Quote from: Gregor on December 23, 2020, 08:57 AM

Or they make this a 110-240V, 50-60Hz input device and afterwards drop any and all other 110V stuff, since you now can obtain a working converter (with benefits) for your obsolete kind of mains power (which is, when seen from the perspective of worldwide prevalence these days, irrelevant).

I still think this SYS-PowerStation may be an easy way to integrate some of the 230 volt Festool & Mafell tools into the work shop without rewiring the shop or running 75 foot extension cords through the house. I'm thinking BS 75 or BS 105.

Yeah, I think they could sell these in the US as is.   The input looks to be standard computer stuff, so that is almost certainly 100-250VAC 50/60Hz input like computer supplies, so that is good to go.  On the output, it comes down to how the designed it and did they plan ahead.  A smart engineer would have spec a transformer with a center tap.  So in EU they connect it as 230V only.  And then for North America, Japan, UK job site, they use the center tap and bring out 220 and 110V power.  Or they just design both transformers from the start and have it easy to swap out at the factory. 

But yeah, bring it as is, not a big deal.  Folks will be ready with the Schuko to NEMA 6-15/6-20 adapters and be able to plug in their 230-240V tools.   I still maintain that Festool should be bringing over 230V stuff anyways.  They could sell a bunch of CTs to folks who want them for their 240V tools as there is very little options for such vacs in the US.   

The price is a hard thing to swallow.  But if you are in cases like Alex mentioned, or building a cabin in the woods, etc.  This makes a lot of sense.

If they made it a 240/110 device, it would be great for bringing power to a cabin on the weekend. 

This stuff will get cheaper, and more companies will jump in.   The systainer aspect of it is a big plus for sure.  Maybe the can make a much smaller one to strap to sys-vac.

Quote from: Spandex on December 23, 2020, 05:59 AM

The main issue for the US will be how long it takes them to make a 110v version

Or they make this a 110-240V, 50-60Hz input device and afterwards drop any and all other 110V stuff, since you now can obtain a working converter (with benefits) for your obsolete kind of mains power (which is, when seen from the perspective of worldwide prevalence these days, irrelevant).

I meant to type ‘120v’. 110v would be used here in the UK for certain building sites, although I’m not sure if that requirement would apply to tools plugged into a generator/power bank, so there may be no demand for a 110v version in the UK.

For those that dont know, in the US there is also the well known Jackery brand that makes a 1002Wh capacity, 1000W rated power (2000W surge power) unit: LINK

Quote from: DeformedTree on December 23, 2020, 01:01 PM

They could just solve all and make them all with a NEMA 14-20 receptacle.  Make it a global choose your own adventure as it does both 110 and 220 (up to 250VAC really).  Folks just use the right adapter for their part of the world. Sell nice green adapters for what ever country/need people want.

Add: Before anyone ask, 50/60Hz is basically a non issue to devices, but if it was, they could just have a 50/60Hz switch on it as that is just part of the controller switching built into it as is.   Similar for the voltage, they all handle ranges,  100-120VAC,  200-250VAC.

The main issue I have with that is that it’s a solution that can only benefit the manufacturer, at the inconvenience of the customers.

I can’t see many people wanting to use an (easily lost) adaptor, just so that Festool can have the convenience of only having one global SKU.

Not gonna happen anyway, Festool's not going to inconvenience themselves and 95% of the world just to please the 5%.

So it's not 5% of the world, as has been brought up in other threads, 110V power is in a lot more places than just the US.  It is a substantial part of the industrialized (power hungry users) world. It is not going away anytime soon/ever.

Even without the 110V power situation, they still have to make different plugs for around the world which is added cost/effort.

A global plug to rule them all isn't going to happen, even if it did you would have decades of adapters.   My comment on the NEMA plug was it could be a solution, as it is the closest thing there is to an answer (some other parts of the world may have similar dual voltage plugs too).  No one likes adapters. But no one likes not being able to buy something either.  I have adapters for my tools from Europe, some of them I could cut the cords and replace the ends, but I don't want to do that, I'll take the adapter instead. But also I can't easily swap the receptacle on the CT, so there is little point.

Further people move, folks don't want to have to re-buy tools if they move, and scrap stuff.  So having something locked into one country isn't exactly desirable.  This is where computers are nice, move anyplace in the world, you just have to find the right cord as the Power Supplies are 100-250VAC 50/60Hz with a common plug on that end.

Not gonna happen anyway, Festool's not going to inconvenience themselves and 95% of the world just to please the 5%.

Not quite. 110/120v countries account for 40% of global GDP  (N. America + Most of S. Am. + Japan + Taiwan + ...). If you look at potential market share for upscale power tools, probably more than 40%.

Quote from: Alex on December 24, 2020, 05:09 AM

Not gonna happen anyway, Festool's not going to inconvenience themselves and 95% of the world just to please the 5%.

Not quite. 110/120v countries account for 40% of global GDP  (N. America + Most of S. Am. + Japan + Taiwan + ...). If you look at potential market share for upscale power tools, probably more than 40%.

And if Festool wants you to get the Powerstation, you're gonna get it in 110v, not some 220/110v hybrid as was suggested in the post I reacted to

It’s not about how many people use that voltage, it’s about how many people use that voltage AND want a high power battery bank to power tools.

I think generator use in America is pretty big considering all their rural areas, so the Powerstation might be of some use to them.

rural US is a big market, that is why looking up "powerstation" you see a lot of such products out there. Many offer the 220/110 Voltage setup exactly so they can power buildings with them, some I saw even use standard generator plugs (nice).

Lot of folks here have cabins, or just weekend getaways and will want to use such things.  Being limited to 1 voltage would be very frustrating as it really cuts down on how someone could use it.

This is where if it comes to N.America, having it be a dual voltage plug like I mentioned would be very useful, if it is just 110V, it would probably be D.O.A. in the market.  But of course dual would also work for places like the UK.   3 Grand is a lot of money, it's much easier to justify if you can expand it's use.

Quality, quiet, portable generators are not cheap. If someone is looking at a generator, but then has this as an option, it would be something many folks would consider instead. Without dual voltage, that option is basically dead.  It takes nothing to have the all ready designed into it, even if the plugs being used don't have a center tap.

   I don't think the rural America theory holds much water either way. We do have electricity even here in the sticks.  Yes, maybe the whole cabin in the woods thing but that really has nothing to do with people living rural areas and is unlikely to be a big market. Plenty of city residents have cabins in the woods too.

   It will have a lot more to do with CONVENIENCE. Even if there is electricity on site. If I did a lot of site work where running cords was a nuisance or there were other workers on the same site. It would be great to just bring along my own portable power source and put it right where I want it.  No gas, no noise, no one else using it or messing with it.

Seth

For UK site usage its worth pointing out that most large commercial sites are usually pretty good (with big transformers and 110 volt sockets at regular intervals) but housing and holiday lodge sites are generally very poorly done and we need to get a generator to them.
Having ond of those darn things clattering away gets old fast especially when most of our tools are cordless anyway.
About the only ones that aren't are the extractors and sometimes chopsaws, maybe lights.

Thing is those gennys are clattering away all day, just to provide power for short periods of burst power.

Personally I was wanting to get one of the De-Walt powerstations but they're not for sale over here in 110 volts and even if they were the sockets are the dodgy US things and I can't see many safety bods liking it.

It being in a Systainer makes sense to me but at the moment the cost is a bit salty.

Tbh, no one on here will buy one anyway, because it’s in the new Systainer3 design...

The basic design of em is pretty good, only problem being they lost the good idea about the heights playing well together down the back of the sofa.
Its easy enough to sort, just make the heights slightly different.

The basic design of em is pretty good, only problem being they lost the good idea about the heights playing well together down the back of the sofa.
Its easy enough to sort, just make the heights slightly different.

They didn’t accidentally drop the height system. They did it on purpose. They’re not going to ‘sort’ it out because there’s nothing to sort out. They’ve made a decision.

They didn’t accidentally drop the height system. They did it on purpose. They’re not going to ‘sort’ it out because there’s nothing to sort out. They’ve made a decision.

Aye, just like the decision about not making an 18 volt impact screwdriver.
Oh, hang on a bit...

 

I’m all for people expressing their opinions on here, and I’m all for people agreeing or disagreeing with those opinions.

What I'm starting to wonder now is, since it is a 230 volt power source, does it come with the usual protections a standard electrical installation comes? I already read on that site linked above that it has no grounding. I wonder how this thing is going to comply with all the legal obligations for 230 volt power sources.

No grounding means antistatic hose... is no longer antistatic.

Quote from: Gregor on December 23, 2020, 08:57 AM

Quote from: Spandex on December 23, 2020, 05:59 AM

The main issue for the US will be how long it takes them to make a 110v version

Or they make this a 110-240V, 50-60Hz input device and afterwards drop any and all other 110V stuff, since you now can obtain a working converter (with benefits) for your obsolete kind of mains power (which is, when seen from the perspective of worldwide prevalence these days, irrelevant).

They could just solve all and make them all with a NEMA 14-20 receptacle.  Make it a global choose your own adventure as it does both 110 and 220 (up to 250VAC really).  Folks just use the right adapter for their part of the world. Sell nice green adapters for what ever country/need people want.

Add: Before anyone ask, 50/60Hz is basically a non issue to devices, but if it was, they could just have a 50/60Hz switch on it as that is just part of the controller switching built into it as is.   Similar for the voltage, they all handle ranges,  100-120VAC,  200-250VAC.

Hahahaha, so you want the whole world to adapt a dumbass plug so you can keep your 110V nonsense? Yeah, that definitely is not gonna happen.