Author Topic: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions  (Read 5397 times)

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Offline Doubled33

  • Posts: 7
Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« on: May 24, 2016, 09:14 PM »
I am getting ready to buy a Kapex and am having trouble on weather to buy the MFT Mini or the UG cart.  It will be used at my house 95% of the time. Perhaps it will be in my garage or on some days I may want to set it up outside the garage. Most of my cuts are 4/4 hardwoods around 8' and widths up to 10".  I currently have a CT 36 and a full size MFT table that will complement this purchase. Does one have more use with what I already have than the other?

I also plan on purchasing the wings unless something better is around these days. In a search I found mention of Best Fence but those post were a few years old. My main use for the wings that would be a selling point is somewhat easy setup and a good useful stop for repetitive cuts.

Lastly do the extension wings have any other integration or uses in the festool system? In other words the tracks can be used with the routers, TS, jig saws etc...do the extension wings have the same functionality?

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Offline neilc

  • Posts: 2764
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2016, 09:53 PM »
Welcome to the FOG -

The Kapex extensions will work with an MFT table or a Festool CMS router  table.  Great for working with  longer pieces or handling off-cuts.

I have the smaller MFT table for my Kapex and made extensions out of plywood attached to the Kapex crown extensions.  I purchased before the UG cart and extensions were available.

The smaller MFT is lower to the ground than an MFT such that the top of the Kapex table is the same height as the MFT/3 top. 

I have on occasion taken the MFT/Kapex table out of my shop for projects around the house, or outside.  It's really study and useful in those occasions.  I also made a lower shelf under the table for holding other items off the floor.  So there is a bit more utility with the table over the UG Cart.

If you want to transport your saw, the UG cart and extensions are probably the better alternative.  Lighter weight and they fold up to be pretty compact.




Offline richk

  • Posts: 52
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2016, 10:10 PM »
Just got a Kapex and outfitted it with the Best Fence system with the Kapex adapters from Fastcap.com

I liked the precision saw stop for quick and repetitive cuts and it was actually less expensive than the UG. I've used the UG in Festool classes and it is a bit rickety--ok if you're careful. The Best Fence is much more solid and easier to collapse to move around. The extensions store more securely and are a snap to set up because the height is dialed in at setup.

On the Fastcap site there are a bunch of videos showing the system.

I didn't order it until I had received my Kapex and was satisfied with the cutting accuracy, which is spectacular. The Best Fence comes on a pallet, so return would be a challenge unless you lived in WA.

RichK

Offline sofa_king_rad

  • Posts: 100
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2016, 12:07 AM »
I have very little experienxe to offer but I did by both. First I got the Kapex. I do plan to use it mobilely (word?) but very rare, however I have a small work space and Need to be able easily put things away.

After getting the Kapex I realized I'd definitely need the cart to take this to job sites, however with been great using it at home and being able to easily take outside or wherever I have space do some work then quickly out it away. the cart is extremely easy and light weight.
TS55, MFT3, OF1010, RO 150, KAPEX, CT Mini

Online Gerald_D

  • Posts: 329
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2016, 09:16 AM »
My setup is in the shop about 95% of the time as well- I have the MFT mini with the extension wings.  The big advantage for me using the table vs. the UG cart is that I have a place to set my tape measure, cutoffs, etc while working, instead of setting them on the wings or somewhere else where they are in the way.  I bought the Kapex with the table before the UG cart was available here, but if it were, I probably still would have purchased the table.  However, if my situation was different to where I was transporting the saw more than 25-30% of the time, I would opt for the cart instead. 

One accessory for the extensions I have been looking at is the bracket from Multiblades.com that allows for attaching a crown stop.  It is on my wish list but haven't purchased as yet.

Regards,
Gerald
Gerald
I have Festools- Big and Small and a few other tools

Offline SRSemenza

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  • Finger Lakes Region, NY State , USA
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2016, 09:26 AM »
I am getting ready to buy a Kapex and am having trouble on weather to buy the MFT Mini or the UG cart.  It will be used at my house 95% of the time. Perhaps it will be in my garage or on some days I may want to set it up outside the garage. Most of my cuts are 4/4 hardwoods around 8' and widths up to 10".  I currently have a CT 36 and a full size MFT table that will complement this purchase. Does one have more use with what I already have than the other?

I also plan on purchasing the wings unless something better is around these days. In a search I found mention of Best Fence but those post were a few years old. My main use for the wings that would be a selling point is somewhat easy setup and a good useful stop for repetitive cuts.

Lastly do the extension wings have any other integration or uses in the festool system? In other words the tracks can be used with the routers, TS, jig saws etc...do the extension wings have the same functionality?


Hi,

   Welcome to the forum!  [smile]

      Will you be leaving it set up while it is in the garage, or will you take it down between uses most of the time? If you are planning to take it down most of the time the UG cart will be handier to set up and take down move in / out.

       I have the table and prefer it for the way I work and the sites I work at. But I only set it up and take it down once for most sites. I would still prefer the table for shop use (or a home built or other stand) over the cart unless I had to set it up and take it down on a regular basis.

Seth

Offline ear3

  • Posts: 3886
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2016, 09:47 AM »
I would only recommend the UG stand to someone who is going to be doing a lot of site work.  The cart makes setup and transportation easy and quick, but you sacrifice stability and capacity in the process.  Now, theoretically the wobbliness of the cart should not affect cuts, since the motion of the cart is transferred to the saw, and I have never experienced a cut being compromised by this wobble.  Where the extensions come up short though is when you are cutting wide boards (8"+).  Boards this wide will sometimes rock on the table because so much of the material is unsupported by the narrow extensions -- you can control this to a certain degree with the Kapex clamps, but I would personally be wary of attempting a precision cut on a wide board using just the extensions (especially one that incorporates mitres or bevels).

Besides the Kapex MFT, another option you might consider if you want mobility around the shop is to make your own mobile station along the lines of what @Peter Parfitt did:   There's another set of videos showing how he incorporated the Incra flip fence allowing precision stopped cuts.  The only downside to the mobile cart is that there are limits to the length at which you can do stopped cuts.

 I built one of my own for shop use of my Kapex based on his designs: http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/kapex-cart

« Last Edit: May 25, 2016, 09:50 AM by Edward A Reno III »
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS-EC 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • RS 2 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/BT module • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Offline Doubled33

  • Posts: 7
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2016, 11:35 PM »
A lot of helpful insight. Thanks. I don't really have a 100% dedicated work space so a built in is not in the cards. I really like the mobile cart but do not really want to build one but it is darn nice so with that said it looks like I have some more suggestions to digest.

I do think the UG cart is out and a wider wing seems to fit the bill for me.

Offline travisbrown

  • Posts: 6
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2019, 01:46 PM »
$748 CAD cheaper than the UG stand.

Knocks down to a four piece flat pack about 30 lbs. 788mm to meet the 112mm Kapex height to get to the target 900mm table height.

Can be used as stand for other tools or as small workbench too I guess. Just made it yesterday after picking up the wings on Craigslist.


Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 1315
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2019, 02:54 PM »
Bolted down to the top?

Do you have a shorter hose?...it would greatly improve dust collection if used indoors.

Offline threesixright

  • Posts: 400
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2019, 03:04 PM »
Not sure if you can get your hands on, what about BOSCH GTA 2600 ?

Retails in EU for ~ 100 USD.

Offline travisbrown

  • Posts: 6
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2019, 03:09 PM »
Not bolted down in the picture because it was just a quick setup for a couple cuts, but the top has M6 threaded inserts to lug down the Kapex should I need.

Yes, have some 6' and 10' hoses too. This long hose is because I was swapping it between a TS55 and sander for this job too and means I didn't have to swap hoses or kick the shopvac around. Dust collection is fine enough for outside. And usually I'd have the shopvac as far away from me as possible because it's an annoying pitch. Just put it there to show it fit under.

This is just meant as a mobile setup. I have a permanent crosscut bench in my shop for the Kapex that hooks up to dust extraction.

Bolted down to the top?

Do you have a shorter hose?...it would greatly improve dust collection if used indoors.

Offline yetihunter

  • Posts: 593
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #12 on: August 27, 2019, 01:24 AM »
The ug stand is a major back injury waiting to happen and the extension wings are wobbly, move about and are a relative pain to setup.   Look at Fastcap or newer options from other mfrs for extensions and something like the Bosch Rise Stand for
rolling about.  The MFT for the Kapex is fine, however.  The Kapex, itself, is awesome and still ahead of the pack as far as I’m concerned.   

Offline travisbrown

  • Posts: 6
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #13 on: August 27, 2019, 02:01 AM »
The ug stand is a major back injury waiting to happen and the extension wings are wobbly, move about and are a relative pain to setup.   Look at Fastcap or newer options from other mfrs for extensions and something like the Bosch Rise Stand for
rolling about.  The MFT for the Kapex is fine, however.  The Kapex, itself, is awesome and still ahead of the pack as far as I’m concerned.

Huh, I don't find the wings wobbly at all if they are attached to the Kapex properly. I was surprised how stable they are. I was cutting 8' 4x6 timbers on them  today without concern.

The first time I tried to attach them I didn't slide the clamping flange forward enough  to grab the underside of the Kapex and didn't make sense. Then once I clamped them on properly, it was all good.

I actually like the single leg support for the wings rather than a spread setup. I don't have to worry about levelling or shimming multiple points or torquing the beds. Single knob adjusts the plane of each side. Smart.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 817
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #14 on: August 27, 2019, 06:53 AM »
When I bought my Kapex, I knew it would spend more time stationary in the workshop, than on site. So I was thinking of modifying my saw station for the Kapex.
That wouldn’t help for the times I would be mobile with it though.
So I opted for the UG base and extension wings.

For me, this proved a great decision. My old saw station has now been converted into bench space, and the Kapex is used on the UG base, with either one or two extension wings. This is to my surprise very sturdy, and quick to set up and put away.
Calibration is easy too.
I have used the extensions on jobs with very limited space, often knocking into the extensions, no problem at all. If you just take a minute or so to set up everything properly, it’s a great system that I’d recommend.


Offline Roachmill

  • Posts: 164
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #15 on: August 27, 2019, 07:20 AM »
I am space challenged to the point where even the UG stand takes up too much room. But I did like the wings as they pack away and offer great precision, so there was a bit of a quandary there. I have both the normal and the longer Dewalt stands which get used for various bits of kit so I worked with it thanks to someone on here posting pics of them having used the same as a stand for the Kapex + wings. Only took removing a small section from each leg and you're left with something very portable that packs down and can be used for many other tasks and tools.

Can't say I've ever noticed them being wobbly, they're quick and easy to set up and you can leave sliding stops on them as well as the new crown stops which work to support wider stock into the... "bargain". Another thing I like about the wings is that you can put the Kapex onto a bench and fix one or both wings onto it which is great when space is tight.

Offline ear3

  • Posts: 3886
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #16 on: August 27, 2019, 08:18 AM »
The occasional wobbliness of the stand has never been a problem for me, as the motion is consistent for both cart and saw, meaning there is no change in the cut quality.

Where the UG stand does come up short in my opinion is on wider boards, since the relatively narrow extension wings don't provide much depth of support.  If the boards are perfectly straight and jointed, it's not as much of an issue on the wider timber.  But working on site -- which is the only place I use the UG stand setup, as I built a more robust cart/cabinet for shop use of my Kapex -- you don't always have that luxury.  In the end, however, the mobile functionality of the UG cart, with its easy transport and consistent setup, still makes it worth it for me.
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS-EC 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • RS 2 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/BT module • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Offline JLMS2010

  • Posts: 32
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #17 on: August 27, 2019, 08:42 AM »
The ug stand is a major back injury waiting to happen and the extension wings are wobbly, move about and are a relative pain to setup.   Look at Fastcap or newer options from other mfrs for extensions and something like the Bosch Rise Stand for
rolling about.  The MFT for the Kapex is fine, however.  The Kapex, itself, is awesome and still ahead of the pack as far as I’m concerned.

I just bought the UG Cart & wings and mine aren't wobbly at all.  It actually works very well and is very simple to setup and take down quickly.

I agree with @travisbrown
« Last Edit: August 27, 2019, 08:44 AM by JLMS2010 »

Offline kevinculle

  • Posts: 301
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #18 on: August 27, 2019, 08:57 AM »
The UG stand is the easiest way to move a Kapex up and down steps or over long distances and the comment about back injury can only have come from someone who has never used it.  In my experience the UG stand and wings is one of three or four features that set the Kapex apart and unless your work is exclusively limited to your workshop I consider them integral to the value of a Kapex.

Offline tjbnwi

  • Posts: 6130
  • Cedar Tucky Indiana
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #19 on: August 27, 2019, 08:59 AM »
The wing to Kapex connection is very solid.

I do leave the "fence" of the wing back from the Kapex fence abput 1/4", always done this no matter what stand I was using.

I shot a video a few years ago showing how solid the connection is.

Width is simple to solve. I believe Festool now has supports if you don't want to fabricate your own.



Tom

Offline JimH2

  • Posts: 866
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #20 on: August 27, 2019, 11:16 AM »
The ug stand is a major back injury waiting to happen and the extension wings are wobbly, move about and are a relative pain to setup.   Look at Fastcap or newer options from other mfrs for extensions and something like the Bosch Rise Stand for
rolling about.  The MFT for the Kapex is fine, however.  The Kapex, itself, is awesome and still ahead of the pack as far as I’m concerned.

I am with you on this. The stand leaves a lot to be desired in terms of stability. The only thing it has going for it is the small footprint.

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1471
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2019, 02:12 PM »
The ug stand is a major back injury waiting to happen
How do you reach that conclusion?

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 817
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #22 on: August 30, 2019, 03:20 PM »
I’ve had mine set up on floors as flat as a billiard table, and also on grass, and very uneven over sites, with broken up hardcore on building sites. All good.

The only time I can think of any problems was, on a refurb job, all the floor boards had been taken up to replace rotten joist. There were sheets of overlapping ply put down for temporary access etc. We had to set up on the ply, and because the ply was very springy, it not doubt would have effected precision. We were building stud walls though, so not a big deal.

Because the extension are clamped to the base, there was probably movement, which wouldn’t have been effected, or at least not as much, had I been using an all in one saw stand with built in extensions. As then the stock would have stayed flat, and not effected by movement of the ply.

This is the only example of anything close to an issue, that I can think of.

I love the UG base/cart and the flexibility the extensions provide, especially cutting long lengths.

Each to their own I guess.  [wink]

Offline yetihunter

  • Posts: 593
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #23 on: September 05, 2019, 02:08 PM »
The ug stand is a major back injury waiting to happen
How do you reach that conclusion?

From using it.  It carts around good.  I like that it takes up such a small footprint vs anything else available.  It's when setting it up and breaking it down that one must follow procedure or find themselves twisting about while trying to catch a saw.  If anyone that owns the stand wants to say that it's not cumbersome (in the least), you must have three hands and 400 lb sneakers. I know that people love the extensions and have had a great experience with them.  I presume that they work great with with baseboard/toe molding and crown.  I was putting much wider and heavier wood on there, and that is why my experience differs.   I'm not afaid of weeble wobble.   I hand planed a monster roubo on top of the mft.   It was fine.  The Kapex stand/extensions I was experiencing twisting all the way through, it almost fell over a few times when I'd put lumber on it, it just wasn't stable enough once you get to a certain width or weight.     
« Last Edit: September 05, 2019, 02:20 PM by yetihunter »

Offline kevinculle

  • Posts: 301
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #24 on: September 05, 2019, 05:14 PM »

It's when setting it up and breaking it down that one must follow procedure or find themselves twisting about while trying to catch a saw.  If anyone that owns the stand wants to say that it's not cumbersome (in the least), you must have three hands and 400 lb sneakers.   

The point to consider here is that the SCMS is by its nature an awkward and difficult to move piece of equipment not really designed for easy portability.  In my experience once you get the hang of it the Kapex on UG stand can be lowered into travel position and raised into use position solo without strain or risk of injury.  I'm a big guy (6' 5" and 205#) but I'm also in my late 60's and I don't find it particularly challenging.

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 1315
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #25 on: September 05, 2019, 06:00 PM »
snip.

 The Kapex stand/extensions I was experiencing twisting all the way through, it almost fell over a few times when I'd put lumber on it, it just wasn't stable enough once you get to a certain width or weight.   

I could envision the instability given the single point contact on the ground.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 817
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #26 on: September 05, 2019, 06:20 PM »
Any mitre saw stand will only take timber up to a certain width, before it can get unstable.
I have a few mitre saws and stands, including the Kapex and UG base etc, and they have all been fine cutting long lengths of skirting, trims, mouldings, right up to floor joists and trusses, that are thick and wide, and because of pressure treatment, heavy.

No problems with any of the saws, or bases/stands. Any of these set ups can have extra support applied if needed.
Setting up, get the folding base for a 10” or 12” Makita mitre saw off the van. Set the base up, go get that big saw off the van and carry it to the base. Lift the saw onto the base and lock it up.

Kapex and UG base: get it off the van, wheel it to the work area, unlock the tab, put one foot on the base, lift the saw just below the cable tidy, guide the support leg into the slots, lock the the tab. Fit the extensions if required.

Which set up, do you think will will cause, or aggravate any back issues?  [scratch chin]

I willingly fetch the Kapex off the van, the other saws, I let somebody else have the privilege  [wink]

Offline aben

  • Posts: 2
Re: Choosing a Kapex Stand and Extensions
« Reply #27 on: September 11, 2019, 03:37 PM »
I'm new to the Kapex game (better late than never) and fingers crossed i'll avoid the pre-REB issues for being a late comer.

I'm sure the OP has moved on since, but as it's being discussed i'll offer my early impressions as I bought the bundle with the UG cart/stand and extensions.

The UG stand is a means to an end. I can't think of a better way to transport and protect the Kapex with such minimal impact on the saws footprint and overall weight. It serves it's purpose well for me having to load/unload/set-up/repeat the majority of the time.

The extension wings are excellent, light enough, robust enough, quick to set up and handles the majority of tasks and material with no issues (none that i wouldn't come to expect from a saw and stand combo)
Optional single-side use is handy if space is tight.
The extension err...extensions, are great, very useful feature when dealing with longer lengths.
The measurements are bang on and have saved me huge amounts of time with the adjustable stop guides for multiple, same-length cuts. In fact, with a cutting list any cut over the saw table length is quicker (than measuring and marking) with the extension wings, stops and saw correctly set up.

The carry strap plastic end caps clipping into the UG stand for transportation is a definite bonus of the combination.

It has obvious limitations like anything "mobile" would but, is a great set up for predominantly mobile/site use and actually pretty bloody great for home/workshop use. So, no complaints or regrets from my side and no wobble-worries nor back pains because of it.

The saw is obviously excellent, as I'm sure we all agree.

I mutter price under my breath, but sing its praises in every other area. The last saw/stand combo was almost a 2 person job and still not easy to handle, plus having to constantly re-tighten and be adjusting the movable parts...jeeze, i don't miss it one bit.