the threshold for "fine" dust is, but I know that drywall dust is definitely right out.

The theory is that the finer sanding dust may eventually clog the pores and render the bag much less useful.

Are the long life bags machine washable?

Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 1733
  • formerly @the_black_tie_diyer
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #32 on: January 24, 2023, 05:07 PM »
The long life bags were originally meant for use with tools that create more shavings/chippings than actual dust.

Kind regards,
Oliver
Kind regards,
Oliver

"... . Say yes to stuff, and it will take you interesting places." - Anne Richards, CEO Fidelity International

Offline rst

  • Posts: 2883
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #33 on: January 24, 2023, 05:18 PM »
I haven't done this with a Festool bag, but years ago the guys lost the bag clip for our Makita 9924 belt sander.  I solve that by buying a small length of polyethylene tube, tapering the ends and slitting it so that it would slide on just like the original.  I use the same thing to cover my hacksaw in my toolboxes to keep the blade from contacting other tools.

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #34 on: January 24, 2023, 05:26 PM »
The long life bags were originally meant for use with tools that create more shavings/chippings than actual dust.

Kind regards,
Oliver

I gave the product description another look: "Used only for extraction of dust types that are not hazardous to health."

Sanding dust definitely falls under the hazardous category or else N95 masks aren't sold to woodworkers. I suppose that rules out long-life bags for some woodworkers. But does it really matter since the CT already has the HEPA filter. Perhaps, the very fine dust will clog the filter?
« Last Edit: January 24, 2023, 05:57 PM by ChuckS »

Offline squall_line

  • Posts: 1717
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #35 on: January 24, 2023, 06:16 PM »
The long life bags were originally meant for use with tools that create more shavings/chippings than actual dust.

Kind regards,
Oliver

I gave the product description another look: "Used only for extraction of dust types that are not hazardous to health."

Sanding dust definitely falls under the hazardous category or else N95 masks aren't sold to woodworkers. I suppose that rules out long-life bags for some woodworkers. But does it really matter since the CT already has the HEPA filter. Perhaps, the very fine dust will clog the filter?

It's two things:

The finer the dust, the more likely to clog and create longevity issues for the bag.

The more hazardous the dust, the more likely it is to create longevity issues for the user if they open the bag to the air and release the hazardous dust back out into the environment and the user's face.

To wit, using this bag for lead remediation would be antithetical to most things related to the confinement and encapsulation rules usually required by remediation practices.

Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 1733
  • formerly @the_black_tie_diyer
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #36 on: January 24, 2023, 06:57 PM »
@ChuckS

Please remember that these extractors and accessories/consumables are designed/engineered and made in Germany, to be used by tradesman in a commercial setting under "jurisdiction" of the state owned accident prevention and insurance association.

For certain tradesman, especially but not limited to those employed, there are certain rules set out by the state owned insurer, they and the employer need to abide by. My command of the english language is not nearly sufficient to go into all these details.

But in this context dust classifications exist:

L = light hazard
M = medium hazard
H = high hazard

Longlife filter bags are only to be used for L classification. Basically that rules out any wood dust.

For wood dust M classification is needed. That means not only better filters but for example also an alarm if flow is obstructed among other things and that the filter bag can be disposed off (close to) dust free. Hence the instructions to close the lid before taking out the filter bag.

With H classification dust free disposal is a must.

Festool's (other's as well) extractors are special in that regard, that even the L classification extractors come with M classification filters installed.

So what you do when you dispose the contents of the long life bag, you expose yourself to the dust again. Of course you can avoid some, you can wear PPE - but basically all measures you took beforehand are now nil and void.

Festool has no choice but to say L classification only for the long life bags. And that deems them pretty much unusable in a German commercial setting when employees and employer are insured by/ fall under the "jurisdiction" of the state owned accident prevention and insurance association.

The broad consensus I have heard & read over the years is that with tools like planers and the like you can use the long life bag because there is much less dust/fine dust compared to sanding. It's still not permitted by the insurer, but everyone who does not fall under their "jurisdiction" is obviously free to do it. And the long life bags work very, very well for that - many, many people tradesman and hobbyists alike do it.

With a lot of fine dust, and plaster ist by far worst, the long life bags will clog. You will not notice immediately but over time. You can try to wash them, some use pressured air, you can use the manual filter cleaning on the extractor to really hit that bag hard - but at some point they are just done - because they are not meant to work with fine dust. And again, with most methods of trying to clean them, you expose yourself to the dust again that it was supposed to keep in first place.

I take this very, very seriously because I have seen, through my own bodily functions, what happens when you have been exposed to this dust. (I snotted violet for days after sanding Dalbergia cearensis without any pre cautions, and another time black because I went through multiple cutting discs on an angle grinder, both times without any precautions/PPE because I simply didn't know better back then.)

This is really not about having a certain type filter in your extractor, that is not the problem. The filter inside your extractor will hold the dust inside. It's solely about the exposure when emptying and trying to clean either of the bags. From a health and safety perspective it makes no sense to first collect and contain everything, but then expose yourself to it while disposing or cleaning.

For the same reason Festool offers bags for the separator. Disposal is "regulated" on M classification as I said before, without them the separator is not rated M anymore. And again, use the separator only with a planer (or other more shaving/chipping creating tools) and go without that bag, just like so many do with the DD, no problem. Fine dust in either without a bag to dispose it? No, thanks.

Kind regards,
Oliver
« Last Edit: January 24, 2023, 07:00 PM by six-point socket II »
Kind regards,
Oliver

"... . Say yes to stuff, and it will take you interesting places." - Anne Richards, CEO Fidelity International

Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 1733
  • formerly @the_black_tie_diyer
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #37 on: January 24, 2023, 07:02 PM »
The long life bags were originally meant for use with tools that create more shavings/chippings than actual dust.

Kind regards,
Oliver

I gave the product description another look: "Used only for extraction of dust types that are not hazardous to health."

Sanding dust definitely falls under the hazardous category or else N95 masks aren't sold to woodworkers. I suppose that rules out long-life bags for some woodworkers. But does it really matter since the CT already has the HEPA filter. Perhaps, the very fine dust will clog the filter?

It's two things:

The finer the dust, the more likely to clog and create longevity issues for the bag.

The more hazardous the dust, the more likely it is to create longevity issues for the user if they open the bag to the air and release the hazardous dust back out into the environment and the user's face.

To wit, using this bag for lead remediation would be antithetical to most things related to the confinement and encapsulation rules usually required by remediation practices.

Way better & straight to the point, than my post. Thank you!

Kind regards,
Oliver
Kind regards,
Oliver

"... . Say yes to stuff, and it will take you interesting places." - Anne Richards, CEO Fidelity International

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #38 on: January 28, 2023, 04:43 PM »
Emptying a CT bag is absolutely no different from emptying a dust collector canvas bag, which I do several times a year. Here is how I did the CT15 bag "dust airborne-free" -- no I didn't wear a mask when doing it, nor do I when dealing with the d.c. canvas bag.

   

[ Specified attachment is not available ]

Roll and hold the top of the bag and yard waste bag together, and dump the dust to the bottom of the bag. Give it a light shake -- you don't want to disturb the fine dust in the bottom to rise up. I'll do the same for the dc bag later using the same yard waste bag.

Since I've just put in a new bag, it'll be a couple of years before I will reuse this modified bag, and then another couple years later to find out how good the concept of reusing is. I think my plan is to reuse each bag once or twice before ditching it. (Will those binder clips be good enough (an idea borrowed from luvmytoolz)? Little clue. I'll use it when the time comes, and evaluate it after the first couple of uses.)

Anyone who is creating a cloud of dust when changing their 1 or 2 HP dust collector bag is...not doing it right.


« Last Edit: January 28, 2023, 06:03 PM by ChuckS »

Offline luvmytoolz

  • Posts: 385
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #39 on: January 28, 2023, 07:13 PM »
Roll and hold the top of the bag and yard waste bag together, and dump the dust to the bottom of the bag. Give it a light shake -- you don't want to disturb the fine dust in the bottom to rise up. I'll do the same for the dc bag later using the same yard waste bag.

Since I've just put in a new bag, it'll be a couple of years before I will reuse this modified bag, and then another couple years later to find out how good the concept of reusing is. I think my plan is to reuse each bag once or twice before ditching it. (Will those binder clips be good enough (an idea borrowed from luvmytoolz)? Little clue. I'll use it when the time comes, and evaluate it after the first couple of uses.)

Anyone who is creating a cloud of dust when changing their 1 or 2 HP dust collector bag is...not doing it right.

I don't know if bulldog clips will be strong enough, I just used two offcut strips of wood with 3 screws and wingnuts for my 38L bag for the SR5E. From memory I did try clips first but when the bag got pretty full it blew them off. Maybe with a Midi/15 it might be okay, but I suspect not. Clamping this way does work a treat though, very simple.

I see comments about "so cheap why bother re-using", maybe in the US, but in OZ they certainly aren't cheap. Some of them go around $25-$30 for each bag. Yeah we get ripped off here!

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #40 on: January 28, 2023, 07:21 PM »
If the binder clips failed, I'd seal it with duct tape, then strips and clips.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 06:48 AM by ChuckS »

Offline NiteWalkerGR

  • Posts: 150
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #41 on: January 28, 2023, 09:35 PM »
I see comments about "so cheap why bother re-using", maybe in the US, but in OZ they certainly aren't cheap. Some of them go around $25-$30 for each bag. Yeah we get ripped off here!
Yikes. In that case I'd add a separator for sure.

Offline luvmytoolz

  • Posts: 385
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #42 on: January 28, 2023, 09:57 PM »
I see comments about "so cheap why bother re-using", maybe in the US, but in OZ they certainly aren't cheap. Some of them go around $25-$30 for each bag. Yeah we get ripped off here!
Yikes. In that case I'd add a separator for sure.

I've got 3 DD's and they are worth their weight in gold so far as I'm concerned, but one is permanently hooked up to my CNC, the others are in the sheds, but there's lots of times I need to move my old SR5E around and lugging the DD with it is a bit cumbersome and not real practical, so clamping the end of the bag is a great money saver. At @$20 per bag minimum, I reckon I've saved countless thousands over the last 40 or so years of use.

Offline Crazyraceguy

  • Posts: 2348
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #43 on: January 29, 2023, 10:24 AM »

I see comments about "so cheap why bother re-using", maybe in the US, but in OZ they certainly aren't cheap. Some of them go around $25-$30 for each bag. Yeah we get ripped off here!

Ouch, yeah I see your point. Here in the US, you can get 5 pack of Power-tech (off-brand but they work fine) for less than you are paying for 1. It's about $4 each and that delivered.
The genuine Festool ones are a little over twice that, about $9 each, still delivered.
It's gotta be the shipping that's costing you guys. Take an already expensive thing, then make it worse  [unsure]
CSX
DF500 + assortment set
PS420 + Base kit
OF1010
OF1010F
OF1400
MFK700 (2)
TS55, FS1080, FS1400/ LR32, FS1900, FS 2424/ LR32, FS3000
CT26E + Workshop cleaning set, Bluetooth remote
CT15
RO90
RO125
ETS EC 125
RAS115
ETS 125 (2)
RTS 400
TS75
Shaper Origin/Workstation/Plate
MFT clamps set
Installers set
Centrotech organizer set
Socket/Ratchet set
Pliers set

Online Packard

  • Posts: 1899
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #44 on: January 29, 2023, 12:23 PM »
For many years, I sold hardware to bag house filter manufacturers that existed because the replacement filters were so expensive from the original manufacturer.

Baghouse filters, are huge versions of shop based dust collection filter.  They use they use highly specific non-woven fabric for this.  The shops that I sold to, were basically “cut and sew” operations.  That is, the startup cost to start one of those businesses is a sewing machine and a commercial fabric cutter.

Some of the baghouse filters cost upwards of $1,500.00 and cannot be cleaned and re-used. Most can be cleaned, but they eventually wear out.

There are major industries that would have to cease production if they could not get the required baghouse filter. 

For example, drug companies grind up components and mix them together.  If the airborne medications were not captured, the employees would get sick or die.

Concrete manufacturers cannot produce the lime mix without filtration for the same reasons.

You would probably have to order 50 bags at a time to approach one of these aftermarket vendors.  If you could get together a bunch of users, you could share the expense.

That would beg two questions:

1.  Is the design patent protected and is it legal to replicate it?
2.  Would soliciting other FOG members to join you get you kicked off this site?

In any event, sewing is the single best way to seal these seams.  Having access to a sewing machine can elevate your wood work, especially if you make padded benches or chairs.  The machines are not very expensive, and are no more difficult to use than a band saw (with similar skills required).

I could probably get the name of a aftermarket baghouse filter manufacturer if anyone is interested in that approach.

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 2085
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #45 on: January 29, 2023, 04:49 PM »
Performance and price aside, how is this different from the long life bags? I'd still be wearing a dust mask and some goggles for either.

Well, because, regular CT bags aren't made to be reused, I think. If they were, they'd be sold as reusable bags.
Randy

Offline ChuckS

  • Posts: 4255
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #46 on: January 29, 2023, 05:26 PM »
Anyone interested in buying reusable CT bags (CT15, CT26, etc.) may check out the eBay, such as this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/174575086052

Offline JINRO

  • Posts: 166
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #47 on: January 29, 2023, 06:07 PM »
I hust got this few weeks ago and seems to work great. Much easier to empty the bag compared to Festool one.
(Reusable dust Bag for Festool Mini and Midi dust extractors (MIDI-2) https://a.co/d/atXrCwP)

Offline luvmytoolz

  • Posts: 385
Re: Reusing CT bags -- Anyone try this or have a better method?
« Reply #48 on: January 29, 2023, 06:41 PM »

I see comments about "so cheap why bother re-using", maybe in the US, but in OZ they certainly aren't cheap. Some of them go around $25-$30 for each bag. Yeah we get ripped off here!

Ouch, yeah I see your point. Here in the US, you can get 5 pack of Power-tech (off-brand but they work fine) for less than you are paying for 1. It's about $4 each and that delivered.
The genuine Festool ones are a little over twice that, about $9 each, still delivered.
It's gotta be the shipping that's costing you guys. Take an already expensive thing, then make it worse  [unsure]

Believe it or not, because the bag costs are so high, they usually qualify for free shipping with some vendors!

I bought a L/L bag for my CT36 which was around $300 on special, and one for my wifes midi which was around $275 from memory. This pic is the current price for the CT36 bags, which aren't much more expensive than the midi's.

Bearing in mind the cost for my 40+ year old SR5E for bags is so eye watering I'd need to sell a kidney to fund a pack!
« Last Edit: January 29, 2023, 06:46 PM by luvmytoolz »